Nitrates reading 0.0 - this CANNOT be true - What should do next?!?

[Sniklefritz]

Have a 1 year old 12 gallon nano AIO. Stock list: 3 torches 2-3 heads each, some zoas, a small goni (size of a baseball cut in half when fully extended), and a small acan bout 6 heads. 1 clown, 1 pygmy wasp fish, 1 dart fish, and a mandarin goby.

I'll admit, I've definitely been lazy about maintenance on it for the past few months and it and as a result it has developed some patches of GHA (not a full blown outbreak by any means) and corals aren't looking their greatest. So last night I did a ~50% water change and removed a good amount of the hair algae roughly 80% of it. Some small bits of it left, mostly in the hard to get to areas.

Tonight I decided to dust off the No3 HR and Po4 Hana test kits and came to find out that my No3 is at 0.0 and Po4 is at .08.... Tested No3 with a Salifert kit and its reading 0 as well. I'm SURE the left hover GHA is contributing to this, and I know its not truly 0, I'm just very surprised that after nearly 24 hours after removing the majority of the GHA and doing a feeding today that its showing 0...I really thought my results were going to be atrociously high based off my recent neglect.

What should I do to make this right?!? In a perfect world id like to get my corals looking healthier without making the left over GHA go crazy! I'm not sure how to accomplish that, so hoping someone has gone through something similar and can help guide me on how they handled it.

Should I.....
Shut off the skimmer?
Feed more?
Add something like Red Sea AB+?

I'm not in a panic, just hoping for a bit of guidance for this conundrum. Hopefully from some of you who have gone through this before.

 

[mcarroll]

Have a 1 year old 12 gallon nano AIO. Stock list: 3 torches 2-3 heads each, some zoas, a small goni (size of a baseball cut in half when fully extended), and a small acan bout 6 heads. 1 clown, 1 pygmy wasp fish, 1 dart fish, and a mandarin goby.

I'll admit, I've definitely been lazy about maintenance on it for the past few months and it and as a result it has developed some patches of GHA (not a full blown outbreak by any means) and corals aren't looking their greatest. So last night I did a ~50% water change and removed a good amount of the hair algae roughly 80% of it. Some small bits of it left, mostly in the hard to get to areas.

Tonight I decided to dust off the No3 HR and Po4 Hana test kits and came to find out that my No3 is at 0.0 and Po4 is at .08.... Tested No3 with a Salifert kit and its reading 0 as well. I'm SURE the left hover GHA is contributing to this, and I know its not truly 0, I'm just very surprised that after nearly 24 hours after removing the majority of the GHA and doing a feeding today that its showing 0...I really thought my results were going to be atrociously high based off my recent neglect.

What should I do to make this right?!? In a perfect world id like to get my corals looking healthier without making the left over GHA go crazy! I'm not sure how to accomplish that, so hoping someone has gone through something similar and can help guide me on how they handled it.

Should I.....
Shut off the skimmer?
Feed more?
Add something like Red Sea AB+?

I'm not in a panic, just hoping for a bit of guidance for this conundrum. Hopefully from some of you who have gone through this before.

Test results being wrong because the tests show zero because algae is in the tank is a crazy (il)logic chain the hobby has cooked up.

Unless you're testing incorrectly ot eh kit is broken or expired, the results are correct.

Usually lack of NO3 isn't that big a deal to corals, but if it's indicating more than just NO3 being unavailable, then corals might still have issues. It might be preventing uptake of PO4 if it's really bad....that might account for your "elevated" PO4 level.

Focus in on eliminating the rest of the algae. It will help if you work in small patched so you can be sure it's TOTALLY clean before you move to the next area. Pulling hunks from all over the tank invariably leaves lots of little patches everywhere. Not great to remove at that stage.

Can you detail what's in your CUC? Don't list scavengers like hermits and shrimp. They should be keeping the areas you clean form regrowing algae again....unless they are MIA or too few in numbers. Seems likely you CUC needs an upgrade.

If you're just running a protein skimmer and nothing else for filtration, then just keep doing what you're doing.

Feeding more is good, but do not waste food in the tank....(continue to) only feed what your fish will consume in a minute or so. Then feed more.

 

[Sniklefritz]

Test results being wrong because the tests show zero because algae is in the tank is a crazy (il)logic chain the hobby has cooked up.

Unless you're testing incorrectly ot eh kit is broken or expired, the results are correct.

Usually lack of NO3 isn't that big a deal to corals, but if it's indicating more than just NO3 being unavailable, then corals might still have issues. It might be preventing uptake of PO4 if it's really bad....that might account for your "elevated" PO4 level.

Focus in on eliminating the rest of the algae. It will help if you work in small patched so you can be sure it's TOTALLY clean before you move to the next area. Pulling hunks from all over the tank invariably leaves lots of little patches everywhere. Not great to remove at that stage.

Can you detail what's in your CUC? Don't list scavengers like hermits and shrimp. They should be keeping the areas you clean form regrowing algae again....unless they are MIA or too few in numbers. Seems likely you CUC needs an upgrade.

If you're just running a protein skimmer and nothing else for filtration, then just keep doing what you're doing.

Feeding more is good, but do not waste food in the tank....(continue to) only feed what your fish will consume in a minute or so. Then feed more.

I appreciate your advise!

Your first point is very interesting, I haven't heard that, that was "cooked up" before. Hoping you're right, would make this issue a lot less of a hassle! I was thinking my hana tester could be bad but once I tested with the salifert and the water in the vial was basically perfectly clear it made me think the hana tester could be correct. Have good rapport with my LFS they'll likely let me borrow their hana No3 tester so I can triple check.

As far as CUC I have 4 Astrea and 1 Margarita snail. Was thinking picking up a few trochus snails might be a good idea, maybe get a half dozen or so and return 50% of em or more once things are cleaned up. Definitely open to other suggestions for CUC additives.

And yes, I agree on getting rid of as much algae as I can, even ordered some better tools (tweezer variants) just a minute ago to help me get into those tougher areas.

I'm doing a bunch of research (googling...lol) as well. Looks like some folks with the same issue added aminos to give sustenance to the corals while getting rid of the algae to some success. Not 100% sure I want to do that but a possibility I'm looking into.

 

[CHSUB]

Your no3 test kit lacks resolution to detect low levels. “Zero” no3 is a good thing. For decades no one gave it much attention, now people believe differently with less success and poor results. My tanks almost always test “zero” with Salifert. Don’t do anything different except continue with good maintenance. If you want to feed your corals that makes sense, as I do it daily!
Here is what “zero” no3 looks like with Salifert:

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

IMO your tank is heavily overstocked, and likely the reason you have algae in the first place. In my mind there is no way in the world that the nutrients are zero with that many fish and algae growing,. I would not turn off filtration or cut out water changes or feed more since the tank will feel changes very quickly, its a small tank with too many fish. Adding nutrients or trying to increase the nutrient level will just feed the algae. I would focus on ridding the algae, once the tank is clean again, then focus on parameters. IMO

 

[Peer.Boerner]

Your no3 test kit lacks resolution to detect low levels. “Zero” no3 is a good thing. For decades no one gave it much attention, now people believe differently with less success and poor results. My tanks almost always test “zero” with Salifert. Don’t do anything different except continue with good maintenance. If you want to feed your corals that makes sense, as I do it daily!
Here is what “zero” no3 looks like with Salifert:

Love that!!! Wonderful

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Have a 1 year old 12 gallon nano AIO. Stock list: 3 torches 2-3 heads each, some zoas, a small goni (size of a baseball cut in half when fully extended), and a small acan bout 6 heads. 1 clown, 1 pygmy wasp fish, 1 dart fish, and a mandarin goby.

I'll admit, I've definitely been lazy about maintenance on it for the past few months and it and as a result it has developed some patches of GHA (not a full blown outbreak by any means) and corals aren't looking their greatest. So last night I did a ~50% water change and removed a good amount of the hair algae roughly 80% of it. Some small bits of it left, mostly in the hard to get to areas.

Tonight I decided to dust off the No3 HR and Po4 Hana test kits and came to find out that my No3 is at 0.0 and Po4 is at .08.... Tested No3 with a Salifert kit and its reading 0 as well. I'm SURE the left hover GHA is contributing to this, and I know its not truly 0, I'm just very surprised that after nearly 24 hours after removing the majority of the GHA and doing a feeding today that its showing 0...I really thought my results were going to be atrociously high based off my recent neglect.

What should I do to make this right?!? In a perfect world id like to get my corals looking healthier without making the left over GHA go crazy! I'm not sure how to accomplish that, so hoping someone has gone through something similar and can help guide me on how they handled it.

Should I.....
Shut off the skimmer?
Feed more?
Add something like Red Sea AB+?

I'm not in a panic, just hoping for a bit of guidance for this conundrum. Hopefully from some of you who have gone through this before.

Can you post a picture of the tank?

 

[Sniklefritz]

Can you post a picture of the tank?

The white lights aren't fully up yet but here you go.

 

[Sniklefritz]

Picked up a new Salifert test kit today and when I do the "higher sensitivity" test (looking through the side instead of from the top down) I can see a little bit of color, looks like im at roughly 2-2.5 ppm.

Also grabbed 3 smaller sized astrea snails. Was hoping to find trochus but they didnt have any. Ill keep picking at all the algae I can find.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Seems reasonable. Tank looks good. :)

 

[mcarroll]

As far as CUC I have 4 Astrea and 1 Margarita snail. Was thinking picking up a few trochus snails might be a good idea, maybe get a half dozen or so and return 50% of em or more once things are cleaned up. Definitely open to other suggestions for CUC additives.

Sounds good. I doubt you'll need to return them, but that's a good option to have "just in case".

And yes, I agree on getting rid of as much algae as I can, even ordered some better tools (tweezer variants) just a minute ago to help me get into those tougher areas.

A general cleanup is probably in order too....siphon clean your sand and maybe blast your rocks and sand both to get the remainders stirred up so they can also be removed.

I'm doing a bunch of research (googling...lol) as well. Looks like some folks with the same issue added aminos to give sustenance to the corals while getting rid of the algae to some success. Not 100% sure I want to do that but a possibility I'm looking into.

Aminos are a combined N and C source....tends to be associated with cyano blooms. I wouldn't go that route in this case. If possible just dose nitrates.

Try to focus reading on the old reefkeeping.com and advancedaquarist.com archives. Reefs.org has the AA archive online. Not sure if reefkeeping.com is still online so you might have to hit archive.org's wayback machine for that.

I'd also recommend the "Marine Aquarium Handbook" by Moe if you need a goo book on the topic. (..and who doesn't?)

 

[ogtumblruser]

hmmmm im having the same issue... but im getting that issue due to fluconazole.

but i am noticing your torches??? mine looked like that before i had a huge algae outbreak... where are you getting your RO from? also how's the flesh band at the bases of the torches?

 

[Sniklefritz]

hmmmm im having the same issue... but im getting that issue due to fluconazole.

but i am noticing your torches??? mine looked like that before i had a huge algae outbreak... where are you getting your RO from? also how's the flesh band at the bases of the torches?

Flesh bands look healthy and plump, ive had these torches since start up of the tank, cycled with them in, they've been very hardy for me fortunately.

For RODI I use a BRS 6 stage system that fills a mixing station in my garage, never trusted getting it from a LFS.

 

[Sniklefritz]

Sounds good. I doubt you'll need to return them, but that's a good option to have "just in case".


A general cleanup is probably in order too....siphon clean your sand and maybe blast your rocks and sand both to get the remainders stirred up so they can also be removed.


Aminos are a combined N and C source....tends to be associated with cyano blooms. I wouldn't go that route in this case. If possible just dose nitrates.

Try to focus reading on the old reefkeeping.com and advancedaquarist.com archives. Reefs.org has the AA archive online. Not sure if reefkeeping.com is still online so you might have to hit archive.org's wayback machine for that.

I'd also recommend the "Marine Aquarium Handbook" by Moe if you need a goo book on the topic. (..and who doesn't?)

All solid advise, good to know about the aminos, and yes ive been turkey basting the rocks and sand. Think I might drain the tank a bit and put some peroxide on some of the spots that are tough to get to with tweezers (keeping in mind not to do too much at a time with this tanks size) and I think thatll help the CUC be more enticed to eat up the left overs.

Picked up 7 astrea snails and an emerald crab today, so well just go 1 day at a time and slowly conquer this issue.

Ill take a look at that book you recommend, saw you recommend it to another person who was asking about an electrical issue that I jumped in on since I'm an electrician, and googled it up already last night.

 

[mcarroll]

All solid advise, good to know about the aminos, and yes ive been turkey basting the rocks and sand. Think I might drain the tank a bit and put some peroxide on some of the spots that are tough to get to with tweezers (keeping in mind not to do too much at a time with this tanks size) and I think thatll help the CUC be more enticed to eat up the left overs.

No need to drain it....check the advice on spot-treating in this thread:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/algae-cure-spot-treating-algae-with-peroxide.359887/

Picked up 7 astrea snails and an emerald crab today, so well just go 1 day at a time and slowly conquer this issue.

Nice.

Ill take a look at that book you recommend, saw you recommend it to another person who was asking about an electrical issue that I jumped in on since I'm an electrician, and googled it up already last night.

His Systems and Invertebrates book is great too, but the Handbook is the place to start...see what you think.

 

[JonasRoman]

Have a 1 year old 12 gallon nano AIO. Stock list: 3 torches 2-3 heads each, some zoas, a small goni (size of a baseball cut in half when fully extended), and a small acan bout 6 heads. 1 clown, 1 pygmy wasp fish, 1 dart fish, and a mandarin goby.

I'll admit, I've definitely been lazy about maintenance on it for the past few months and it and as a result it has developed some patches of GHA (not a full blown outbreak by any means) and corals aren't looking their greatest. So last night I did a ~50% water change and removed a good amount of the hair algae roughly 80% of it. Some small bits of it left, mostly in the hard to get to areas.

Tonight I decided to dust off the No3 HR and Po4 Hana test kits and came to find out that my No3 is at 0.0 and Po4 is at .08.... Tested No3 with a Salifert kit and its reading 0 as well. I'm SURE the left hover GHA is contributing to this, and I know its not truly 0, I'm just very surprised that after nearly 24 hours after removing the majority of the GHA and doing a feeding today that its showing 0...I really thought my results were going to be atrociously high based off my recent neglect.

What should I do to make this right?!? In a perfect world id like to get my corals looking healthier without making the left over GHA go crazy! I'm not sure how to accomplish that, so hoping someone has gone through something similar and can help guide me on how they handled it.

Should I.....
Shut off the skimmer?
Feed more?
Add something like Red Sea AB+?

I'm not in a panic, just hoping for a bit of guidance for this conundrum. Hopefully from some of you who have gone through this before.

Not strange as algue have probably consumed no3. And no3 will not for sure raise as it must first be "created " from the organic/food you add.
If nitrate stays low despite you removed a lot of algue=denitrification works fine=you should be happy. A coral (read the zooxanthelle) doesnt need no3 in first place but ammonium, so its not for sure they lack nitrogen just because no3 happens to be low.
If your corals look pale but po4 is not deficient=could be N deficiency. Then feed corals and fish more. And maybe consider a small dose of urea or ammonium for the corals.

Have you a sand bed? If you have, a lot of no3 is processed there and explains why your denitrification is good. But as I said, the algue also explains as it consumes no3. So keep an eye on no3 so it doesnt increase too much when algue is removed.

Jonas