Recent Soda Ash Change

[spsick]

Guys can we please look into what’s going on with the Soda Ash lately?

Ive been using the product since Ryan sold me a bag and a maxi mod out of his garage. When the switch to Pharma happened it mixed up cleaner and faster. As of late it is a huge pita to mix! While I appreciate CS effort to maintain a happy customer by just sending a new bag when I asked about it. I tried to resolve through email but I got the feeling it would not be looked into.

Every bag (7lb) I’ve cracked since buying a handful on Black Friday including the new ones sent does not mix up well without aggressive heating AND shaking.

Literally nothing has changed in the way I mix the product in 10 years. I feel like the raw material vendor was subbed or something.

Here’s another thread about the same concern:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/soda-ash-crystaling-while-mixing-with-rodi-water.962843/

 

[((FORDTECH))]

Actually I have noticed this also. Past 2 gallons I mixed when poured into my dosing container had chunks at the bottom and it was mixed no different than the last 20 times I’ve mixed it and didn’t have chunks.

 

[Bulk Reef Supply Verified Sponsor]

Guys can we please look into what’s going on with the Soda Ash lately?

Ive been using the product since Ryan sold me a bag and a maxi mod out of his garage. When the switch to Pharma happened it mixed up cleaner and faster. As of late it is a huge pita to mix! While I appreciate CS effort to maintain a happy customer by just sending a new bag when I asked about it. I tried to resolve through email but I got the feeling it would not be looked into.

Every bag (7lb) I’ve cracked since buying a handful on Black Friday including the new ones sent does not mix up well without aggressive heating AND shaking.

Literally nothing has changed in the way I mix the product in 10 years. I feel like the raw material vendor was subbed or something.

Here’s another thread about the same concern:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/soda-ash-crystaling-while-mixing-with-rodi-water.962843/

I haven't heard about any raw material suppliers changing and personally haven't noticed my Soda Ash mixing differently on my personal aquariums. But let me gather some more info just to be sure and I'll report back when I know more

 

[spsick]

I haven't heard about any raw material suppliers changing and personally haven't noticed my Soda Ash mixing differently on my personal aquariums. But let me gather some more info just to be sure and I'll report back when I know more

Awesome thanks for looking into it.

 

[DeeBee]

It is completely different in the way it looks and mixes. Far fluffier looking than it used to be and doesn't mix worth a darn, regardless of water temp.

Here is another thread about it:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/s...-mixing-with-rodi-water.962843/#post-11070148

 

[spsick]

It is completely different in the way it looks and mixes. Far fluffier looking than it used to be and doesn't mix worth a darn, regardless of water temp.

Here is another thread about it:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/s...-mixing-with-rodi-water.962843/#post-11070148

Interesting. I haven’t found the consistency to be any different. Dense and fine powder but very poor mixing. Even when mixing in increments with prewarmed water as customer service suggested.

I’ve always mixed with cold RODI water by pouring in the full amount and it mixed up great. Now most of it solidifies into small chunks that look like hail and it’s super hard to mix. Like it takes an hour of repeated heating the jug in a hot water bath and shaking.

 

[nashlake]

I am having the same issue, dumped the first gallon I mixed thinking I did something wrong. It does finally mix but much more difficult in the past.

 

[BirdGuy21]

I am having the same exact problem with my latest batches.

 

[Bulk Reef Supply Verified Sponsor]

I heard back from our purchasing team after some digging into some lot numbers and other info. We have not had a supplier change for our Soda Ash raw materials within the last year and a half and the lot number for the raw materials has been the same lot number for the past ~8 months.

One thing that could be hindering the mixing for some people is the temperature of the RO/DI water being used. Especially for those in cold weather areas, if you're mixing using RO/DI water just produced, the temperature of the water is probably many degrees lower than room temp and lead to challenges getting everything to dissolve into solution.

As Randy Holmes-Farley mentioned in one of those threads linked here, floating the jug in some HOT water can really really help with the dissolving of the Soda Ash powder (or any powder you're mixing, for that matter).

With all of that said, I don't want to ignore the issues that some reefers are reporting here, so if I come across any new information that could help explain anything reported, I'll absolutely follow up here again.

 

[DeeBee]

I heard back from our purchasing team after some digging into some lot numbers and other info. We have not had a supplier change for our Soda Ash raw materials within the last year and a half and the lot number for the raw materials has been the same lot number for the past ~8 months.

One thing that could be hindering the mixing for some people is the temperature of the RO/DI water being used. Especially for those in cold weather areas, if you're mixing using RO/DI water just produced, the temperature of the water is probably many degrees lower than room temp and lead to challenges getting everything to dissolve into solution.

As Randy Holmes-Farley mentioned in one of those threads linked here, floating the jug in some HOT water can really really help with the dissolving of the Soda Ash powder (or any powder you're mixing, for that matter).

With all of that said, I don't want to ignore the issues that some reefers are reporting here, so if I come across any new information that could help explain anything reported, I'll absolutely follow up here again.

Appreciate the research and reply. Like some of the other users, I have been using BRS Soda Ash for many years (pre-Pharma grade). I've never had an issue with it mixing regardless of how cold the temperature is. My water is now usually around 70 degrees, which I consider to be pretty warm, and it still clumps up. For me it happened first in a batch that I received in late November 2022.

The good news is that it doesn't seem to have any negative effects on the tank, but certainly takes far more effort to mix.

 

[BirdGuy21]

Mixed up two separate gallons last night, water temp 65 degrees. Took quite a bit of shaking to get it all to dissolve. I’ve definitely mixed it with colder water in the past, around 50 degrees, and it dissolved right away.

 

[Cichlid Dad]

I just started using the product and did have a hard time with chunks at the bottom of the container. I just didn't have a reference so thought it was normal. I will be mixing a new batch this weekend

 

[Cichlid Dad]

I just started using the product and did have a hard time with chunks at the bottom of the container. I just didn't have a reference so thought it was normal. I will be mixing a new batch this weekend

Ok I just mixed up a new batch

 

[Cichlid Dad]

Ok I just mixed up a new batch

I shook for a minute most of it dissolved should fully dissolve with a little more shaking

 

[spsick]

@Bulk Reef Supply any update? Maybe you haven’t changed suppliers but the product from that supplier has 100% changed.

Even before the switch the Pharma grade I NEVER saw residue in the bottom of my container until now. Is it possible this could be from the 80ml/gal of Tropic Marin A- Elements I am adding per the hybrid method? I am not seeing any residue whatsoever in my calcium/K+ Elements mix.

I am using 0 TDS water from an 8 stage RODI unit with filters changed frequently.

 

[spsick]

@Bulk Reef Supply Tag didn’t work in last post

 

[Bulk Reef Supply Verified Sponsor]

I've been doing some digging on this with our procurement team and we haven't gotten any information from out vendor on a change in product. This is the first report of a brown residue after mixing that I've been able to find in my searches here with our support team. We are using soda ash for several tanks here and haven't come across this yet either.

With the mention of the trace elements I'll be reaching out to Lou to see if they've seen this before with the Traces to rule out all possibilities as well as do more work with our procurement team on testing the soda ash. Should have a bit more information by Friday this week.

 

[spsick]

I've been doing some digging on this with our procurement team and we haven't gotten any information from out vendor on a change in product. This is the first report of a brown residue after mixing that I've been able to find in my searches here with our support team. We are using soda ash for several tanks here and haven't come across this yet either.

With the mention of the trace elements I'll be reaching out to Lou to see if they've seen this before with the Traces to rule out all possibilities as well as do more work with our procurement team on testing the soda ash. Should have a bit more information by Friday this week.

Awesome I really appreciate the ongoing effort. BRS products have given me a decade + of success and tanks full to the glass of coral so I REALLY want to stick with it.

I live in Minneapolis so I’m happy to provide samples of anything if that helps.

 

[Borat]

If you add a couple of table spoons of sodium hydroxide (caustic soda) - the mix will dissolve fully. Sodium carbonate reacts with atmospheric CO2 and water vapours to form sodium bicarbonate - which has much lower solubility and precipitates in this saturated mix.

Sodium hydroxide mixed with sodium bicarbonate will restore it back to sodium carbonate - therefore allowing it to dissolve fully.

 

[Bulk Reef Supply Verified Sponsor]

Update on the soda ash. We have pulled many samples from different batches over the past couple of days and weren't able to replicate either issue shown in this thread (non-dissolving crystals or brown residue) with just the soda ash by itself. Our advice would be to warm the solution to help with dissolving some, however, if issues persist our support team would be happy to work on a solution for anyone seeing this as well.

As for the brown residue, we talked to Tropic Marin and they advised that it was likely some trace element precipitation that is completely normal when making a solution like this. It is never a problem and does not affect the concentrations in the final solution. Also, if some, or even all, of this residue should work its way into the tank, it is also not an issue at all. Sometimes when mixing you will find this. And other times not so much.