Pale SPS . What is going on?.

branbray07

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So some of my SPS frags look pale , and i have no clue why. I have it at the bottom of the tank as you can see. I am currently running 2 radions g5 wwc at 50 % 9hrs a day plus 4 t5 ran 1 hr at peak. Tank is 15 inches deep so its very shallow. Flow is ran by 4 jebao mlw 20 at 60 % so itss movinggg. Parameters are
N03 15 ppm hanna
Po4 .04 ppm hanna
Alk. 8.8 dkh dkh
Mag 1400 Salif
PH 8 Salif and Red Sea
Salt 1.025 Hanna

Using full Aquaforest probio salt , with abfe . There are No visible pest at all. Please advise
 

Perry

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How old is the tank? I would not recommend using probiotic salt unless you are running the Probiotic program, and no larger than 10% weekly. The salt has a carbon source, bacteria source, amino acids, and vitamins. This is NOT an average salt, it's an advanced salt for running a system where no interruption to the Probiotic program will result in water changes. A seemless salt to their program.
 

Perry

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How old is the tank? I would not recommend using probiotic salt unless you are running the Probiotic program, and no larger than 10% weekly. The salt has a carbon source, bacteria source, amino acids, and vitamins. This is NOT an average salt, it's an advanced salt for running a system where no interruption to the Probiotic program will result in water changes. A seemless salt to their program.

Also, paling is indicative of low nutrient system. I would push P04 to .10ppm for more saturated colors, N03 perfect. Also, don't exceed use on E or Energy, it has traces of copper sulfate designed for pastelling... fyi, I use it, but only a couple times per week, definitely not every day.
 

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did you double check your readings/test? any of your readings could’ve been test error
 
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branbray07

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How old is the tank? I would not recommend using probiotic salt unless you are running the Probiotic program, and no larger than 10% weekly. The salt has a carbon source, bacteria source, amino acids, and vitamins. This is NOT an average salt, it's an advanced salt for running a system where no interruption to the Probiotic program will result in water changes. A seemless salt to their program.
Hey Perry. Tank is now 1 year old. I am using the full probiotic method and changing about 10 to 15 % a week. I will drop now to 10% if recommended.
7AF17A3F-996E-41F1-B569-699ACBA76CBA.jpeg
D3DADFA1-1C24-4086-A55A-9E17880AE3F5.jpeg
518D9F52-22C1-46B8-9BD7-8BDE846BE89A.jpeg
6D071463-EAB6-4CE7-ABE2-812192BFFB42.jpeg

The top pic i dose 3 drops every other day, and bottom daily same dosages. Total water vol is about 80 g.
 

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Micro e is heavy metals, including copper sulfate. I believe the extra heavy metals which is unnecessary to dose, especially in a young system, is thinning tissue. This is a typical zeo like effect, but risky, and fringing bleaching. I would discontinue micro e, and elavate P04 for better color saturation.
Cheers
 
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branbray07

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Micro e is heavy metals, including copper sulfate. I believe the extra heavy metals which is unnecessary to dose, especially in a young system, is thinning tissue. This is a typical zeo like effect, but risky, and fringing bleaching. I would discontinue micro e, and elavate P04 for better color saturation.
Cheers
Sounds good Perry i will discontinue for now then. Thanks brother.
 

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Sounds good Perry i will discontinue for now then. Thanks brother.

Yeah,
I would, at least for now. BTW, I use reef salt, and you can do larger changes with it, the Probiotic is a great salt, but can be too effective. I find it's a great salt for a mature reef, a young reef is a bit more sensitive. Keep in mind that you are reallt on a good track, that coral pictured is very pretty! I used to use KZ Zeospur 2 days before photos on my old tank, it's basically designed to thin tissue, likely copper sulfate as well as other heavy metals. Your pucture looks exactly what Zeovit users strive for, but your riding that edge with these additives and low nutrients. Bring P04 up just a bit, and hold, your corals should darken a bit. Do not worry over ABEV, those doses and schedule seem fine.
 
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branbray07

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Yeah,
I would, at least for now. BTW, I use reef salt, and you can do larger changes with it, the Probiotic is a great salt, but can be too effective. I find it's a great salt for a mature reef, a young reef is a bit more sensitive. Keep in mind that you are reallt on a good track, that coral pictured is very pretty! I used to use KZ Zeospur 2 days before photos on my old tank, it's basically designed to thin tissue, likely copper sulfate as well as other heavy metals. Your pucture looks exactly what Zeovit users strive for, but your riding that edge with these additives and low nutrients. Bring P04 up just a bit, and hold, your corals should darken a bit. Do not worry over ABEV, those doses and schedule seem fine.
Dang ty brother. I will do exactly that.
 

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Isn't the zeovit method designed to bring the corals on the brink of death in order to make them, "shinier" for lack of a better word?
 

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Isn't the zeovit method designed to bring the corals on the brink of death in order to make them, "shinier" for lack of a better word?

Yes and no, but certain products, whether KZ, or not, can cause thinning of tissue, which shows a "shinier" if you will, appearance. Likely it's certain heavy metal dosing, copper sulfate specifically that achieves this. It's not bleaching, but can easily be mistaken for it. However, purposefully doing so is a risky proposition. Note, tissue generally teturns to normal after discontinued use.
I know this as I have used KZ, AF, Prodibio, BW NeoZeo, and other bac/carbon systems. Zeolite use can be quite effective at nutrient limitation, which in turn can lighten corals by having lowered nutrients. In this instance, corals are healthy and growing, just lighter in color, more pastel if you will. Some argue they pull trace, specifically "k" out, thus the need to bring levels back to nsw target.

Personally, after years of doing these programs, I now use salt water changes, passive gac, heavy feeding, powerful skimming to balance nutrients. I replace 15% weekly water, and 25% once per month for trace, with quality salts. My current system is trending to be my best sps system ever ;)

I now promote KISS ;)
 
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branbray07

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You got this brother!!!
Just be cautious of recommendations versus your coral mass, in the polish to english translation, some instructions can be hard to understand, nothing like 2016, lol ;)
Omg trust me i feel you. This tank has been nothing but a headache. Even with all the goodies and tech it has( apex, ato, fancy wavemakers , dc skimmer , red sea doser, kalk doser,a freaking UV and CHILLER. That 2016 tank had 2 gyres a cheap pump and hand dose and hand filled top off. Yet it was a breeze and sps thrived. Never did i have Dinos, Black ic , alk spikes, bottomed out nutrients, alk spike again. Lmaoo
 

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Omg trust me i feel you. This tank has been nothing but a headache. Even with all the goodies and tech it has( apex, ato, fancy wavemakers , dc skimmer , red sea doser, kalk doser,a freaking UV and CHILLER. That 2016 tank had 2 gyres a cheap pump and hand dose and hand filled top off. Yet it was a breeze and sps thrived. Never did i have Dinos, Black ic , alk spikes, bottomed out nutrients, alk spike again. Lmaoo

I rum my system so basic, lol...
Water change, feed heavy, powerful skimmer, lots of fliw, ton of light, and a little passive GAC. I use a Digital Aquatics RKL, an Ink Bird, and that's it lol... Check my journal, my corals look pretty good :)
 
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branbray07

branbray07

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I rum my system so basic, lol...
Water change, feed heavy, powerful skimmer, lots of fliw, ton of light, and a little passive GAC. I use a Digital Aquatics RKL, an Ink Bird, and that's it lol... Check my journal, my corals look pretty good :)
Bro i swear , im going to go back to my old school KISS. Yea man your tank looks amazing . Im soooooo jelly
 

HudsonReefer2.0

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I rum my system so basic, lol...
Water change, feed heavy, powerful skimmer, lots of fliw, ton of light, and a little passive GAC. I use a Digital Aquatics RKL, an Ink Bird, and that's it lol... Check my journal, my corals look pretty good :)
I’m with u. Simple.
 

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Just be cautious of recommendations versus your coral mass
This is a great point. I think a lot of these methods such as KZ, Aquaforest, and other probiotic systems work best in established systems where coral mass is more substantial. On a new tank with frags it can be too much, too soon. There's just not enough uptake.

I've also found low nutrients, high PAR, and high alk to be an issue. It's like asking the coral to run a marathon (high PAR and high alk) with no food reserves (nutrients). Your alk of 8.8dKH is probably fine... I've just found when dealing with pale acros, lowing the alk to 7.5 - 8.0 sometimes seems to help.
 
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branbray07

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This is a great point. I think a lot of these methods such as KZ, Aquaforest, and other probiotic systems work best in established systems where coral mass is more substantial. On a new tank with frags it can be too much, too soon. There's just not enough uptake.

I've also found low nutrients, high PAR, and high alk to be an issue. It's like asking the coral to run a marathon (high PAR and high alk) with no food reserves (nutrients). Your alk of 8.8dKH is probably fine... I've just found when dealing with pale acros, lowing the alk to 7.5 - 8.0 sometimes seems to help.
Actually im trying to lower alk, since 8.8 is to high for my liking. However its been a challenge. I have stopped all dosing of alk products to include kalk, even Aquaforest Build which idk if it contributes to alk but just in case.
 

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Actually im trying to lower alk, since 8.8 is to high for my liking. However its been a challenge. I have stopped all dosing of alk products to include kalk, even Aquaforest Build which idk if it contributes to alk but just in case.

Build is basically calcium carbonate. It's used as a binder of acidity, safe to use, won't impact alk. Kalkwasser? Not necessary, look at the pdf instructions for Probiotic Method, I remember it being ill advised. Best to run their balling program. Don't obsess over ph, do your best, if you can draw fresh air to skimmer, great :)
 
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