Randy, why did you add dry ice to your sump?

[Miami Reef]

Most aquarists are not likely to do what I did, and add a chunk of dry ice to the sump just to see what happens. Those that do will see the pH drop…and drop…and drop. Soon, they may become convinced that the pH of 5 is going to kill the entire tank (it didn't in my case, but I don't recommend this process for general entertainment).

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-09/rhf/

Why would you do this?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

lol

I had it left over from some sort of nonreef experiment. Just for fun. lol

 

[Sean Clark]

It is basically like injecting CO2 into your tank right. I'll bet the answer is "for science".

 

[Spare time]

Wouldn't that make the tank rather cold lol

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The tank system was about 250-300 gallons at the time, so the temp effect was minor. Even the whole tank pH probably didn't drop all that much, but the sump pH dropped a lot. lol

 

[Miami Reef]

The tank system was about 250-300 gallons at the time, so the temp effect was minor. Even the whole tank pH probably didn't drop all that much, but the sump pH dropped a lot. lol

I thought your tank was 100 gallons? Were you not afraid of dissolving your corals?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I thought your tank was 100 gallons? Were you not afraid of dissolving your corals?

Tank was either a 90 or 120 (made a swap at one point).

But I had big rock filled refugia and sumps (up to 5 x 44 gallon Brute cans).

I was not afraid of losing corals, but maybe should have been a bit more careful.

 

[GK3]

Tank was either a 90 or 120 (made a swap at one point).

But I had big rock filled refugia and sumps (up to 5 x 44 gallon Brute cans).

I was not afraid of losing corals, but maybe should have been a bit more careful.

It’s just CO2? So you drop the Ph and you’d change temp. It would be directly proportional to the amount of dry ice and total system volume. Honestly if I were having an issue with pH being too high, this seems like a great way to bring it down without injecting other ingredients. Maybe you could invent the dry ice reactor for ph control

 

[Miami Reef]

Tank was either a 90 or 120 (made a swap at one point).

But I had big rock filled refugia and sumps (up to 5 x 44 gallon Brute cans).

I was not afraid of losing corals, but maybe should have been a bit more careful.

Hey, at least it worked out fine!

While I have you here, I am making a stock sodium hydroxide solution. I have a clean glass pickle jar. I don’t know what material the lid is (seems metal-like to me). Is this safe with a high ph solution?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

It’s just CO2? So you drop the Ph and you’d change temp. It would be directly proportional to the amount of dry ice and total system volume. Honestly if I were having an issue with pH being too high, this seems like a great way to bring it down without injecting other ingredients. Maybe you could invent the dry ice reactor for ph control

lol

Not many folks have high pH, but soda water might be easier for most to buy.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Hey, at least it worked out fine!

While I have you here, I am making a stock sodium hydroxide solution. I have a clean glass pickle jar. I don’t know what material the lid is (seems metal-like to me). Is this safe with a high ph solution?

I'm not sure. Some metals do dissolve at high pH. Plastic lid is better.

 

[Miami Reef]

I'm not sure. Some metals do dissolve at high pH. Plastic lid is better.

I looked it up. Seems like jar lids are made from steel coated with plastic on the bottom part.

And then I learned from google that sodium hydroxide will not react with iron nor steel.

 

[Gtinnel]

I looked it up. Seems like jar lids are made from steel coated with plastic on the bottom part.

And then I learned from google that sodium hydroxide will not react with iron nor steel.

Im keeping a mixture of lye and kalk solution in a pickle jar and I haven’t noticed any obvious issue. I figured the metal lid is coated, and I store it upright so the liquid isn’t in constant contact with the lid.
Im not saying that it’s a safe way to store it but I am using one too and so far so good.

 

[Miami Reef]

@Randy Holmes-Farley

One thing that confuses me is when using ph altering solutions, aeration can work for or against you.

I’m just starting to use sodium hydroxide. 5mL a day in a 20 gallon.

If I heavily aerate which brings my ph to a baseline of 8.1, will this make the hydroxide work better than if I keep aeration minimal?

Like, how do I make the effects of sodium hydroxide most noticeable? Aeration with outside air + hydroxide? Is that the best combo?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Randy Holmes-Farley

One thing that confuses me is when using ph altering solutions, aeration can work for or against you.

I’m just starting to use sodium hydroxide. 5mL a day in a 20 gallon.

If I heavily aerate which brings my ph to a baseline of 8.1, will this make the hydroxide work better than if I keep aeration minimal?

Like, how do I make the effects of sodium hydroxide most noticeable? Aeration with outside air + hydroxide? Is that the best combo?

Is the goal the biggest pH boost, or to detect the boost easiest, or to target a specific pH?

The degree of boost to pH from adding hydroxide depends on two things: that alk (lower is better for seeing a pH boost) and the starting pH.

pH buffering is much lower at pH 7.8 than at pH 8.5. About 1/3rd as much. So a given hydroxide boost does a lot less when starting high then when starting low.

On the other hand, the pull of CO2 into the tank from the air is much higher with higher pH (for any given alkalinity). So even if you boost more when starting higher in pH, you will also suck in more CO2 over time to partly offset that larger rise.

Outside air is better than inside air (or the same if CO2 is not elevated indoors) if the goal is higher pH.

 

[Miami Reef]

Is the goal the biggest pH boost, or to detect the boost easiest, or to target a specific pH?

The degree of boost to pH from adding hydroxide depends on two things: that alk (lower is better for seeing a pH boost) and the starting pH.

pH buffering is much lower at pH 7.8 than at pH 8.5. About 1/3rd as much. So a given hydroxide boost does a lot less when starting high then when starting low.

On the other hand, the pull of CO2 into the tank from the air is much higher with higher pH (for any given alkalinity). So even if you boost more when starting higher in pH, you will also suck in more CO2 over time to partly offset that larger rise.

Outside air is better than inside air (or the same if CO2 is not elevated indoors) if the goal is higher pH.

The goal is to target minimum ph of 8.3. Right now I’m getting 8.0 - 8.1

My alk is currently 9dkh.

I just started the hydroxide dosing last night.

I also just increased the aeration with outside air with a fan blowing over the tank.

 

[taricha]

It’s just CO2? So you drop the Ph and you’d change temp. It would be directly proportional to the amount of dry ice and total system volume. Honestly if I were having an issue with pH being too high, this seems like a great way to bring it down without injecting other ingredients. Maybe you could invent the dry ice reactor for ph control

In case anyone wondered what happens if you just blow into your tank for a few minutes....

I put an airstone under a powerhead and blew through it so the bubbles would get pulled into the powerhead and pumped around the tank.

60 gallon system, after the second 5 minute round of breathing into the tank, I'd definitely go out and buy seltzer water instead. It's kinda tiring.