Opinion/rant: Sump designs are overcomplicated

[JoJosReef]

I can't fathom that people put them in their clothes washer... or some in the dishwasher. :face-with-spiral-eyes:

 

[twentyleagues]

I can't fathom that people put them in their clothes washer... or some in the dishwasher. :face-with-spiral-eyes:

This is me! not the dishwasher! Lots of bleach on the first wash a second wash with nothing but water and air dry for at least a day. I run a wash cycle after the socks are out with bleach to help make sure its clean. I still use socks on my fresh water tanks. Slowly getting rid of most of the freshwater fish though soon to be sockless!!!! The tank I am designing for the fw I keep will have a bog filter. A couple already do but this is going to be around 500g plywood build. Still debating if I want to do it like an aio or overhead "sump".

 

[BeanAnimal]

This is me! not the dishwasher! Lots of bleach on the first wash a second wash with nothing but water and air dry for at least a day. I run a wash cycle after the socks are out with bleach to help make sure its clean.

So three washer cycles to wash one set of dirty filter socks? The cost of the water, electricity. wear on the washer and dryer... wow :zany-face:

If I did use socks, I would have a bucket and small filtered pump and spray wand. Bleach water, inside out and done. Hang to dry. Still too much trouble... so no socks. On the rare occasion that I use them, I do hand wash and bleach at that point they could go in with the cleaning towels and rags I suppose, but I see no need.

 

[twentyleagues]

So three washer cycles to wash one set of dirty filter socks? The cost of the water, electricity. wear on the washer and dryer... wow :zany-face:

If I did use socks, I would have a bucket and small filtered pump and spray wand. Bleach water, inside out and done. Hang to dry. Still too much trouble... so no socks. On the rare occasion that I use them, I do hand wash and bleach at that point they could go in with the cleaning towels and rags I suppose, but I see no need.

So I have 20 4" socks and 12 7" socks. I dont wash just a few. They also sit in a tote of bleach water until I do wash them. No dryer used they hang dry. I use 4 4" on my 2 125g and 2 7" on my 300g pond, It works out to be about 5 weeks in between washes. Dont get me wrong I hate socks and dealing with them. I always have. The bank of 10gs are hamburg mattenfilters there are 10 of them super easy and all are planted. The 40b and 75g are bog filters also super easy and of course the bog is planted.

 

[mikst]

The point of coral snow is as a floculant to bind particles in the water colomn. They then need to be collected by filter socks or floss.

Ok, got it,flocculant. I thought coral snow was used as a way to make the doc more available for the corals? I mean if you're just using it as a flocculant , could just use powdered calcium carbonate. Works wonders

 

[BeanAnimal]

So I have 20 4" socks and 12 7" socks. I dont wash just a few. They also sit in a tote of bleach water until I do wash them. No dryer used they hang dry. I use 4 4" on my 2 125g and 2 7" on my 300g pond, It works out to be about 5 weeks in between washes. Dont get me wrong I hate socks and dealing with them. I always have. The bank of 10gs are hamburg mattenfilters there are 10 of them super easy and all are planted. The 40b and 75g are bog filters also super easy and of course the bog is planted.

I would be at the local laundromat once a week then. Though, for reasons just like that... I wouldn't wash my clothes at a laundromat....

 

[Slocke]

Ok, got it,flocculant. I thought coral snow was used as a way to make the doc more available for the corals? I mean if you're just using it as a flocculant , could just use powdered calcium carbonate. Works wonders

That’s exactly what coral snow is

 

[Tamberav]

I can't fathom that people put them in their clothes washer... or some in the dishwasher. :face-with-spiral-eyes:

haha, well people wash cloth diapers in their washer...

and theres rodent poop in peanut butter, chocolate, flour... just about everything we eat processed...

when clothing was tested at a department store it contained lots of bacteria and fecal matter... I guess lots of gross people trying on clothing.

Ya I bought of one those gross fact books... :eek: :p

 

[Tamberav]

I hear mesh socks are easy to clean? Don't catch as much but don't clog and you just spray them with a hose and return to the tank. I was thinking about trying those.

 

[TangerineSpeedo]

True. Isn’t that why people don’t use canister filters in saltwater.

It's because people do not know how t use a canister filter properly in a saltwater system. My best tank, I used a canister filter to run a chiller. I just had very course media in it (sponge/ceramic tubes). I would only clean it with the water would crawl to a stop. (6-10 months)
So essentially I created a denitrifier and a cryptic sump combined... Your live rock handles all your other stuff.
Never had to clean the glass on that tank...
But nobody wants to hear that malarkey....
"Canister filters don't work... Whaaa Whaaa! ":loudly-crying-face::loudly-crying-face::loudly-crying-face::rolling-on-the-floor-laughing:

 

[BeanAnimal]

They work just fine. I don’t want to take them apart and clean them.

Honestly, If I were to want mechanical filtration I would run one or two large penguin HOBs in the sump. Just swap media, no draining, no mess…. Or a DIY box of similar design.

 

[mikst]

They work just fine. I don’t want to take them apart and clean them.

Honestly, If I were to want mechanical filtration I would run one or two large penguin HOBs in the sump. Just swap media, no draining, no mess…. Or a DIY box of similar design.

Ooh that's a neat idea! I'm not a mechanical filter guy, but that's cool for those that are. Cheapo filter foam and just rinse out when gunky

 

[mikst]

That’s exactly what coral snow is

OK, so if you're trying to use a flocculant to make doc available for the corals, why would you then use a filter sock to take it out? Similar to feeding heavily on the fish and then trying to scoop up the excess they don't eat?

 

[Slocke]

OK, so if you're trying to use a flocculant to make doc available for the corals, why would you then use a filter sock to take it out? Similar to feeding heavily on the fish and then trying to scoop up the excess they don't eat?

People use it for water clarity and to stop certain algae’s
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/extreme-water-clarity-and-cyano-eradication-made-easy.916381/

 

[mikst]

People use it for water clarity and to stop certain algae’s
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/extreme-water-clarity-and-cyano-eradication-made-easy.916381/

Gotcha. I use a calcium carbonate solution as a flocculant for clarity in my fw tanks as well as boosting hardness. It's quite effective. Thanks for the additional link for a different formula.

 

[Cichlid Dad]

haha, well people wash cloth diapers in their washer...

and theres rodent poop in peanut butter, chocolate, flour... just about everything we eat processed...

when clothing was tested at a department store it contained lots of bacteria and fecal matter... I guess lots of gross people trying on clothing.

Ya I bought of one those gross fact books... :eek: :p

That's way to much information!

:rolleyes:

 

[Cichlid Dad]

So while this fine conversation was happening, I just finished the plumbing on my new - used 120 4ft and am putting together the refugium only with a skimmer sump. Pictures soon. I replaced all of the filters in the RODI unit and have run 60 gallons through so I will start with great water. It's not too late @Slocke for you to change back! Just saying.... LOL :rolleyes:

 

[Slocke]

So while this fine conversation was happening, I just finished the plumbing on my new - used 120 4ft and am putting together the refugium only with a skimmer sump. Pictures soon. I replaced all of the filters in the RODI unit and have run 60 gallons through so I will start with great water. It's not too late @Slocke for you to change back! Just saying.... LOL :rolleyes:

Maybe someday. I want to see if I can get things under control with carbon dosing. I may well ditch the filter socks though that would cause a new issue that I just realized which is how loud the sump is without the socks.


For my next thread I want to do a compare and contrast of my old setup vs new. Basically a cheap aqueon/top fin tank vs a Red Sea eaque tank. Should be fun!

 

[Cichlid Dad]

Maybe someday. I want to see if I can get things under control with carbon dosing. I may well ditch the filter socks though that would cause a new issue that I just realized which is how loud the sump is without the socks.


For my next thread I want to do a compare and contrast of my old setup vs new. Basically a cheap aqueon/top fin tank vs a Red Sea eaque tank. Should be fun!

That is a very good idea! I love this hobby, we never stop learning and moving forward. Please tag me when you get the post going so I can follow along. Good luck and happy reefing

 

[VintageReefer]

IMO the perfect sump is the Trigger Systems Ruby product line. Good features, good layout, not overly complex, but not barebones

The first chamber is the water entry and it’s big enough to hold a skimmer I have a Diablo 160xs in there, but I don’t use it currently. The rest of the space is filled with live rock

The second compartment I ran as a cheato fuge in a prior system years ago. It’s pretty large compared to these undersized fuges companies try to squeeze in. Grew lots of cheato

But on my current setup i use an algae scrubber and made this a cryptic zone

With cabinet shut it looks like this

But open you see

That live rock has yellow, blue, and purple sponge growing all over it, but more on the bottom than the top. The live rock was purchased about 12 - 14 years ago and has been in my systems since day 1. It’s caked in coraline. It’s authentic Fiji, pukani, and tonga rock. It’s also in chamber 1 and under the floating scrubber

Chamber 3 is the return and I have a reactor connected but not in use, just parked there in case I need to run media for any reason. It also has live rock in it. And lots of mulm

This sump also has media shelves that forces all water through the media, and build in probe holders in chamber 1

Since my harlequin died I now also have 2 chocolate chip stars that wander around the compartments