New tank, fishes keep dying! Please help

[Saul2309]

Hi everyone! I am new to the reef hobby, started my 20 gallon three months ago, as you can image made plenty of noob mistakes, but you live and you learn, now, one month back my mom bought for me a baby blue hippo, and it got sick with ich, the hippo died but before anything got worse i moved all my other fishes to my qt with copper, at the time i had 4 clownfish, 1 bullet goby and a file fish, which was introduced days before the hippo got sick. I waited three weeks before releasing the fishes to the tank, separated the 2 clowns in another tanks so they won’t get aggressive, given that in the qt they started picking on one, days after both the clown that was getting picked on died as well as the bullet for misterious reasons(wouldn’t eat from the sand, and acted weird the whole time), I did the mistake of buying another diamond goby and a clownfish, the clownfish died after 5 days with weird white patches on its skin, did not look like ich, and the diamond goby was acting weird, but died two days after purchase being punctured by an emerald crab(happened in front of me), i removed the crab, bought a new clownfish 4 days ago, died this morning. Please help me I don’t know what to do anymore, I really want to stay in the hobby but can’t keep losing fishes like this. Here are my parameters. Salinity 33.
I appreciate any help, won’t buy any other fish till i find a solution, I want to upgrade to a 90 end of the year, that’s why I need help, thanks!!!

 

[o2manyfish]

There are so many variables to this question. A couple of things that stick out to me:

1) Those cute tiny lil baby blue hippo tangs - some times as small as a dime - Have a huge mortality rate in the wild and in captivity. Losing a tiny blue hippo is not necessarily on your shoulders.

2) The Diamond Goby is a Sand Sifter - If you moved it to a Copper QT you took away it's ability to eat. Even if you had sand in the QT tank, there was no life in the sand for the Diamond Goby to feed on. Many gobies are also extremely susceptible to digestive tract issues in high concentrations of copper. So you may have just starved this guy to to death by putting him in QT

3) The Clowns sound like possibly a Brooknyella outbreak, which would have been held if check with the copper but not necessarily eradicated.

4) Sounds like a lack of patience. Someone will surely correctl me but when you go fallow after and ich outbreak the tank needs to be fishless for 68-70 days. You said you went fallow for 3 weeks. So there was little point in putting all your livestock through the trauma of the QT tank if you weren't going to make sure you removed the original issue.

Also, you have had a run of bad luck, and lost a bunch of fish in a tank that you say is 3 months old. Depending how you cycled the tank, and how closely you followed the cycle, and the speed at which you kept adding bioload to a 20g tank it sounds like some of your issues may have occurred from tank immaturity.

Those are just 'some' of the options to your woes. There is also the issues of temperature stability, water movement, aeration, filtration - biological & mechanical, something nasty in the rock you purchased, outside factors (hair spray, bug spray, furniture polish, windex -used near the aquarium).

Sorry for your loss and frustration, but with the details you provided, its impossible for anyone to accurately and correctly determine the cause of your losses.

Dave B

 

[Saul2309]

There are so many variables to this question. A couple of things that stick out to me:

1) Those cute tiny lil baby blue hippo tangs - some times as small as a dime - Have a huge mortality rate in the wild and in captivity. Losing a tiny blue hippo is not necessarily on your shoulders.

2) The Diamond Goby is a Sand Sifter - If you moved it to a Copper QT you took away it's ability to eat. Even if you had sand in the QT tank, there was no life in the sand for the Diamond Goby to feed on. Many gobies are also extremely susceptible to digestive tract issues in high concentrations of copper. So you may have just starved this guy to to death by putting him in QT

3) The Clowns sound like possibly a Brooknyella outbreak, which would have been held if check with the copper but not necessarily eradicated.

4) Sounds like a lack of patience. Someone will surely correctl me but when you go fallow after and ich outbreak the tank needs to be fishless for 68-70 days. You said you went fallow for 3 weeks. So there was little point in putting all your livestock through the trauma of the QT tank if you weren't going to make sure you removed the original issue.

Also, you have had a run of bad luck, and lost a bunch of fish in a tank that you say is 3 months old. Depending how you cycled the tank, and how closely you followed the cycle, and the speed at which you kept adding bioload to a 20g tank it sounds like some of your issues may have occurred from tank immaturity.

Those are just 'some' of the options to your woes. There is also the issues of temperature stability, water movement, aeration, filtration - biological & mechanical, something nasty in the rock you purchased, outside factors (hair spray, bug spray, furniture polish, windex -used near the aquarium).

Sorry for your loss and frustration, but with the details you provided, its impossible for anyone to accurately and correctly determine the cause of your losses.

Dave B

Hey Dave, I really appreciate your answer, I was informed that the qt was only for two weeks, but wanted to keep them for three just to be sure. As I said, I will retain myself from purchasing any other fish for now, throw them in quarantine and leave the tank clean for at least 3 months. I just purchased a uv sterilizer to help up with the cleaning. One question i have for you is, for how long can I have the fishes in qt, and also, if the clownfish and the filefish have not been sick in the dt, is it more wise to leave them there for the next three months since they have what it looks immunity, or do i put them back in qt. Waiting for your answer.
For the filtration i have a standard hang on filter from top fun, i use red reef carbon with just a sponge. I have a powerhead so the water is constantly flowing, i think aggression beetween the clown triggered the ich on the tang. Now the constant clown death could be both due to brookynella and agression, i will proceed to check daily on their health. Still have three clowns alive and kicking, but separated from the aggressive one.

 

[Saul2309]

Hey Dave, I really appreciate your answer, I was informed that the qt was only for two weeks, but wanted to keep them for three just to be sure. As I said, I will retain myself from purchasing any other fish for now, throw them in quarantine and leave the tank clean for at least 3 months. I just purchased a uv sterilizer to help up with the cleaning. One question i have for you is, for how long can I have the fishes in qt, and also, if the clownfish and the filefish have not been sick in the dt, is it more wise to leave them there for the next three months since they have what it looks immunity, or do i put them back in qt. Waiting for your answer.
For the filtration i have a standard hang on filter from top fun, i use red reef carbon with just a sponge. I have a powerhead so the water is constantly flowing, i think aggression beetween the clown triggered the ich on the tang. Now the constant clown death could be both due to brookynella and agression, i will proceed to check daily on their health. Still have three clowns alive and kicking, but separated from the aggressive one.

Also the temp is always stable at 78, i constantly check temperature.

 

[Sharkbait19]

Without knowledge of how the fish died, a fallow and full qt for all of them is the best option. Leaving them in the dt just gives any infection a host to stay alive.

Current Quarantine Protocol

2023 Quarantine Procedures Jay Hemdal David Scarborough Protozoans (Cryptocaryon/ich, Amyloodinium/velvet) and Metazoan trematodes/flukes are by far the most common parasites found on newly acquired fish. A carefully managed quarantine process can effectively eliminate these parasites before...

www.reef2reef.com

As a side note, get rid of 2 of the clowns. Especially in so small a tank, 2 will inevitably pair off and kill the others.

 

[Saul2309]

Without knowledge of how the fish died, a fallow and full qt for all of them is the best option. Leaving them in the dt just gives any infection a host to stay alive.

Current Quarantine Protocol

2023 Quarantine Procedures Jay Hemdal David Scarborough Protozoans (Cryptocaryon/ich, Amyloodinium/velvet) and Metazoan trematodes/flukes are by far the most common parasites found on newly acquired fish. A carefully managed quarantine process can effectively eliminate these parasites before...

www.reef2reef.com

As a side note, get rid of 2 of the clowns. Especially in so small a tank, 2 will inevitably pair off and kill the others.

The other 2 clowns are in a separate 5 gallon and doing well so far, i just have that one alone

 

[Saul2309]

Without knowledge of how the fish died, a fallow and full qt for all of them is the best option. Leaving them in the dt just gives any infection a host to stay alive.

Current Quarantine Protocol

2023 Quarantine Procedures Jay Hemdal David Scarborough Protozoans (Cryptocaryon/ich, Amyloodinium/velvet) and Metazoan trematodes/flukes are by far the most common parasites found on newly acquired fish. A carefully managed quarantine process can effectively eliminate these parasites before...

www.reef2reef.com

As a side note, get rid of 2 of the clowns. Especially in so small a tank, 2 will inevitably pair off and kill the others.

But yeah i will put them in the qt with copper, can I have them for the three months?

 

[Sharkbait19]

But yeah i will put them in the qt with copper, can I have them for the three months?

I have had to do it multiple times due to mistakes I have made. As long as ammonia is kept under control in qt, the fish will be fine.
The only ones at risk would be fish that require mature systems to survive (like mandarin dragonets).

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

That tank can only hold about 4 fish, stop trying to stuff it with so many fish so fast.
Your fish are aggressive and getting disease cause your stuffing too many into a tank that's too small.
You are also selecting poor choices of fish for a 20 gallon.
Sorry to sound negative, but its sad to hear about all these fish deaths that are preventable with a bit of reading before purchase.

 

[Saul2309]

I have had to do it multiple times due to mistakes I have made. As long as ammonia is kept under control in qt, the fish will be fine.
The only ones at risk would be fish that require mature systems to survive (like mandarin dragonets).

Thanks! I appreciate your help!!

 

[Cell]

But yeah i will put them in the qt with copper, can I have them for the three months?

You need to slow down and do a ton of research before subjecting fish to copper treatment.

 

[Saul2309]

I was doing some research yesterday about quarantine, and I have seen people removing their corals and inverts and dosing the whole dt with copper, would that be something that i can do? I have someone who can hold on to my corals and inverts i have a small tank for them, the nem i can hold it in my fish store. Will that be a more effective way to eradicate the parasites??

 

[Sharkbait19]

I was doing some research yesterday about quarantine, and I have seen people removing their corals and inverts and dosing the whole dt with copper, would that be something that i can do? I have someone who can hold on to my corals and inverts i have a small tank for them, the nem i can hold it in my fish store. Will that be a more effective way to eradicate the parasites??

This is not a good way to treat. Rock and sand absorb copper, making dosing difficult to keep at therapeutic level. Furthermore, they will slowly leach out the copper after treatment, making the tank toxic for inverts. It is much safer to treat fish outside of the tank and leave the dt fallow for 60 days.

 

[Saul2309]

This is not a good way to treat. Rock and sand absorb copper, making dosing difficult to keep at therapeutic level. Furthermore, they will slowly leach out the copper after treatment, making the tank toxic for inverts. It is much safer to treat fish outside of the tank and leave the dt fallow for 60 days.

Mmh okay thanks, I appreciate the feedback!

 

[Rmckoy]

I was doing some research yesterday about quarantine, and I have seen people removing their corals and inverts and dosing the whole dt with copper, would that be something that i can do? I have someone who can hold on to my corals and inverts i have a small tank for them, the nem i can hold it in my fish store. Will that be a more effective way to eradicate the parasites??

No !
you would never be able to add corals or inverts to the dt after dosing copper .
the rocks and sand will absorb copper
Making it next to impossible to clean it later

 

[Saul2309]

No !
you would never be able to add corals or inverts to the dt after dosing copper .
the rocks and sand will absorb copper
Making it next to impossible to clean it later

Understood thanks!