Murder Tang

[ScottF]

I made the mistake of adding a gold-rimmed tang as my first (not-bottom dwelling) fish. Some new fish he completely ignores. Like my little clown, hawkfish and my midas blenny. Other fish he harasses, but they can hold their own. Like my foxface, melanurus and my bluejaw trigger pair. He straight up murdered my tomini tang. He's a jerk that basically had the tank to himself for way too long.

I managed to catch him with an acrylic fish trap/acclimation box from PNW Custom. He is residing in my sump and fuge as of yesterday. Today I added three juvenile yellow tangs, a small filefish and a tiny baby mandarin from Biota. Some time soon I should be receiving a powder blue tang, powder brown tang, blue hippo tang and a lemonpeel angel from Marine Collectors.

The big question is, will keeping him out of the main tank for a few weeks allow the pecking order in the tank to reset or will he go on a murder spree if I reintroduce him? Everyone in the tank seems happier with him gone. Do I donate him to one of my LFS? He is a beautiful fish.

 

[Cheese Griller]

how big are the yellows, how big is the gold rim, and how big is the tank? All will play into your next steps

 

[BasementBox]

That and how big is the powder blue… those guys hold grudges like an old Irish man. Pb’s are notorious for being bullies on their own. Also it’s supposedly a no no mixing powders.

 

[ScottF]

The Yellows are very small. One inch maybe. If they stand on their tippy toes. The gold-rimmed I would call an adult. Four inches maybe. Big enough to destroy the yellows with no effort.

The tank is a seven foot long 210G Red Sea S1000 G2+.

 

[am3gross]

You have a 250 correct? I think that having the Gold Rim, Powder Blue and the Powder Brown is asking for trouble. Not saying it cant be done. I have an Achillies, Powder Brown and a Clown tang, all are corrently peaceful but I am sure later down the road 1 will have to be moved.

 

[ScottF]

That and how big is the powder blue… those guys hold grudges like an old Irish man. Pb’s are notorious for being bullies on their own. Also it’s supposedly a no no mixing powders.

I've mixed powders in the past by introducing them together. My old tank had powder blue, powder brown, blue hippo, tomini, and a vlamingi with no issues and it was half the size of this tank. That powder blue was a model citizen. It was my niger trigger that grew up to be a jerk.

 

[ScottF]

You have a 250 correct?

The main tank is 210. 265 total system volume. I usually just call it 250.

 

[exnisstech]

Deleted. Sounds like the OP has it figured out.

 

[ScottF]

I've mixed powders in the past by introducing them together. My old tank had powder blue, powder brown, blue hippo, tomini, and a vlamingi with no issues and it was half the size of this tank. That powder blue was a model citizen. It was my niger trigger that grew up to be a jerk.

And I later introduced an Achillies that seemed to be doing well with everyone else until a power outage wiped out half of that tank and I tore it down.

The trigger though.. It liked to snack on chromis.

 

[ScottF]

Deleted. Sounds like the OP has it figured out.

I'm open to all advice. And this gold-rimmed has opened my eyes a bit about how lucky I was in the past. I do tend to get a little defensive when I get "tang policed".

Seems like there are a lot of people out there with a "do what I say, not what I do" attitude. People with all the tangs in the world in their tank telling others not to mix tangs.

My understanding is that every fish is different and it's a bit of a crapshoot. There are techniques for maximizing success like introducing them all together when they are young or introducing them in groups to spread aggression.

But at the end of the day, much like people, some fish are jerks and some aren't. To me, tangs make the aquarium. It's worth the risk and effort to try to get them to coexist.

What I don't have experience with is dealing with the jerks. It sounds like the best thing to do is probably just donate the gold-rimmed to a LFS. It's what I did with that trigger, but I did watch a reef builder video where they talked about removing a fish and reintroducing it later to reset the pecking order. I was trying to find out if anyone has experience/success doing this.

 

[exnisstech]

I just have nothing constructive. I was going to say mixing powders isn't a good idea but I've never even been able to keep either a blue or brown alive long term so my opinion is meaningless.
Also I've not had to deal with a jerk tang. I have had others types of aggressive fish and if they don't settle down I remove them. Which you already have a plan in place
As you know the yellows are coming in small so they may not do well thrust into a tank with larger fish. I added 3 last march but was able to keep them in a stock tank for several weeks then make them the first fish in the new tank 84x30x25" I left them in alone for a month then brought the bigger tangs over one at a time. I understand that isnt a luxury everyone has.
I'm been lucky with my gang. I have 8, some that have been with me for years the oldest a naso 8 years.
Good luck with the new tank. I almost went with the same tank for my last build but coming from a 72x24x24" I wanted 30" depth for the swim room so I went with a WB 330.7

My gang

 

[am3gross]

I'm all about the what ever you want plan myself, I just know that from my experience's, I have had some jerk tangs for sure, (Powder Blue specifically) and I tried the taking him out thing and it did not work in my attempt. I also changed the rock work around thinking that may help too. For what it is worth I think I am in the 10-12 group as how many tangs I have, and I agree, they do make the tank. I have a 375 display 96x36x25, however so my experience's might be different from yours..

 

[ScottF]

I just have nothing constructive. I was going to say mixing powders isn't a good idea but I've never even been able to keep either a blue or brown alive long term so my opinion is meaningless.
Also I've not had to deal with a jerk tang. I have had others types of aggressive fish and if they don't settle down I remove them. Which you already have a plan in place
As you know the yellows are coming in small so they may not do well thrust into a tank with larger fish. I added 3 last march but was able to keep them in a stock tank for several weeks then make them the first fish in the new tank 84x30x25" I left them in alone for a month then brought the bigger tangs over one at a time. I understand that isnt a luxury everyone has.
I'm been lucky with my gang. I have 8, some that have been with me for years the oldest a naso 8 years.
Good luck with the new tank. I almost went with the same tank for my last build but coming from a 72x24x24" I wanted 30" depth for the swim room so I went with a WB 330.7

My gang

Thanks for the reply. Lovely tank. I love vlamingi tangs. I half believe that my vlamingi is what kept the piece in my old tank. He ended up massively oversized for that tank. So I am hesitant to get another. He never seemed unhappy though.

 

[ScottF]

I'm all about the what ever you want plan myself, I just know that from my experience's, I have had some jerk tangs for sure, (Powder Blue specifically) and I tried the taking him out thing and it did not work in my attempt. I also changed the rock work around thinking that may help too. For what it is worth I think I am in the 10-12 group as how many tangs I have, and I agree, they do make the tank. I have a 375 display 96x36x25, however so my experience's might be different from yours..

I think I am just going to cut my losses and donate Bruno. It's a shame. He really filled out well in his short stay here.

 

[am3gross]

Yeah, I hear that. Gold Rims are such a pretty fish too.. would be a 2nd favorite of mine with the Powder Blue being number 1

 

[ScottF]

As you know the yellows are coming in small so they may not do well thrust into a tank with larger fish.

I was expecting them to be small, but not this paper thin. They seem to be doing ok so far in the six hours or so that they've been in the tank. Really only the melanurus wrasse has shown any aggression and that hasn't been anything serious yet.

Hopefully they fill out quickly. I'm sure they would be goners if I hadn't managed to catch Bruno the murder tang.

 

[ScottF]

Yeah, I hear that. Gold Rims are such a pretty fish too.. would be a 2nd favorite of mine with the Powder Blue being number 1

Achilles for me. Then Powder Blue. Achilles are just so hard to find that aren't infested with parasites. I keep seeing them every now and then at Ocean View Aquariums near my house and I'm tempted. Sooo tempted.

 

[am3gross]

Hopefully you are right. I also got the Biota Yellows and they were the size of a quarter. I kept them in a 75 gallon frag tank for months before adding them because I wanted to make sure they were eating the food I was putting in there for them. In the big tank it is no holds barred during feeding time. Now, they are up there with the big boys getting there share!

Good luck to you! Let us know how it works out.

 

[vetteguy53081]

In many cases, a vicious tang never changes their behavior. Powder blue, sohol tang and clown tang are examples of tangs that will be a nightmare. I have 26 tangs and hiding and space are essential.

 

[am3gross]

Achilles for me. Then Powder Blue. Achilles are just so hard to find that aren't infested with parasites. I keep seeing them every now and then at Ocean View Aquariums near my house and I'm tempted. Sooo tempted.

Yeah, I have gone thru a few, the one I have now will be the last. I also started him off in a 75 gallon and was eating but just wasn't happy. One day I just said F it, if your not going to make it, I dont want him to die in the small tank.. So I added him to the display and he turned it all around. happy and healthy now!