Metal Halide Par question

[X-37B]

OMG what a blast from the past reading through this thread, I just stumbled across it this morning. Thank you to all who have contributed to this awesome read.

I'm planning some tank builds and changes when we get our new home built (don't get me started on that lol). I use Reefis currently but I still dream of the days from the 90s when I used MH. First it was the 6500k Hamiltons with actinic supplements that used a ballast box that weighed about 40 lbs, then came the 250w 10k lamps with PFO ballasts, then the 400w 10k lamps. Sold all of that, regrouped and started using hanging fixtures over my open topped tanks with an Icecap EB, started with several lamp selections including a 250w mogul base Phoenix 14k and then a 250w mogul base Hamilton 15k. The Hamilton 15k never had the punch the Phoenix did and I never liked it. I ended up with 250w double ended Phoenix 14k on the Icecap ballast, that was the best of everything at the time. I wish I still had some of that gear, it was sold for literally pennies on the dollar decades ago. The Reefis are nice but are not even in the same game as MHs are.

After reading through this thread I think I'm going to start putting together a MH setup for my 100g which will be my new SPS/clam habitat, and leave the 325 for the big tangs and angels that I am longing for.

Anyways I'm subscribed now, I look forward to more MH discussions.

Old fixtures are out there. I got this one from an lfs who had it in storage.
I ran the LB's with 250 de on my 120.
The LB fixture distributes the light well with much higer par vs the RB.
I won't be running the RB.

 

[StealthLabs]

Are Hamiltons still available? Last I heard they wasnt making them anymore.

Hamilton no longer makes halide bulbs. Dave, with Aqua Bright Solutions (former Hamilton employee), creates their own bulbs. Including 10k / 14k / 20k. They still offer Radiums as of today.

AQUA BRIGHT SOLUTIONS

Supplier of high quality aquarium products

aquabrightsolutions.com

 

[StealthLabs]

IMO, I feel the 14k is best. 20k is a deep blue and if you are not supplementing with a white light via LEDs or T5, it's just too blue. To each their own. Dave sent me all three kelvins and I haven't tested the PAR of each quite yet. But I can say the 10k is a true white, not a yellow like typical "10k bulbs." I use the 10k over my live rock bin. 14k on all of my other tanks with Meso Blue Helix by Quanta lights. This combo for coloration and growth is like no other.

Got my RB fixture hung and fired up yesterday. Right now it’s probably around 15” above waterline so I’ll definitely be dropping it to somewhere around 10-12” to reduce spill. These are 20k aquabrite bulbs no filter on phone lense so it’s crazy blue. These bulbs in person are nice but I am probably going to try some 14k still

 

[StealthLabs]

I am torn between going with two Quanta Meso blues and two Reef Crest to flank the halides for ramp up/down. Thing is, I'd need a Proifilux Light Mini controller and break out box to control the four bars. Plus, that's 5 outlets being used.
Two Orphek OR4 Blue Plus and two Reef Day Plus with Osix controller so I can run all four bars off a single power supply and just use one outlet.
I think I know by decision, but wanted to hear others thoughts.

14k Halide w/ Meso Blue Helix Bar

 

[56longroof]

IMO, I feel the 14k is best. 20k is a deep blue and if you are not supplementing with a white light via LEDs or T5, it's just too blue. To each their own. Dave sent me all three kelvins and I haven't tested the PAR of each quite yet. But I can say the 10k is a true white, not a yellow like typical "10k bulbs." I use the 10k over my live rock bin. 14k on all of my other tanks with Meso Blue Helix by Quanta lights. This combo for coloration and growth is like no other.

How do the 10k compare to the old XM bulbs?

 

[reef’r]

IMO, I feel the 14k is best. 20k is a deep blue and if you are not supplementing with a white light via LEDs or T5, it's just too blue. To each their own. Dave sent me all three kelvins and I haven't tested the PAR of each quite yet. But I can say the 10k is a true white, not a yellow like typical "10k bulbs." I use the 10k over my live rock bin. 14k on all of my other tanks with Meso Blue Helix by Quanta lights. This combo for coloration and growth is like no other.

I did end up picking up the 14ks from aquabrite and that’s what I’m running, supplemented by two Orphek blue plus bars. I do love the 14k and have even been tempted to try 10k but don’t want to be fooling around too much with the light just want the coral to set in and grow!

 

[StealthLabs]

How do the 10k compare to the old XM bulbs?

The AquaBriteSolutions 10k is a clean white without the yellow hue. That's the only difference I observed.

 

[StealthLabs]

I did end up picking up the 14ks from aquabrite and that’s what I’m running, supplemented by two Orphek blue plus bars. I do love the 14k and have even been tempted to try 10k but don’t want to be fooling around too much with the light just want the coral to set in and grow!

That setup is clutch! I say give it a shot when you replace the bulbs. Buy one 10k ahead of time and see if you like it. If so, you can run the halides and still have the blue viewing throughout the evening.

 

[X-37B]

I did end up picking up the 14ks from aquabrite and that’s what I’m running, supplemented by two Orphek blue plus bars. I do love the 14k and have even been tempted to try 10k but don’t want to be fooling around too much with the light just want the coral to set in and grow!

Do you have any par #'s?

 

[X-37B]

The AquaBriteSolutions 10k is a clean white without the yellow hue. That's the only difference I observed.

Any par #'s?

 

[StealthLabs]

IMO, I feel the 14k is best. 20k is a deep blue and if you are not supplementing with a white light via LEDs or T5, it's just too blue. To each their own. Dave sent me all three kelvins and I haven't tested the PAR of each quite yet. But I can say the 10k is a true white, not a yellow like typical "10k bulbs." I use the 10k over my live rock bin. 14k on all of my other tanks with Meso Blue Helix by Quanta lights. T

Any par #'s?

No. Not currently. I do have all three bulbs they offer (10/14/20k), but I have not tested them yet.

 

[X-37B]

My 10K ushio 400's put out 188 par on the RB fixture.
10K on the LB was 560 so 100 more pare than the Radium 20k at 450.
That was on a digital ballast.

M135 ballast and the Radium 20K put out 369 par On the LB. The digital runs the 20K at 30% more power than the recommended m135.
The RB was 136 par on the digital and 20K
I will test the 10K's on the new M59 which is the recommended ballast For them.
In all the digital ballasts give the bulbs around 30% more power.

 

[56longroof]

My 10K ushio 400's put out 188 par on the RB fixture.
10K on the LB was 560 so 100 more pare than the Radium 20k at 450.
That was on a digital ballast.

M135 ballast and the Radium 20K put out 369 par On the LB. The digital runs the 20K at 30% more power than the recommended m135 at 450.
The RB was 136 par on the digital.
I will test the 10K's on the new M59 which is the recommended ballast For them.
In all the digital ballasts give the bulbs around 30% more power.

Those seem like really low numbers. The XM 10k Im using put out almost 1000 par at the waters surface with the bulbs 9" above the water.

 

[StealthLabs]

My 10K ushio 400's put out 188 par on the RB fixture.
10K on the LB was 560 so 100 more pare than the Radium 20k at 450.
That was on a digital ballast.

M135 ballast and the Radium 20K put out 369 par On the LB. The digital runs the 20K at 30% more power than the recommended m135.
The RB was 136 par on the digital and 20K
I will test the 10K's on the new M59 which is the recommended ballast For them.
In all the digital ballasts give the bulbs around 30% more power.

Which Apogee meter are you using? Do you have the numbers in water and not on an open surface? They just seem too low to be accurate.

 

[reef’r]

Do you have any par #'s?

Unfortunately I do not I’ve actually been watching your halide threads for your numbers. My fixture is the DE 250watt…. I have it 10” off the water so I figure the bulb is realistically closer to 13-14 with the depth it sits inside the fixture. I plan to rent a par meter soon and get some numbers I’m hoping to be 200+ on the bottom tank is 16” deep

 

[X-37B]

Which Apogee meter are you using? Do you have the numbers in water and not on an open surface? They just seem too low to be accurate.

The test is 14" to the water and 17" to the bottom. This simulates my new system lighting height.
The numbers are what they are and just show the difference between the reflectors.
I had never tested par in the water with halides and I ran them in the early 90's.
The par meter is a Parwise set on air readings.
It is close enough to the Apogee I tested along side it.
I will retest all when the system gets here.

 

[X-37B]

Unfortunately I do not I’ve actually been watching your halide threads for your numbers. My fixture is the DE 250watt…. I have it 10” off the water so I figure the bulb is realistically closer to 13-14 with the depth it sits inside the fixture. I plan to rent a par meter soon and get some numbers I’m hoping to be 200+ on the bottom tank is 16” deep

Yea it will be interesting as I never tested my de 250's. I was 14" off the surface and 22" to the bottom.
Whatever the numbers were it could and did grow acros easily on the bottom.

 

[me & my baby]

Reading through this is making me want to get my old setup out . I do miss my halides . I like the looks of LEDs but I miss the 20k radium with some High output vho actinics on a icecap 660 . I got so much halide stuff lol I’m a hoarder .

 

[X-37B]

This shows the LB 1 and RB 2.
This is where the readings came from. 31" from the fixtures edge.
It shows how focused the LB light is vs the RB. This is why the par is higher in the LB.

 

[me & my baby]

Oh the LB are like a laser beam . I remember when they first came out . I got a set of the first batch coralvue put out and swapped my lumenarchs for them . I fried so many corals . I had to rebuild my canopy to raise them up to quit cooking my corals .