My GHA nightmare is back in just over a week.

[Tim Olson]

I am not currently running any phosphate remover. I was using rowa phos in my tank for about 1 month. Then I took it out when I kept getting zero phosphates.

I feel your pain. I've been battling GHA for almost a couple of years, although, it have been gradually going away over the last couple of months. It's almost gone now. Also, during this whole time I always had zero phosphates and nitrates per the tests. What I've realized is that the GHA was absorbing all the nitrates and phosphates, therefore, giving a zero reading.

Here's my 2 cents worth ... the main things I think have helped my tank were:

• Continually removing the GHA. Mainly by using a silicone siphon tube that allows me to pinch the GHA while it's in the tube and pull it off. I also use a syringe with a long, small diameter tube on it. I've been able to suck the algae off from rocks that way.
• Small army of Hermit Crabs. They helped keep clean up and ate some algae.
• A Tuxedo Urchin. It would not eat the thicker areas of GHA, but would thoroughly clean the other areas, which kept the algae from coming back. Over time most of the rockwork was cleaned.
• Brightwell's Phosphate-E phosphate remover - I ran across this during one of BRS's live videos, where they recommended using it instead of GFO. So I figured I'd give it a try. So I started carefully dosing it with my dosing pump throughout the day. What I found was it very effective at removing phosphates and over time it removed all the phosphates that were stored in the GHA and the rocks. I like it because I could precisely control the phosphate level, vs. using GFO, which would give an up and down roller coaster ride.
• The tank is reaching it's 2 year mark, and is relatively mature.

Overall, I think the Phosphate-E was the most significant factor. Although, you have to be careful to not overdose and starve your corals.

I hope this helps a little.

 

[stevieduk]

well when you wrote the algae bible , you hit the nail on the head when you wrote , BUT IVE GOT PEOPLE COMING OVER AND I WANT IT TO LOOK NICE. I think a lot of the people in this hobby just want a " ooh look what ive got " item in there house. My tank is to me , is a little part of the sea bed , and I know from years of being a commercial diver , that the sea bed is not a clean and pristine place
People seem to want to set up there tank, always have their gravel and rocks brilliant white and not a thing out of place.
Let your tank mature and find a balance at its own pace, if this takes a year or 18 months, then so be it

 

[BryanD]

Carbon dosing. That's what solved my cyano/GHA problems. Starting about 5 years ago, I dissolve my Calcium hydroxide in white vinegar, right now 300mL per 3 gallons of RO water, to make my Kalkwasser. I just drip 1.5 liters into sump every morning, (65 gallon system), I have one of the Kent Marine bottles they used to sell (wish they still did). If you are interested look online, there is a chart about how to start slowly. Haven't had a GHA issue for a long time until just recently, had some GSP that was hanging off a shelf right in front of the overflow that get overrun with GHA due to me messing with an orange tree gorgonian, was overfeeding the tank but I came up with a solution to that so after cutting off the GSP that was covered in GHA it hasn't returned. Also had my first cyano outbreak in a long time for the same reason (gorgonian), but since cleaning both up a week ago and a good water change, neither has returned. Like has been stated, you never get rid of algae, just learn how to control it. Carbon dosing "feeds" the bacteria that breakdown the ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates, more than they get normally. I do get some extra bacterial film, especially in the lines from sump back to tank, but I also have a lawnmower blenny that loves the stuff. In fact, this is also one of the reasons I feel he is doing so well, I had one 4 years ago that seemed to be doing well for over a year then all of the sudden appeared to stop eating and died. After reviewing what I had been doing over the previous couple of months, realized for some reason I had gotten lazy and wasn't dosing vinegar on a regular basis. I think the lack of a bacterial film contributed to him not eating enough. I've had the one I got now for over two years, and he is fat and happy. So once in awhile I crank up the return pump and flush out the bacterial film, he races around eating the bacterial film that is flushed out. The rest settles in my sump, which is where I pull my water for my water changes. Some have complained about white "flakes" in the DT water but I've never had that issue. Just another option, and my 2 cents ...

 

[Wendybright]

GREAT ARTICLE

 

[nden]

My next step is buying some snails. I stopped buying snails because my hermits kept eating them everytime I bought them so I just removed the hermits 2 days ago. I am going to buy snails on my next day off. Right now I have 2 nassarius snails and 2 other small snails (not sure what kind) but I know that is not enough to make any kind of difference in my tank.

One thing to know about snails, they work for you. If you have a really bad area they aren't working on, place them there! Don't just think they'll work there way there.

 

[niQo]

I realize a tuxedo urchin may not the the sole answer to your problems, but mine have been making a huge difference in my tank. Just combine it with manual removal and you will most likely make headway.

I do think that most tanks that have zero algae just control it better with herbivores. Algae is, after all, a part of any reef.

 

[Fish_Sticks]

well when you wrote the algae bible , you hit the nail on the head when you wrote , BUT IVE GOT PEOPLE COMING OVER AND I WANT IT TO LOOK NICE. I think a lot of the people in this hobby just want a " ooh look what ive got " item in there house. My tank is to me , is a little part of the sea bed , and I know from years of being a commercial diver , that the sea bed is not a clean and pristine place
People seem to want to set up there tank, always have their gravel and rocks brilliant white and not a thing out of place.
Let your tank mature and find a balance at its own pace, if this takes a year or 18 months, then so be it

Nicely reinforced. Good job!

Also you can find the algae bible thread here and read the full discussion: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/what-if-i-told-you-ammonia-was-causing-your-algae-problems.558661/

I've made an adjustment to the original post...

7. do not add more snails, shrimp, fish or other animals to the system to FIX your algae, initially. You should already be running a tank with these inhabitants, otherwise nicknamed the Clean Up Crew (CUC). These animals will bring your ecosystem full circle, and play an important role in turning algae back into food for bacteria.
AFTER you've addressed the detritus build up issue, consider readdressing your stock list to include more CUC members, such as snails, shrimps gobies, and everybody's favorite fish, the lawnmower blenny.

8. do not go overboard with detritus removal. Your existing bacteria and corals need decaying detritus to remain healthy. The focus is not to starve your algae into oblivion, but to control the algae so bacteria have a chance to repopulate and take the algaes place. Bacteria repopulation is our main objective, not total detritus removal, not 0-5 nitrates, not 0 phosphates, not low ammonia production, as those are inherently unhealthy and now, finally, dated practices.

 

[DaNkness]

2-7-19
Cleaned my JBJ 45 pulling out by hand as much GHA as I can and then scrubbing the rocks with a toothbrush while in the tank. I also performed a 10% water change right after cleaning the tank.

2-17-19
Algae is back. Scrubbed tank again and performed a 15% wc.
Moved hermits out of tank in order to stock up on a better CUC (hermits keep eating all the snails)
Tested nitrates and phosphates. Here are the results............

Salifert phosphate test kit results

API kit. Holding the test tube against the color chart

Same test. Holding the test tube away from the color chart

Somebody help!!!!!!

I would recommend that you look into brightwell’s “razor“ product. That stuff will rid your tank of GHA once and for all in less than a week. I believe you can purchase it on marine depot.

 

[saullman]

I feel your pain. I've been battling GHA for almost a couple of years, although, it have been gradually going away over the last couple of months. It's almost gone now. Also, during this whole time I always had zero phosphates and nitrates per the tests. What I've realized is that the GHA was absorbing all the nitrates and phosphates, therefore, giving a zero reading.

Here's my 2 cents worth ... the main things I think have helped my tank were:

• Continually removing the GHA. Mainly by using a silicone siphon tube that allows me to pinch the GHA while it's in the tube and pull it off. I also use a syringe with a long, small diameter tube on it. I've been able to suck the algae off from rocks that way.
• Small army of Hermit Crabs. They helped keep clean up and ate some algae.
• A Tuxedo Urchin. It would not eat the thicker areas of GHA, but would thoroughly clean the other areas, which kept the algae from coming back. Over time most of the rockwork was cleaned.
• Brightwell's Phosphate-E phosphate remover - I ran across this during one of BRS's live videos, where they recommended using it instead of GFO. So I figured I'd give it a try. So I started carefully dosing it with my dosing pump throughout the day. What I found was it very effective at removing phosphates and over time it removed all the phosphates that were stored in the GHA and the rocks. I like it because I could precisely control the phosphate level, vs. using GFO, which would give an up and down roller coaster ride.
• The tank is reaching it's 2 year mark, and is relatively mature.

Overall, I think the Phosphate-E was the most significant factor. Although, you have to be careful to not overdose and starve your corals.

I hope this helps a little.

I just took out a small army of hermit crabs from my tank. They didn't seem to be doing anything but eating my snails. Now I can add more snails to my tank and see if they make a difference.

Also I tried using rowa phos in my tank. WWC recommended it. Left it in my tank for a month, then removed it. Not really sure if it helped or not because my phosphates always show 0.

 

[saullman]

I realize a tuxedo urchin may not the the sole answer to your problems, but mine have been making a huge difference in my tank. Just combine it with manual removal and you will most likely make headway.

I do think that most tanks that have zero algae just control it better with herbivores. Algae is, after all, a part of any reef.

I tried a tuxedo urchin a while ago and it was dead within 3 days. I have no idea what happened other than my tank was a newer tank. I have been hesitant to buy one ever since. Are you supposed to acclimate them just like you would a fish before putting it in the tank?

 

[Tim Olson]

I just took out a small army of hermit crabs from my tank. They didn't seem to be doing anything but eating my snails. Now I can add more snails to my tank and see if they make a difference.

Also I tried using rowa phos in my tank. WWC recommended it. Left it in my tank for a month, then removed it. Not really sure if it helped or not because my phosphates always show 0.

I had the same experience with the hermit crabs eating my snails. So I finally quit getting snails. But the main reason I quit getting snails is they wouldn't survive. I think it was because, my phosphates would fluctuate wildly, since I was using GFO. What would happen is right after I added a new batch of GFO the phosphates would be depleted, then after a few days it quit working and the GHA would start growing again. BTW, all during this time phosphates were reading zero on my Hanna tester.

Also, I tried Rowa Phos a few times and it had the same effect as GFO. I did this for almost 2 years. Then I heard that BRS and WWC recommended using Brightwell's Phosphate-E to get phosphates under control. I like it, since I could precisely control the dosing amount. BTW, the best way I could tell it was working was if the GHA quit growing and the corals started looking better. Currently, I'm not using Phosphate-E, after using it for about 2 1/2 months, since it appears to removed all the "stored up" phosphates in the system. Although, if phosphates start to creep up too much then I'll use it, in moderation, to bring phosphates back down.

In summary, it might be worth using Phosphate-E or something like it to get your phosphates under control. It was the closest thing to a silver bullet for my system. Also, I would follow the suggestions by @Fish_Sticks, which was a great summary.

All the best and good luck!

 

[saullman]

Here is a pic of my tank before the light comes on.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I would focus on phosphates. Additionally I have had success with small dosages of Red Sea No3Po4 as mine has been gone for many weeks.
Clean up crew is now on guard for me for further control

 

[saullman]

I would focus on phosphates. Additionally I have had success with small dosages of Red Sea No3Po4 as mine has been gone for many weeks.
Clean up crew is now on guard for me for further control

I just bought nopox, but haven't used it yet. I was using it as a last resort. I hear it works very well, but to be careful when using it. How much were you using and for how long?

 

[CoralReefer1019]

The algae control bible as prescribed by fish_sticks.

The rules of algae management:

1. do not make sudden changes, do not use hydrogen peroxide, do not turn off your lights and perform a tank blackout (this is not only bad for your corals, but your fish), or do anything that would be described as a fast fix. These strategies do not work long term. As soon as you stop dosing, as soon as you turn back on the lights, the algae will come back. These are foolish strategies.

2. patience. Understand that it will take a few weeks or even a month to fix the problem. This hobby is based on the slowest changing thing in the world, the ocean. Patience is required to achieve success in the hobby.

3. algae is not a bad thing. Sure its ugly, but its not going to crash your tank in a few weeks. Every single tank on the planet has algae, there is no way to get rid of it. The secret that nobody talks about, is that you never get rid of algae, you control algae.

4. during this process, you should be manually removing algae from the tank when it reaches high levels, or when it threatens the well being of your corals and fish.

5. do not do too much too fast. Take things slow and focus on changing your habits. The algae will dissipate with time if you perform a responsible maintenance routine. Plus, fish love a little snack of fresh grown algae, they are probably having a ball while they watch you run around like a crazy person changing a hundred things on the tank and ruining the balance of the ecosystem.

6. this bible assumes that you arent running your lights for longer than 14/16 hours. Although algae likes light, it cannot survive on just light. If you have a dirty tank, you can grow algea with lights on for only a few hours a day. Fix the real problem...

7. do not add more snails, shrimp, fish or any other animals to the system to eat your algae. This is another fool's tactic. Your just creating more crap. Fix the real problem...

Why do you have algae? Its plain and simple, don't let anyone fool you.
Your tank is dirty; maybe not chemically, but physically.

Nitrate levels around 10-20 are perfectly fine. Phosphates dont even really matter that much. Algae doesn't even really like nitrogen, what they do love, is ammonia!

For algae to use nitrogen, they must convert it into ammonia.

Algae love ammonia because it is less work for algae to consume ammonia than nitrogen.

When detritus (fish crap uneaten food) breaks down into ammonia, the ammonia is usually taken up by the bacteria in your rock; however, because algae use ammonia very efficiently, algae can use ammonia before the bacteria have a chance. This causes some bacteria to die off and for the algae to get worse over time.

Can you see how this would create a snowball effect?

Your algae is essentially taking over your bacteria.

This gets even worse because the algae also contributes to clogging up your rock and taking up valuable surface area that bacteria need to live. Algae can overtake your bacteria when it comes to using ammonia. Think you can keep reducing your nitrates into oblivion and starving your corals in hopes your algae will magically disappear? Think again. Your tank is dirty.

So, if you remove the detritus, you solve your algae problems. Don't let anyone fool you otherwise!

Where is the detritus?
It can be in the holes and pores of your rock. Detritus looks just like you think it would, brownish green fish poop.
Fix: use a turkey baster to blast out only a few rocks per day, overtime your equipment (skimmer or filter socks) will collect the detritus. You also create more surface area for bacteria to live inside the rocks.
It can be in your sand bed.
Fix: Vacuum out your sand bed with a gravel vacuum. This can and should be done on a regular basis during your routine water changes, and you kill two birds with one stone; changing the water, and cleaning detritus! I like to vacuum out with my right hand, hold the end of the hose with my left, and control the flow of water in the siphon hose with my left hand fingers.
It can be in your equipment.
Fix: Clean your equipment on a regular basis, check any sponges, filter floss, pumps, wavemaker suction cups. Detritus can get lodged anywhere.
It can be in your sump.
Fix: I like to suck it up with a turkey baster. The best part about the baster is you can use it to blow water out, or suck things up.
It can be in your macroalgae (if you're growing macroalgae).
Fix: After a small 1G water change, just shake out your chaeto macroalgae in your water change water.

Great so now I can go crazy cleaning my tank right?
Not so fast. Doing too much at one time can cause your tank to crash. Only do a fair amount of maintenance a day. Doing too much than your equipment can handle will cause your ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate production to rise too much too fast. This is not so much about getting rid of the algae as much as it is improving your maintenance habits. If you fix your habits, the algae will be under control; and stay under control.

How do I avoid detritus buildup?
Well if you look around your tank, I'm sure you can find dead spots where water inst flowing very well. See if you can find some dead spots and fix them.

If you have a power head pointed directly at a rock, its gonna lodge a bunch of crud into there.

But I have friends coming over and I want my tank to look nice fast.
That's just too bad. The algae has be slowly gaining power overtime and getting stronger and stronger though weeks of work because you have detritus build up. If you think you can fix all that in one or two weeks, then you're out of luck.

But I have super duper deadly byopsis, cotton candy algae, (insert buzzword terrible evil algea here, AHHHH NITRATES ARE AT 11 PPM IM GONNA DIE, I NEED TO USE PHOSBAN ASAP. IM NEVER GONNA FEED MY FISH AGAIN!!!! MAYBE I NEED TO RIP OUT ALL MY ROCK AND TOSS IN IN BLEACH !!!! OR JUST CHANGE MY T5 BULBS AND IT WILL GO AWAY AHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!)
Calm dowwwwwn. So what. All algae does the same thing. They feed off the ammonia produced by the detritus in your aquarium. You can carefully physically remove the algae just like normal, remain calm, dont do anything too fast, dont result to stupid quick fixes, have some fun, and follow the algae bible.

Lots and lots of people are gonna tell you otherwise, but that's not their fault. They don't know any better.
This is your tank.
You've been given the algae bible. Follow the rules. If you don't use it, your tank will only have you to blame, not random people on the forums who suggested you try a couple of foolish quick fixes in a hobby based entirely on patience; based around the slowest changing thing in the entire world, the ocean.

I have some live rock in my sump and I’m pretty sure I’m harvesting detritus there. I want to remove the live rock from my sump by doing this will it cause any issues! I really enjoyed reading your post very I formative. Getting rid of detritus is key. My system is 60G frag tank with not that much live rock inside just frag racks. If I remove the rocks in my sump will I loose too much of the benificial bacteria!

 

[Fish_Sticks]

If you dont have much rock in your display, the rock in your sump is performing a very important role in harboring bacteria. I wouldn't remove it at all. Maybe you could put it in your display...

These strategies of removing detritus are only for dealing with huge algae outbreaks. Theres nothing wrong with having small, or even large amounts detritus in a perfectly balanced tank.

One of the key steps to a balanced tank, is a healthy amount of rock for your bacteria. Rock is literally the foundation your tank relys on.

If you want to message me photos of your tank I can try to assist further...

 

[Fish_Sticks]

Also I need to make it very clear that Ive revised one of the rules and added a new one. Rule 8 is especially important and I regret having not added it. The original post wasnt being received correctly...

7. do not add more snails, shrimp, fish or other animals to the system to FIX your algae, initially. You should already be running a tank with these inhabitants, otherwise nicknamed the Clean Up Crew (CUC). These animals will bring your ecosystem full circle, and play an important role in turning algae back into food for bacteria.
AFTER you've addressed the detritus build up issue, consider readdressing your stock list to include more CUC members, such as snails, shrimps gobies, and everybody's favorite fish, the lawnmower blenny.

8. do not go overboard with detritus removal. Your existing bacteria and corals need decaying detritus to remain healthy. The focus is not to starve your algae into oblivion, but to control the algae so bacteria have a chance to repopulate and take the algaes place. Bacteria repopulation is our main objective, not total detritus removal, not 0-5 nitrates, not 0 phosphates, not low ammonia production, as those are inherently unhealthy and now, finally, dated practices.

 

[CoralReefer1019]

If you dont have much rock in your display, the rock in your sump is performing a very important role in harboring bacteria. I wouldn't remove it at all. Maybe you could put it in your display...

These strategies of removing detritus are only for dealing with huge algae outbreaks. Theres nothing wrong with having small, or even large amounts detritus in a perfectly balanced tank.

One of the key steps to a balanced tank, is a healthy amount of rock for your bacteria. Rock is literally the foundation your tank relys on.

If you want to message me photos of your tank I can try to assist further...

It’s BRS Reefsaver Rock, display has good flow I don’t run any filter socks, just skimmer and gfo. Sump is getting dirty with detritus

 

[PhreeByrd]

Good discussion. I've been through the nuisance algae wars a few times, primarily dealing with derbesia and bryopsis. I can say this: there is absolutely no easy, quick fix. Dumping potentially toxic chemicals into your water is not a solution. Nor is turning off your lights for several days. I have yet to find a tang, blenny, snail, urchin, or any other critter that prefers these nuisance alga over other foods. Obsessively cleaning the tank is likely worse than just leaving it alone. And scrubbing the rock with a toothbrush, even with the rock outside of the tank, is absolutely the worst idea on the planet.

You cannot remove algae. It is everywhere, like dust. You can control it. With good husbandry, bacteria will eventually outcompete it. IME, good nutrient control, which more than anything means keeping your nutrient levels STABLE (even if higher than some will tell you they should be), is extremely important. Physical removal of large stands of algae can be beneficial, since it removes primary nutrients along with the pest. When it was necessary, I did this by target siphoning while pulling/twisting the algae from the rock with a long tweezers, which left little behind. Just don't expect to be able to remove all of it, or to leave your rock completely clear of algae, because that is not possible. I am not a 'tank cleaner', and I've always had sand beds that I've left alone, even when they look a little grungy. That's natural to me.

The most important tactic is patience. I have not lost an algae war yet, but a couple of tanks literally took a couple of years to resolve into what I wanted them to be. Afterwards, there was no visible algae growing in those tanks. But it was/is still there. It's just no longer a pest.

 

[Katrina71]

No NoPox!!! My official vote. Wait it out. Feed less. Change a larger volume of water more often. Maybe shorten your light cycle. Jmo