NUKE it or let it eventually kill everything?

[Boomer52]

I am in the process of nuking my 80 gal. reef now. My posts from months ago told of my outbreak of neomeris annulata and what I have tried to rid the tank of it. Since my last post I have tried several other things to starve, kill or control it and nothing has worked. It is even growing on the stony parts of the few corals I have. All that is left is the nuclear option. Not the fish. They will go into quarantine (kind of like us) until I know they are not carriers of spores from possibly eating some of it.

All rocks are in the process of being boiled (outside in the turkey fryer). They will then be baked in the oven just to be sure. All sand will be removed and later replaced with new sand. The tank and sump will be drained and refilled with tap water and two gallons of bleach. I plan on letting the system, read that all reactors, skimmer, chiller, everything water touches, run for two or more days with the bleach and then drain and refill several times to get the chlorine out. Clean the tank, sump and all equipment and set it up as a new tank.

The problem with the neomeris annulata is it is starting to grow on my probe holders and return bulkheads. I am hoping the bleach kills any remaining spores or remnants. This stuff is ridiculous.

I hope this works.

 

[Nadir]

Tank 1- 300 gallon water volume
Tank 2 - 85 gallon water volume
Sump 95 gallons water volume in a 150 gallon sump size
Had a Display refugium, removed it for it was not easy to maintain and looked dirty.

In January I got back from Holiday after a 45 days, I came back to a tank with a ton of hair algae and with over 500 gallons of water volume, tearing the tank down was not in the cards at that time.

- My first step was to use a syringe with a fine needle and use H2O2 spraying the algae for over 10 days, this help burn the strands that were fine, difficult to manually remove it by hand.
In areas where I could not reach, the H2O2, helped me burn the algae. Used filter floss to catch the loose debris.

- The second step was to use fluconazole treatment. I was lucky that I had pick up 50 tables of 200mG from Thailand when I was there for $10.00, Wish I had pick more up. This treatment went for 6 days, with H2O2 treatment too.

- The third step was to turn the skimmer, and that made the skimmer over flow, That was great for water change.
As the skim was wet and over flowing, I replace the tank with fresh made water, which I filled in the Display. This took over 4-5 hours to replace the water I lost in the wet skim.
The skimmer stabilized, only putting out dry skim, but still putting out quite a bit of skim, white, frothy but clean.
By the end of the day everything stabilized. By this time I had replaced over 60 gallons of water.

- Now with the skimmer hardly pulling any skim, still white but dry, it was to take readings of the Nitrates and Phosphates. They were high! P04 at 1.83 and nitrates over 120, even with the water changes.

- The fourth step was to reduce the nutrients, this was done with Brightwell Phosphate E and a mixture of Sugar/Vinegar/ Vodka mix. This mix was made with 10 ounces of Vodka, 3 tables spoons of sugar and 30 ounces of Vinegar and about a litre of water, concentrated, made i a jug to be used over a month.
Two separate containers were used as you see in the video.

The VSV mix went into the tank in the water overflow, at the rate of 20 drops/minute, the mix was 200 mLs of the concentrate, topped of with RODI water in the Jug.

The Phosphate E mix was made of 50mLS topped of with RODI waster and this was dripped at 30 drips/minute directly in to skimmer VIA the air intake of the skimmer. This is what you see in the video.

This lasted for a month, slowly, the skimmer now after 2-3 days produced dark green, brown sludge, dry skim slowly but certain days was heavy but not enough to worry, the waste went into a 5 gallon oil jug that I had, this need to be emptied every week, fowl smelling and thick.

- The fifth step was to take reading every 3-5 days, this was to help adjust the drips of wither the PO4 and the Nitrates, as not to strip the tank fast. When the reading went to 0.5 for Phosphates and 60 for the Nitrates, the container for the Phosphate E was discontinued as that jug ran empty.

Now I run the VSV solution, diluting it every time I had to refill the jug, taking the readings as I went along, adjusting the mix and the drips

As of last week, the PO4 reading are at 0.02 and the Nitrates are at 10-20 and still dropping, as I still use a maintenance dosing of VSV mix, but now in the 1 Gallon jug you see, I use 2 Tablespoon of sugar, 4 ounces of Vodka, and 16 ounces of Vinegar, dripping into the tank at the Rate of 1 drip every 6-8 seconds and that jug lasts me close to 5-7 days as the drip is adjusted with the reading taken every week.

I did not have to tear the tank down, took time to rid of all the algae, the rock are still slightly green, and getting better as days go by, did not have to worry about the parameters being dropped down fast. took time to do so but being housebound with COVID, there was plenty of time to monitor the tanks and take reading every 2-3 days, learning how to dose the tank slowly.

Now that go on holidays, if there is one in the near future with COVID, I am slowly perfecting the dose of VSV, for dripping into the tank.


Skimmer SRO Reef octopus 6000 external Skimmer, for I don't have the patience to worry about the water level fluctuations, and it has a variable pump feed, this it to make sure I don't over strip the water as the feed can be adjusted from 800 gallons/hour to 1300 gallons/ hour as to adjust the flow into the skimmer for heavy or light skimming, Just have adjust the knob for the water exiting the skimmer.

Guidance and Feedback appreciated.

Dropbox - File Deleted - Simplify your life

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Could not upload the videos, use the link

 

[jdstank]

I can't hardly reach in the tank to flip over a wayward snail without breaking a coral. Trying to get algae out quickly by manual removal would be like nuking the tank one broken coral at a time!

Here’s what I do, it let’s you be very tactical rather than fumbling fingers in the tank. Python with a pipette attached. Also creates great suction with the reduced tip size vs a standard python tube or the gravel attachment.

I shove the other end of the siphon tube into a filter sock in my sump and collect any detritus, algae and other assorted gunk there for immediate removal when done. It’s a lot easier than using buckets and having to put the water back into the tank.

 

[Someshmuk]

Surgery doesn't solve obesity. A healthy, properly portioned diet and consistent exercise is. It isn't really about killing algae, but building proper systems and regiments that strengthen your tank against algae.

Although, more power to you if it makes you feel more in control and on top of the situation.

 

[Gareth elliott]

Ok so i didnt nuke my tank. But did make some corals unhappy for a short period of time. Did lose a single acropora.

Premise:
Had a dinoflagellate that was not responding to uv or lowered nutrients. Decided to try something based on readings on an unrelated field for an antibiotic I already had on hand. The study was how clindamyicin destroys the apicoplasts of the parasite. My brain said wait most researchers point to a brown algae source for malaria apicoplasts. Dinoflagellates have these plastids, could dosing clindamyicin kill dinos?

Experiment:
Added a single dose of 15mg per gallon and
monitored the progress each day. Took off skimmer cup and removed all carbon.

Results:
Was not immediate, took several days to see any effect. But by day 15-26 each day there was less and less dinoflagellates. Week 3 there was a random increase in another species as the initial plague species died off. By week 4 i had no visual dinoflagellates in the aquarium.

the side effects:
Corals also contain dinoflagellates! Day 16 began to see some stony corals bleach. By day 60 all but one had recovered an acropora accelus. This colony did perish eventually. Had debated testing again with lower but more often doses of around 6mg per gallon. But self inflicting dinoflagellates was something I havent decided to try. Have also wondered if there was efficacy with disease causing dinoflagellates, like velvet. But i have not wished to put fish through that, as if it fails they would most likely perish.

 

[Backreefing]

I have had algae problems in the past . But no never nuke . Now my CUC handles the inside, and every few days I magnet swipe the glass . It’s easy for me now .

 

[Jose A Venereo]

IMO. Extremes in this hobby are not good. As a veterinarian, I approach my aquariums, like I approach a patient with a curable/treatable condition. First find the cause/s of the problem. Then take adequate steps to correct the problem. Any drastic decision, typically lead to a disaster. Also, don't expect any good thing to happen fast. In addition, often times we fail to consult with more experienced hobbyists.

 

[fishface NJ]

I did nuke my tank and rocks with bleach when I had dino. I removed all my corals and fish to QT

 

[drblakjak55]

Voted No. First why do you think the problem won’t just return when you start back up. For GHA and Bryopsis (which nothing in the world eats) you have to get to basics. Algae has to live on something so it eats all the crap that collects in the rock crevices. It becomes the soil. If you have bad algae stiff brush it off the rocks than turkey baste until nothing coming out of cracks. Three days later will have 30% regrowth. Do it again. You’ll see less and less each time until the right stuff is growing in the cracks and weekly turkey basting keeps it away. encourage the ecosystem

 

[drblakjak55]

There’s always a Sea Hare.

 

[Lambo82]

I recently nuked my tank with Vibrant in attempt to rid of bubble algae. Vibrant definitely worked but I lost most of my SPS and a few LPS in the process. Lesson learned!

 

[taricha]

I suppose I have strong feelings on this one.
IMO, people too often willingly treat systems with knowingly harmful/risky things with the hopes of getting rid of something that may not actually be harmful. It may just be annoying and unsightly.
I'm a big fan of ID and name-your-pest, but often people make perplexing choices with that info.
I think for some cases, corals would survive better if we just called it "the uglies" and shrugged it off.

For young tanks I think that should be an absolute rule. Tank less than 3 months old, no matter what it is - you must simply call it "the uglies" and let it ride, or suck some out if you must.

 

[DHill6]

Here’s what I do, it let’s you be very tactical rather than fumbling fingers in the tank. Python with a pipette attached. Also creates great suction with the reduced tip size vs a standard python tube or the gravel attachment.

I shove the other end of the siphon tube into a filter sock in my sump and collect any detritus, algae and other assorted gunk there for immediate removal when done. It’s a lot easier than using buckets and having to put the water back into the tank.

Where did you get the big pipette from and what size is that tubing?

 

[Robzreef369]

NUKE may be a strong term but it's what I'm calling it.

Have you ever battled algae so much and so long that nothing and I mean nothing has worked besides an all out onslaught that may hurt or even kill coral? Let me refer to this as "nuking" your tank. By that I mean using whatever means necessary to eliminate the algae.

In my case I think I have recently done that and have lost most of my acropora. The relentless hair algae had already smothered several acros and it was either pull out all the stops or let the algae KILL EVERYTHING! For me I'm finally beating the hair algae and it's white and almost gone from most places. The frag tank is almost 90% clear now and the main display about 75% clear.

What did I do? I made a cocktail of Reef Flux, Vibrant and GFO and hit it hard. I still have a few acro colonies that look to be doing fine and my other corals show no signs of distress so nuking may be a strong term but let's think about it. If you try every natural means necessary to remove algae, to no avail, do you continue to just let your tank turn into a swamp and kill everything or do you take extreme measures to save what you can? Let's talk about that today!

1. Would you take drastic measures to kill algae even if it means killing coral?

2. Have you ever had to "NUKE" your tank to save it?

In March I was in the hospital for 9 days and my 60gal. Cube was in the beginning stages of a Dino bloom before I went in. It was an emergency trip so the tank was basically left in limbo for over a week with the wife and daughter only filling the 5gal. Topoff container. When I got home I was welcomed to the worst Dino bloom I've ever seen totally covering the sand, rock & some corals. Tank is just over a year old with some nice encrusting Montis and lps & sps a nice mixed reef. So I started with chemiclean thinking it was cyano bacteria which it was not. Nothing happened skimmer went nuts and did the water changes etc. Came back worse then ever so I knew it was dyanos after reading more and did a 48hr. No lights after sucking out all I could and dosed with 10ml. H202 twice daily. It worked for about 4 days and started to return. I then did another round of h202 same strength and totally covered the tank from all light using paper bags from Winco and masking tape. This time did 72 hrs. now fast forward 3 weeks and the tank is back to normal. Only lost coral was a nice ORA birdsnest that got consumed by the dyano slime and bleached out. So yes sometimes you have to let's just say NUKE your tank when all else fails. I attribute the dyano bloom to the addition in January of a yellow coris wrasse who in short order ate every bristleworm and mini brittle star of which I had hundreds. They were a major cleanup crew and as he singlefishedly wiped them out my tank started to change. Here's some shots of the tank now on a strong comeback.
Morale of the story never give up. I was close to throwing in the towel but only being a year into this current tank I had to put my nose to the grindstone and battle with everything I could throw at it. P.S. I also added a 20 watt uv sterilizer after the last blackout period h202 treatment.
Cheers reefers

 

[Josh_boss]

I have had a few algae problems in the past green from bubble, bry, hair a pretty wide variety. I have got all of them under control by dosing 20-40mg/gallon of Fluconazole/ ketoconazole and never had a issue with coral or fish or invert loss. Actually didn’t even mess up my skimmer lol. It worked all the times I have tried it. I’ve tested with a lot of different products to kill algae and I had the best results with that meds. I voted no to nuking the tank lol

 

[KenO]

I had three tanks and all three were infested with blue clove polyps. If anyone has had them you know the are like the borg. Resistance is futile. They act as one organism and take over everything. I had two options, option one was remove everything and put them in QT because if one of these polyps was to escape it would take over and assimilate the new tanks. Option two was nuke the tanks with I think it was Fendbendazole. I decided that was going to be my course of action. Was it a hard decision, you bet. In the end it was worth it, absolutely. The BCP’s died quickly, but there was a symptom I did not anticipate. The meds were absorbed into the rocks. My Xenia, snails and shrimp were the major casualties and I couldn’t add any back in until the med was out of the system. Xenia was my canary in the coal mine. I would add a piece and if the med was still present it would die within hours. It took months before my tanks were cleared of the meds. I did multiple full tank WC’s and went through a lot of carbon.

 

[WallyB]

If one has to resort to Nuking a Tank to get rid of a relentless Algae problem. Why Hurt Corals (They resist Algae, and have no algae on them...ROCKS DO)

Instead.... NUKE THE ROCKS, or SCRUB THE ROCKS.

Remove the Sensitive Corals (like Acros), if Nuking Rocks in Tank.

 

[phatduckk]

I poured a cup of bleach in my 10g cube the other day because the algae was out of control.

felt great. Highly recommend it

 

[Nathan80]

I voted ‘other’ as I kind of did and kind of didn’t all at once. I had a bad dinos outbreak and couldn’t get it under control (I’m fortunate - I have 4 other tanks), so I stripped everything coral wise out of another really mature system and moved it to the other 3 tanks (I left the fish and CuC in). This was the first time I’ve not been able to treat dinos and get rid of it without drastic measures.

Took all coral out of the tank with dinos, stripped all plugs off where I could and everything went into first a 30min lugols dip then a 30 mins Witch Hazel dip, then into The mature tank (dips were done in freshly mixed salt water).

Fish and inverts were then also moved to the other 2 tanks.

Rock went into a bucket of bleach and the sand and water in the bin/down the drain respectively, everything in the tank was soaked in citric acid to clean it properly and then allowed to air dry.

I saw no sign of dinos for about 3 weeks and then it started back a little bit (this was about 5 weeks ago), its still there a very little bit but seems to be on the Small chunks of rock that came over such as the GSP, on the base of the torches that came over etc - the rock that has been in the tank for ages and is really mature it doesn’t seem to be able to get a grip on.

I’m bubble scrubbing overnight with a CO2 scrubber as well, have changed the UV bulb and slowed the flow right down, added an additional ALR algae reactor and I’m dosing H2O2, live rock enhance, reef enhance as well as every few days a bit of ATM colony. Slowly but surely the dinos is receding.

The only piece of coral that has really sulked (annoyingly) is my gold torch - I suspect I’m gonna lose it, but all in all if that’s all I lose I’ll take it this time

With the above as I say you could argue I did or didn’t nuke the tank depending on how you look at it

I’m convinced a lot of dinos is to do with the maturity of the tank and that a lot of rock nowadays is not real reef rock (which is a good thing as its more sustainable), but it doesn’t have all the good in in that live rock used to have and it takes I’d say up to a couple of years for that goodness to properly propagate and mature. I’ve only ever had Dinos in relatively new tanks - more mature systems don’t seem to get it for me (That may just be personal experience)

I’ve also had a major GHA outbreak quite a while back that I couldn’t figure out as test readings were coming in fine bizarrely - I eventually hit that with FluxRX, problem went away in about 2 weeks.

The only other major outbreak I’ve had was bubble algae and that was dealt with pretty quickly by Vibrant.

 

[ycnibrc]

I'm an old reefer and I can't remembered back in the day that we used real live rock from the ocean and algae problem. Now adays tank crash and algae are the norm may be lacking of beneficial bacteria and microorganisms are the cause because of dry rock instead of real live rock.