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Not all ATO's are as safe and reliable as the Tunze 3155 with optical and float sensors. I don't remember offhand if the Neptune ATO is any good.
Opinions please, What do I need next?
- Thread starter JK75gal
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OP
OP
Thank you! Yes, trying to do research Rather than find out I made a mistake later.
OP
OP
Thank you so much for the detail! Can't wait to start getting some more life going in this tank.
OP
OP
This past weekend with the new Hanna ALK and Nitrate
See attached PDF for my tank parameters and fluctuation from start to current.
Testing weekly through 2023 with API reef test kit. I was checking everything every time now I am going to look to some of the posts i have seen related to how often to test what and follow that method. I don't have it handy but it was similar to test this weekly this bi weekly and so on. I did a 10% water change Sunday (75gal tank) and will test again tomorrow if I can or this coming weekend.
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So, you don't have a sump and are using a canister filter instead? If that's true, will a skimmer provide more filtration than what you currently experience? If you decide to pursue a skimmer, will you use a "hang off the back" model, or will you go whole hog with a sump. That would be a significant move from where you are now, so the question becomes "will you be better off with a sump rather than a canister?"
OP
OP
No, I do not have a sump - Yet. Still doing reseach on the skimmer. Maybe halfhog since I have room in the cabinet if there is a way to use a small tank and skimmer?? As you can guess I am still not where I need to be knowledge wise. I like the canister, the tank looks good I am still trying to fully understand "stable" and what it means in general as well as in my tank with Red Sea salt and RODI water. One year in and really wanted to go further with corals (as you can see the tank is pretty bare) but am hesitant until I figure this all out. So would I be better off going the sump route? Simply put, not sure. I do however think that most likely a hang on back skimmer if directed by the masses initially.
OP
OP
On youtube now looking at ATO and Dosing might as well add this to the list.
thank you very much for the suggestion.
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A sump isn't necessary for success. It gives you more space for equipment and hides it from plain sight leaving the display clutter free.
Canisters aren't popular because they can be tedious to clean and maintain. A HOB filter like an Aquaclear 110 would serve a similar function and easier to maintain.
Stable refers to many things. Basically you pick your target levels and you strive to maintain those levels with extreme consistency. If your desired temp is 78.6, then you want it 78.6 24/7. Alkalinity, calcium, nitrate and phosphate should be all tested every 1-3 days for awhile to understand the rate your tank is consuming/producing them.
I wouldn't worry about dosing quite yet. Weekly water changes can suffice if you have few corals.
Canisters aren't popular because they can be tedious to clean and maintain. A HOB filter like an Aquaclear 110 would serve a similar function and easier to maintain.
Stable refers to many things. Basically you pick your target levels and you strive to maintain those levels with extreme consistency. If your desired temp is 78.6, then you want it 78.6 24/7. Alkalinity, calcium, nitrate and phosphate should be all tested every 1-3 days for awhile to understand the rate your tank is consuming/producing them.
I wouldn't worry about dosing quite yet. Weekly water changes can suffice if you have few corals.
OP
OP
That all makes sense, thank you. For the longest time I was testing and trying to find what the parameters were supposed to be. Getting frustrated all the while everyone had different numbers they were going for. As you can see I don't mind making fun of myself, it's a learning experience right
I have to say though the R2R family has been very helpful and kind oh, and patient lol
twentyleagues
Valuable Member
The reason I asked about your test regimen and what you used was to see if something along the lines of testers for your next "upgrade". I dont mind api (some people hate them) I find them adequate especially in cases like yours. As long as you do the tests properly they are fine. Obviously, Hannah are superior being more precise. As you get into more corals you may want to pick up better tests but honestly what you have works.
You may want to up your water change game a bit that nitrate is kinda high. Although in my previous reef life I had 2- 300g stock tanks that had quite a few large nonreef safe fish that produced a lot of nitrate and phosphate. For a good long while my nitrate was 25-50 and phosphate showed up on api tests so high also. For a couple years I was changing out 200g a month to keep the numbers in that range. I had a mixed reef attached then went to two reef tanks one lps and softies the other was sps. Some corals did fine others grew but were not pretty. A lot more water changes and system "upgrades" happened to get into "normal" numbers. You may want to look in to hob fuges or algae turf scrubbers to keep water changes down. They say skimmers dont remove nitrate or phosphate and they dont directly, but they do pull out stuff that hasn't been broken down yet. I upgraded skimmers got very lucky and had a custom built 6' tall skimmer for pretty much cost. I added a large display fuge. A 90g tank with an 8" deep sand bed (wasn't for that but plans fell through) and a very large bio pellet reactor. I am trying to stay on the sane side of this hobby (if there is one) this time.
Reef tanks can be run on all kinds of filtration hob, can, under gravel filters, sponge, but imo sumps are the way to go. Since your tank isn't drilled and you haven't gone coral crazy ( kudos to you btw you must have iron will) what you have will work. Upgrades may be needed for some of the tougher corals.
You may want to up your water change game a bit that nitrate is kinda high. Although in my previous reef life I had 2- 300g stock tanks that had quite a few large nonreef safe fish that produced a lot of nitrate and phosphate. For a good long while my nitrate was 25-50 and phosphate showed up on api tests so high also. For a couple years I was changing out 200g a month to keep the numbers in that range. I had a mixed reef attached then went to two reef tanks one lps and softies the other was sps. Some corals did fine others grew but were not pretty. A lot more water changes and system "upgrades" happened to get into "normal" numbers. You may want to look in to hob fuges or algae turf scrubbers to keep water changes down. They say skimmers dont remove nitrate or phosphate and they dont directly, but they do pull out stuff that hasn't been broken down yet. I upgraded skimmers got very lucky and had a custom built 6' tall skimmer for pretty much cost. I added a large display fuge. A 90g tank with an 8" deep sand bed (wasn't for that but plans fell through) and a very large bio pellet reactor. I am trying to stay on the sane side of this hobby (if there is one) this time.
Reef tanks can be run on all kinds of filtration hob, can, under gravel filters, sponge, but imo sumps are the way to go. Since your tank isn't drilled and you haven't gone coral crazy ( kudos to you btw you must have iron will) what you have will work. Upgrades may be needed for some of the tougher corals.
The size of your tank is probably the largest I would personally consider NOT using a skimmer and a sump. My tank is 125 gallons, and the skimmer is really effective. I have not used a hang-on skimmer so I can't compare to what I have. Sumps are very expensive as you will see when you research. I enjoy DIY projects, so I saved a bunch by building my own using a 29-gallon Aqueon aquarium special. Total cost before return pump and plumbing connections to the DT was $50. If I had built my stand differently, I would have used a 40-gallon breeder tank.
OP
OP
Appreciate the detail, yes this hobby is expensive
I have no concerns with building my own as well if it comes to that.
OP
OP
I have to agreee on the API statement, I perform the tests the same exact way everytime. Clean the cuvets rinse with RODI store upside down in glass with paper towels then dip them in the tank prior to testing. Even if the readings are off I will get the same results each time. Honestly, during the first few months I didn't even know what I was actually testing for, embarrasing maybe but I jumped in without research and still learning as I go. Now that I am a year in, absolutly wish I did this years ago!! Now looking to get more accurate results I did purchase two Hanna checkers (ALK and Nitrate) so far. After thinking about it probably looking at returning them and just going for the full on Hanna kit, 450 is alot but I think it is worth it since just the two came to about 130. Cost benefit analysis say so
I do want to bring the Nitrates down a bit did a 5 GAL water change and will test tomorrow. I agree with others who have stated that if the tank looks good... but, I would like to start looking at nice corals and I think that the nitrates being so high might not be best practices for starting my coral collection. Of course, still stressing over pulling the trigger until I feel more comfortable in the hobby.
Thank you for the conversations these help so much more than you all know!
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Ideal parameters are really a range. It's best to try and find a salt that is near your chosen parameters or with levels lower than desired so you can supplement to your desired level.
TehBrainz
Well-Known Member
A good way to knock that nitrate down is to schedule some rather large WC's with water as close to your current parameters as possible (temperature, pH, Salinity, Alk)
When I had my 75g, I used a brute trash can on casters that I mixed my new SW in and wheeled it to the tank. Used a pump to get 90% into the tank before having to lift the bucket up for the last 10% (this was the worst, but still easy-ish, part).
My recommendation would be to do 30-50% WC, wait a week, test, do another a 30-50%, rinse and repeat until you get to where you want to be.
@Randy Holmes-Farley has a very good write-up on the effects of water changes with the various methods on contaminants like nitrate as well as frequency effects. At the end of the day it's a dilution problem while the tank is generating the nitrate as well.
When I had my 75g, I used a brute trash can on casters that I mixed my new SW in and wheeled it to the tank. Used a pump to get 90% into the tank before having to lift the bucket up for the last 10% (this was the worst, but still easy-ish, part).
My recommendation would be to do 30-50% WC, wait a week, test, do another a 30-50%, rinse and repeat until you get to where you want to be.
@Randy Holmes-Farley has a very good write-up on the effects of water changes with the various methods on contaminants like nitrate as well as frequency effects. At the end of the day it's a dilution problem while the tank is generating the nitrate as well.
OP
OP
Thank you, using Red Sea mixed reef 8kh, CA 430 MAG 1310. Tank seems to be clear of the hair algea mess now just waiting for the parameters to be somewhat consistant. Whatever that ends up being.
Thankfully, I have plenty of patience, this hobby requires it and I had no idea how much. One checkbox for me..
OP
OP
Thank you for the advice, I started down that exact path yesterday only with a 5 GAL change as I am not aware of how much to do at a time. (should have waited for your reply) I figured that would let me know if indeed it makes any difference. I was planning on giving it two days prior to testing. Keep in mind reason is I have to make decisions that I feel won't ruin what I have done so far (to be honest all I have done is kept 1 sail tang and 2 clowns alive) but they are living animals. And the GSP I have heard could stay alive in my backyard if it wanted.
I will post the readings tomorrow or Saturday if you all don't mind providing thoughts on how much the parameters change.
Weekly water changes of 10 - 20% will help lower your nitrates. I found that once I had a good growth of coraline algae, my nitrates started dropping naturally and quickly. When my corals started growing, the nitrates dropped even further. Now they sit at 2.5 - 5 ppm with no additional effort on my part. My phosphate will get a little high from time to time (between 0.1 and 0.15). When that happens I use a little GFO to bring it back down closer to 0.1. I never test for ammonia since the tank is fully cycled. Only time I use the ammonia test kit is when I set up an un-cycled QT.
Looks like you are in a good position to start adding more coral.
Looks like you are in a good position to start adding more coral.
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