PARwise

[ScubaFish802]

Ok everyone,

I won't post all of my research, I'll just get to the point. Here are some basic readings.

For reference, my lighting is 11 inches above the top of the water.
My Acropora start at 12 inches under the water and go down to about 15 inches under.

These readings are with all flow off, water totally still.

1) 250W dual bulb Metal Halide and dual LED running at same time PAR readings:
- ITC PARwise - 244 to 260 PAR
- Apogee MQ-510 - 340 to 355 PAR

2) 250w Metal Halide only
- ITC PARwise - 165 PAR
- Apogee MQ-510 - 240 PAR

Ok, now for my thoughts on which is possibly correct. I switched to Metal Halide within 3 weeks of starting this new Acropora system, from the LEDs. I was wanting the best possible outcome and I knew MH would go a long way in assuring that.

About 2 months into the Halides, my Acros were doing very good, but wasn't showing much color and I had one ORA Grape Juice Acro that was turning a bit brown, like it was starved for light. I couldn't rectify that in my mind as my Apogee PAR meter was reading 300 to 320 PAR 12ninches under the water. So I waited.

After a lot of thinking, I added one of my new Illumagic Blaze X 90s to the front of the tank and angled it about 20 degrees to cover the Acropora. I adjusted the fixture to low intensity in case it was too much on the Acropora.

Within 2 weeks, I noticed some of my Maricultured Acropora coloring up a bit with different colors and having more PE than normal. I added the second Illumagic Blaze to the rear of the tank and angled it forward.

It hasn't been a long time to give final thoughts, but I monitor the tank hourly. I've had great success with it and since adjusting my lighting to reflect 100 additional PAR on the Apogee, but correct PAR (with what it normally should be), instead of bleaching and retracted polyps, I'm getting GREAT results.

I have also notice that I'm not really using any Alk, Calcium, etc. A little, but like 0.10 to 0.20 change every two or three days.

I was SHOCKED to watch my tests run yesterday and I had dropped from 9.3 DKH to 8.1. Calcium had dropped about 40 or 50 points. That's a clear indication to me that the corals are getting the PAR they need now and are utilizing the available calcium, etc.

This is an educated guess, but I believe the ITC PARwise is correct and what should be used to adjust PAR. Remember, BRS had a video on YouTube testing the Seneye and the Apogee. They also found the Apogee to be very high in its PAR readings and the Seneye was almost perfect.

Buy the PARwise, tell them I sent you . Here are two graphs that I took. First one is MH and LED and the second one is MH only. I have the LED adjusted to maybe 40% and mostly blue. So this isn't a representation of full spectrum on the LED, but it is on the Halide. These are underwater, 12 inches.

This is the type of content I'm here for

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

@Hurricane Aquatics Love your tests: this is one of the first detailed tests of PARWise we've seen so far and it's very encouraging.

Can you tell us if it is very directional in the PAR readings? I know my Seneye PAR needs to be tilted towards the light to get a proper reading, whereas the Apogees have a lens diffuser and cosine correction to deal with light directionality. Does PARWise have the same issue as Seneye?

@ConsummatePro As long as you keep it flat, it should read fine. However, I do see what you are saying and that could be the same way as it is built exactly the same as the Seneye.

I don't think it makes much of a difference as I always have to tilt my Apogee as well. My lights cover the tank from end to end and are positioned for back to front coverage, so if you had one fixture like a Radion I could see you having to tilt the meter some.

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

Since there has been a lot of interest in my testing, I believe I'm going to make a video showing what and how I tested the Apogee and the Parwise. I will be starting my YouTube channel back very soon to cover a wide array of topics for success with lighting, spectrum, Acropora, etc.

My water parameters are perfect, my flow is great, My nutrients import and export is spot on, and now the lighting is adjusted correctly with the PARwise. My Alkalinity uptake went from literally 0 to dosing 20ml daily within 2 weeks of adjusting the lighting. Calcium was also rising and not being consumed and now it is being consumed and dropping by 40 points in a 24 hour period.

So is lighting everything? No, but it is an integral part of the overall process and if you can get that adjusted correctly, then you can forget it and work on other parameters that are lacking.

Glad to help if anyone gets their Parwise and needs help.

 

[ConsummatePro]

Since there has been a lot of interest in my testing, I believe I'm going to make a video showing what and how I tested the Apogee and the Parwise. I will be starting my YouTube channel back very soon to cover a wide array of topics for success with lighting, spectrum, Acropora, etc.

My water parameters are perfect, my flow is great, My nutrients import and export is spot on, and now the lighting is adjusted correctly with the PARwise. My Alkalinity uptake went from literally 0 to dosing 20ml daily within 2 weeks of adjusting the lighting. Calcium was also rising and not being consumed and now it is being consumed and dropping by 40 points in a 24 hour period.

So is lighting everything? No, but it is an integral part of the overall process and if you can get that adjusted correctly, then you can forget it and work on other parameters that are lacking.

Glad to help if anyone gets their Parwise and needs help.

Would love to see the video!! Even better if you include side by side with the Apogee mounted at the same spot (perhaps even zip tied beside the PARWise). No one has done this yet.

If you then explain (as you did in your post) why you went with the PARWise PAR readings (including the explanation of why the Apogee PAR may over estimate the actual usable PAR) plus your practical experience, I think this would be the first content of this type and a very unique addition to the Reefing community's knowledge. Challenging the current "gold standard" and the rationale for that is a terrific place for knowledge expansion (and debate).

Before/after pics if you took them would be great, too.

I might be asking too much, but even showing a log of the 24 hour DLI beside a prized coral can show how the PARWise gives other insights into coral lighting (recognizing we may not yet know what to do with this data).

I wonder if the next frontier for lighting will be useable PAR/PUR, spectrum profile and DLI - just like how we are now posting our Alk/Ca/NO3/PO4. Imagine that users can then replicate other's lighting successes with more precision.

I think you're gonna cost me $300.

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

Would love to see the video!! Even better if you include side by side with the Apogee mounted at the same spot (perhaps even zip tied beside the PARWise). No one has done this yet.

If you then explain (as you did in your post) why you went with the PARWise PAR readings (including the explanation of why the Apogee PAR may over estimate the actual usable PAR) plus your practical experience, I think this would be the first content of this type and a very unique addition to the Reefing community's knowledge. Challenging the current "gold standard" and the rationale for that is a terrific place for knowledge expansion (and debate).

Before/after pics if you took them would be great, too.

I might be asking too much, but even showing a log of the 24 hour DLI beside a prized coral can show how the PARWise gives other insights into coral lighting (recognizing we may not yet know what to do with this data).

I wonder if the next frontier for lighting will be useable PAR/PUR, spectrum profile and DLI - just like how we are now posting our Alk/Ca/NO3/PO4. Imagine that users can then replicate other's lighting successes with more precision.

I think you're gonna cost me $300.

That's one of the exact things I was going to do. A side by side of the Apogee and the Parwise together and show the real time readings of each.

Yes, I believe PUR and also LUX is more important than people think. I can tell you that my Metal Halide puts out 11k LUX and the LED is around 4k at best. That brightness seems to matter to the corals. All great ideas and a path forward.

Lots more to come and thank you for your kind words and keep the ideas coming!

 

[Dburr1014]

Glad to help if anyone gets their Parwise and needs help.

I ordered mine, will be here on Tuesday.
I may have to take you up on that.

 

[ConsummatePro]

....annnnnnd ordered (I fully blame @Hurricane Aquatics so you'll have to answer to my wife).

I'm watching with interest: certainly until now people have just been using Apogee PAR readings with great success, so you could argue we don't need more than this. I wonder if we'll evolve to show coloration and growth optimizations with additional insights - like how BRS is recently highlighting PUR and "biology band" as the next frontier - especially since there is now a consumer device that can provide this info (at a lower cost, interestingly).

 

[Dburr1014]

....annnnnnd ordered (I fully blame @Hurricane Aquatics so you'll have to answer to my wife).

I'm watching with interest: certainly until now people have just been using Apogee PAR readings with great success, so you could argue we don't need more than this. I wonder if we'll evolve to show coloration and growth optimizations with additional insights - like how BRS is recently highlighting PUR and "biology band" as the next frontier - especially since there is now a consumer device that can provide this info (at a lower cost, interestingly).

This unit won't do PUR.
But, I think I'm going to love the idea that I can check my Spectrum along with PAR.
I recently set up a small frag shelf in my large sump with a 175 metal halide bulb. It's going to be nice to know where I am with par compared to my display along with the Spectrum. Eventually I'd like to get a LED fixture over the frags but for now this is what I got.

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

This unit won't do PUR.
But, I think I'm going to love the idea that I can check my Spectrum along with PAR.
I recently set up a small frag shelf in my large sump with a 175 metal halide bulb. It's going to be nice to know where I am with par compared to my display along with the Spectrum. Eventually I'd like to get a LED fixture over the frags but for now this is what I got.

Yes, you're right about PUR, but I saw where ITC posted that they are going to add that in an upcoming software update. They also said if we have ideas that we would like to add we can tell them and they will look at adding them.

@ConsummatePro yes, people have been doing well with the Apogee over the years and I think I know why. If they are all as high as mine, it might be a good thing for most. I know some think they have to hit their SPS with 400 to 600 PAR. Maybe if they are a 100 short, it's good for the corals lol.

I think I'll contact Apogee and see if they will recalibrate mine for no charge. It's worth a shot.

 

[Dburr1014]

Yes, you're right about PUR, but I saw where ITC posted that they are going to add that in an upcoming software update. They also said if we have ideas that we would like to add we can tell them and they will look at adding them.

@ConsummatePro yes, people have been doing well with the Apogee over the years and I think I know why. If they are all as high as mine, it might be a good thing for most. I know some think they have to hit their SPS with 400 to 600 PAR. Maybe if they are a 100 short, it's good for the corals lol.

I think I'll contact Apogee and see if they will recalibrate mine for no charge. It's worth a shot.

Knowing pur would be a bigger bonus.

You may be right, we don't know.
If 90% of people use apogee and 10% seneye, apogee has the market. Now all these people think 500 Par the way to go. But what if it is high to what the real number is?
I guess the more people use PARwise the more we will have comparison to the apogee.

Lots of neysayers already and the data is not in yet.

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

Knowing pure would be a bigger bonus.

You may be right, we don't know.
If 90% of people use apogee and 10% seneye, apogee has the market. Now all these people think 500 Par the way to go. But what if it is high to what the real number is?
I guess the more people use PARwise the more we will have comparison to the apogee.

Lots of neysayers already and the data is not in yet.

Yeah, I'm getting a lot of naysayers on the other thread. It's fine with me, I'm not trying to sell anything, just trying to help. But I'll be danged if somoene is going to tell me I'm wrong when they don't even have a PAR meter lol....... People.

I'm all about what works and what helps everyone be successful. If it's the Seneye, PARwise, Apogee, or any other tool then that's good with me. As a community we should be investigating these things and spreading real world data based on quantifiable results.

 

[Dburr1014]

Yeah, I'm getting a lot of naysayers on the other thread. It's fine with me, I'm not trying to sell anything, just trying to help. But I'll be danged if somoene is going to tell me I'm wrong when they don't even have a PAR meter lol....... People.

I'm all about what works and what helps everyone be successful. If it's the Seneye, PARwise, Apogee, or any other tool then that's good with me. As a community we should be investigating these things and spreading real world data based on quantifiable results.

Yup, read that thread too.
That would be real nice to have other features.
Glad I'm in at $300 before the price jump. LOL

 

[nbooks]

yeah, great job here. I've been watching this meter closely and you are the first true hobbyist review ive found.

i really like when products cost less and work better!

 

[jonb154]

Since there has been a lot of interest in my testing, I believe I'm going to make a video showing what and how I tested the Apogee and the Parwise. I will be starting my YouTube channel back very soon to cover a wide array of topics for success with lighting, spectrum, Acropora, etc.

My water parameters are perfect, my flow is great, My nutrients import and export is spot on, and now the lighting is adjusted correctly with the PARwise. My Alkalinity uptake went from literally 0 to dosing 20ml daily within 2 weeks of adjusting the lighting. Calcium was also rising and not being consumed and now it is being consumed and dropping by 40 points in a 24 hour period.

So is lighting everything? No, but it is an integral part of the overall process and if you can get that adjusted correctly, then you can forget it and work on other parameters that are lacking.

Glad to help if anyone gets their Parwise and needs help.

Hi I’ve been reading a couple posts about the Parwise and was hoping for some help. The white diffuser( cosine corrector maybe) says it is replaceable and I’ve looked everywhere for the part but can’t seem to find it. Do you have that information?

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

Hi I’ve been reading a couple posts about the Parwise and was hoping for some help. The white diffuser( cosine corrector maybe) says it is replaceable and I’ve looked everywhere for the part but can’t seem to find it. Do you have that information?

No, I don't have any information on where to buy it. You would have to contact the company and ask them. That piece should last for a very long time though.

After every use, I rinse mine with fresh water and dry it gently. Then I use canned air to blow out any moisture, but I never blow hard on that white diffuser. I'll take a soft paper towel and go around it very gently.

 

[Dburr1014]

Just got mine today.
Hope to use it tonight.

 

[Swede Reef]

Just got mine today.
Hope to use it tonight.

Hey,just found this thread. I have a parwise as well. Unfortunately nothing to compare against. I am happy as it is consistent and corals look good. As far as how accurate is it, who knows but it serves my need. Let us know how you like it.

 

[Swede Reef]

Any idea if there will be any logging feature upcoming?

 

[Hurricane Aquatics]

Any idea if there will be any logging feature upcoming?

It has DLI now, but if you mean logging PAR or other values, not that I know of. They did say that if we give them our ideas, they would work to incorporate them.

 

[Dburr1014]

I tested PARwise over my frag area in my sump and I'm very confused.
It's newly setup, easy frags, lit by my old 175mh ballast with a 1 year old plusrite 14k bulb.
The fixture is mounted high, about 20" above the water. The frag Shelf is 5" below the water.
I have a short of spider reflector on the bulb.
These are screen shots I took.



I like the color analysis of the meter.
I don't get why this says 6 PAR.
Even taken out of the water and held 6" away from the light of gave me about 100 PAR.

Anyone care to give me some insight?
Tonight I'm going to try my display with the reef breeders. I don't have a handle but maybe I can make-shift something at home.