Need Help clownfish has ich or velvet!

[PeterB113]

So this morning i noticed very small white dots on my clownfish in my 20g long reef. Did some research and it looks like it could be ich or velvet. Looked up many treatments and they all inclue either medicating with copper( which i cant do because i have corals) or to quarantine with various medications. I dont have a tank to quarantine fish in and since the disease is already in the water i dont understand how it would help if im just eventually putting him back in. Please let me know what i should do. Thanks for your help

20g long reef tank 1 powerhead 1 heater and AI prime 16hd. No filters or skimmers.

Temp 78°
Dkh. 7.2
Salinity 1.025
Nitrite 0ppm
Ammonia 0ppm
Calcium 430ppm
Ph. 8.2

 

[PeterB113]

Pictures of the clownfish sorry meant to put these pics in my fitst post. Lmk if you think its ich or velvet.

 

[fishguy242]

@Jay Hemdal @vetteguy53081

 

[Tamberav]

That looks like velvet to me or early brook? As I see lots of spots.

You let the tank go without fish for 6 weeks or so to get rid of the parasite. It dies off without a host. That is why you remove them and treat them in a hospital tank

If it is velvet or brook then you have no choice but to remove all fish or they will probably die.

 

[PeterB113]

Will the parasite live off my corals? Frogspawn duncan toadstool galaxea and zoanthids also one lord acan frag. If i create a hospital tank i need to be sure the parasite wont live off my corals and in 6 weeks im back in the same position. I also have inverts hermit crabs sandstarfish an arrow crab and pincushion urchin. Thank you for your help and please give any advice on how i should create a hospital tank. Remember my main tank is a 20glong and i live in a apartment so space is kind of tricky.

 

[fishguy242]

i think fallow is about 10 weeks?? 72+ days

 

[vetteguy53081]

Im thinking brook. Brooklynella symptomatically looks like ich, white spot disease. The clown will at the onset scrape up against objects, rapid respiration (breathing) develops, and fish often gasp for air at the surface and swims eratically. Its the white mucus plus dots that leads me to Brook.
Copper will do nothing for this. Formalin however would but this has become accelerated and needs immediate treatment of Formalin stronger than diluted or Ruby Rally Pro.
To differentiate from ich/velvet- close up, brook dots will be kidney shaped whereas ich/velvet will be round.
You can give this fish a FW dip to help to remove some of the parasites, as well as reduce the amount of mucus in the gills to assist with respiration problems. Once the initial dip or bath is done, place the fish into a QT under lower salinity (1.022) to help keep any possible new free-swimming protists from infecting the fish again, and then obtain medication as soon as possible to begin treatment.

 

[Tamberav]

Will the parasite live off my corals? Frogspawn duncan toadstool galaxea and zoanthids also one lord acan frag. If i create a hospital tank i need to be sure the parasite wont live off my corals and in 6 weeks im back in the same position. I also have inverts hermit crabs sandstarfish an arrow crab and pincushion urchin. Thank you for your help and please give any advice on how i should create a hospital tank. Remember my main tank is a 20glong and i live in a apartment so space is kind of tricky.

No. It can not survive without a fish host.

You break the cycle by removing fish for a long enough period that the parasite starves out. You do not want to keep the QT tank near the DT though and you need to be careful never to transfer water between tanks like on your hands or waste buckets etc.

I would do a peroxide bath I route to the hospital/QT tank. This is 1.25ml peroxide per cup of saltwater for 30 min. This will knock off a lot of disease and give your fish a better fighting chance. I find this a lot more gentle than freshwater dips.

Hybrid TTM or Copper + Metroplex would cover both brook, velvet, ich. Biospira can be used to help cycle a hospital tank.

Also stir the sand and turkey baster the rock to free up debris and parasites in your display tank once the fish are out. I would do this every few days... or at least once a week with your water changes or such.

There are tons of stickies in fishless (fallow period) and treatment options.

Fallow periods: Going Fishless

Please see this updated information on fallow periods: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/45-day-fallow-periods.805213/ Jay Hemdal 7/13/2023 The reason to go fallow (fishless) is to eliminate a fish disease from your DT (display tank). Going fallow works because you are denying the disease a...

www.reef2reef.com

Treatment Options Index

This thread contains links to useful treatment options. Please click on the blue links below for more info. :) Treatment Options 102 provides a brief rundown of most medications & treatments. Acriflavine is a first aid antiseptic. Antibiotics treats bacterial infections. Chloroquine...

www.reef2reef.com

My Current QT Process

UPDATE, 10/9/22: For those looking for quarantine information, our current process is kept updated on the first page of this thread (post any questions at the end of the thread). https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/current-quarantine-protocol.825055/ Thanks, Jay Hemdal I am frequently...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[vetteguy53081]

Will the parasite live off my corals? Frogspawn duncan toadstool galaxea and zoanthids also one lord acan frag. If i create a hospital tank i need to be sure the parasite wont live off my corals and in 6 weeks im back in the same position. I also have inverts hermit crabs sandstarfish an arrow crab and pincushion urchin. Thank you for your help and please give any advice on how i should create a hospital tank. Remember my main tank is a 20glong and i live in a apartment so space is kind of tricky.

Your best bet is to place fish in QT. Although corals cannot catch diseases, they sure can hold them until a new host fish is available. Fallow = meaning no fish in tank to allow cysts/parasites to die is 45-50 days. Ten weeks is no longer a rule of thumb, however the longer you go fallow, the less likely they will be fed on by a cyst

 

[Tamberav]

i think fallow is about 10 weeks?? 72+ days

It has been suggested by humble that turning the heat up to 80-82 will speed the process up. I believe Jay said they always did 45 days.

 

[PeterB113]

It has been suggested by humble that turning the heat up to 80-82 will speed the process up. I believe Jay said they always did 45 days.

Ok going to let nature take its course and if both my fish die, my 20g will become just corals and invert only. I cant have a QT setup and quarantine every fish for 6 weeks with water changes etc to much of a hassle and costly and my space is kind of restricted. Unless theres a way to treat without QT i guess im screwed. Ill post an update if they make it or die. Thanks for all your help wish there was a better solution for me.

 

[Tamberav]

Ok going to let nature take its course and if both my fish die, my 20g will become just corals and invert only. I cant have a QT setup and quarantine every fish for 6 weeks with water changes etc to much of a hassle and costly and my space is kind of restricted. Unless theres a way to treat without QT i guess im screwed. Ill post an update if they make it or die. Thanks for all your help wish there was a better solution for me.

You may want only buy fish from TSM or Dr Reef in the future as they do all the treating/QT for you. You pay a bit more but it skips having to do the work yourself.

Keeping pets healthy cost money and time, even fish.

You can use a 5g bucket and airstone for a QT. It doesn't need to be anything large. I don't even heat my 5g buckets... I just use room temp. Too worried a heater could fail and cook them in such a small amount of water.

 

[PeterB113]

In the future i definitley will after these fish die and 6 weeks go by. But to setup a qt tank that i need to do weekly water changes on , test parameters when i already have 2 reef tanks, get a new powerhead and heater just doesnt seem to make sense to keep a clownfish and royal gramma espically because im in an apt and already dont have much space. And does a QT tank need light? You say 5gallon bucket but 6 weeks for a fish to go without light seems like it would stress him more than do good... Alot longer than a typical blackout period.

 

[Tamberav]

In the future i definitley will after these fish die and 6 weeks go by. But to setup a qt tank that i need to do weekly water changes on , test parameters when i already have 2 reef tanks, get a new powerhead and heater just doesnt seem to make sense to keep a clownfish and royal gramma espically because im in an apt and already dont have much space. And does a QT tank need light? You say 5gallon bucket but 6 weeks for a fish to go without light seems like it would stress him more than do good... Alot longer than a typical blackout period.

I just use ambient light which is fine for fish. I don't put a cover on the bucket... I just fill it 75% of the way or put a piece of egg crate or craft mesh laying over the top. Can also just use a plastic Rubbermaid. I wouldn't bother with a powerhead, an air stone or sponge filter will be more useful for a sick fish. Again, I do not use a heater on the small QT tanks, only the larger ones. I put the tank somewhere temperature stays comfortable.

I just treated a Tang in a bucket for an eye infection (just got him from LFS). I use a large plastic bowl to take two large scoops of water out (maybe 25% water total) and added new fresh water (plus antibiotics) once a day. He came through with flying colors and never stopped eating. A 10g tote is arguably a better solution then a bucket but I have used buckets in a pinch.

Maybe you should consider giving the fish to someone who would treat them for disease. Some LFS have QT tanks. That way the fish gets a chance to live and you could also start the 6 week fallow period sooner.