Reef dying again. Any ideas?

Rick.45cal · Sep 26, 2016

rock_lobster said:
Wouldn't matter how much nitrate you add to a tank that is over the limits on copper, the coral will still die.. Even worse it will polute the tank and accelerate the die off. There are 2 fish at least and a clean up crew in a 18 gallons of water that's plenty enough coral food. I would try to get some zero tds water as soon as possible as and do a 50% water change. Your triton results won't be back for 2 weeks and your coral will most likely be dead by then.

I am not discounting the possibility of copper from the distillation process. However you ARE discounting a nitrogen deficiency.

Your take on Nitrates is totally wrong. Adding 2.5ppm will neither "pollute" the tank or accelerate the die off. Obviously if the OP is running 0 nitrates, that he has an effective removal source. 2.5ppm will likely disappear overnight due to a surplus of DOC. (Dissolved Organic Carbon). It's likely that surplus that's driving the bleaching event. There is a real simple test to see if it is nitrate deficiency, add nitrates and maintain a couple parts per million. If the RTN STN/bleaching event ceases and the coral begin showing signs of recovery in a few days then it was a nitrogen deficiency. If it doesn't stop the event then you don't have to dose anymore, you can check that off of your list of possibilities.

In the meantime you can wait for your triton test results to see if there is heavy metal contamination and address the issue! I totally agree 100% GET A NEW SOURCE OF WATER.

It amazes me how many aquarist are resistant to adding an ionic form of NO3 but have no problem squirting mystery bottles of amino acids, and "trace elements" into their tanks on a regular basis.

Surfandturf · Sep 26, 2016

I have been running distilled water for my water top off and it works just fine. Someone on here please tell my why distilled water is bad.

saltyfilmfolks · Sep 26, 2016

Surfandturf said:
I have been running distilled water for my water top off and it works just fine. Someone on here please tell my why distilled water is bad.

because of the unknown of who makes it.... yes a lot of debate.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/rodi-vs-distilled-water.239764/
http://www.thereeftank.com/forums/f6/ro-di-water-vs-distilled-water-170881.html

Thus my recommendations to avoid or replace it as a possible cause IF there's problems.

Paul B used tap water for top off and salt mixing for years until they started monkeying with the water.

Atrain · Sep 26, 2016

I've been running tap water for two years

rock_lobster · Sep 26, 2016

LOL

Atrain said:
I've been running tap water for two years

saltyfilmfolks · Sep 26, 2016

Atrain said:
I've been running tap water for two years

shudder.....

Atrain · Sep 26, 2016

It's true granted sps is not something I can take care of.but everything else is more than OK... This is not something I would recommend rodi is the way to go with out a doubt, well so I've heard, but two drops per gallon of declorinater and I've not had a issue... My only issue has been keeping my temperature good in the summer and calcium and alk stable with my in frequent water changes

Wiz · Sep 26, 2016

I would buy a tds meter. As long as the distilled measures well its just as good. But I doubt contaminated top off is your issue. It would cause a nuisance algae outbreak. Thats how I know when my top off is bad. Just got a batch two weeks ago that caused a slime and hair outbreak. (Short lived;-)) tested and it was at 90! Went back to show the store owner and tested again instore. 136! Yup, redid his whole system. Anyway, shot in the dark. There isn't anything near the tank that could get In it right? Ie: air freshner cologne etc...

TheAsian0328 · Sep 27, 2016

I have 5 fish. 1 fire fish, 2 clown fish, 1 royal gramma, and 1 mandarin. All of them are doing fine and don't seem bothered by anything. Today the corals are still shriveled and looks like no improvement after a 5 gal distilled water change. Tomorrow I will be doing another water change after work. I have a tds meter and have been checking all my water sources to find distilled to be 3 or less. Been feeding fish every day and letting the rest float around for the corals. I have not been spot feeding corals since none of them really open up to eat.

Lenny_S · Sep 27, 2016

The corals you have left aren't going to bounce back right away it will take time. So be patient.
I would try the following...
1) Stop doing water changes for a while. This will help stabilize the tank and give the corals a little break.
2) Get a big bottle of TLF Acro Power. Dose double the amount recommended for a few weeks. This will help the corals recover and what they don't use will break down and help bring your nutrients and dissolved organics up.
3) Monitor your parameters and see what they do. Take the time that you aren't doing water changes to see how much of the core water properties are used over what period of time.
I really think you just have a new tank that is not totally balanced out yet and is running a bit too clean. There really isn't much you can do besides what I put to hurry that along. It will take a little more time.

Eggyoke · Sep 27, 2016

My 2 cents are toxins that may be added to the tank from your home. Sprays, lotions, Smelly things. The only time I had a tank crash was from wife spraying.

Kungpaoshizi · Sep 27, 2016

Apologies, at work and don't have time to read the whole thread~

I see black sand? Have you done a triton test? (I saw aluminum from black sand)
Also what coral dip do you use?
How often do you feed?

Surfandturf · Sep 27, 2016

What a bummer about the black sand. Was considering it for my next build. This coming from a guy that hates adding sand lol.

TheAsian0328 · Sep 27, 2016

Kungpaoshizi said:
Apologies, at work and don't have time to read the whole thread~

I see black sand? Have you done a triton test? (I saw aluminum from black sand)
Also what coral dip do you use?
How often do you feed?

The sand is this. Haven't gotten the results back from the triton test yet. I haven't added any coral for a while and when I did it was a freshwater dip. I have been feeding every day for the past week.

TheAsian0328 · Sep 27, 2016

Lenny_S said:
The corals you have left aren't going to bounce back right away it will take time. So be patient.
I would try the following...
1) Stop doing water changes for a while. This will help stabilize the tank and give the corals a little break.
2) Get a big bottle of TLF Acro Power. Dose double the amount recommended for a few weeks. This will help the corals recover and what they don't use will break down and help bring your nutrients and dissolved organics up.
3) Monitor your parameters and see what they do. Take the time that you aren't doing water changes to see how much of the core water properties are used over what period of time.
I really think you just have a new tank that is not totally balanced out yet and is running a bit too clean. There really isn't much you can do besides what I put to hurry that along. It will take a little more time.

I have a bottle of that and will start that tonight. I have been doing the normal dose regularly.

TheAsian0328 · Sep 30, 2016

Water test this morning
Mg: 1320
Ca: 415
Kh/alk: 9.8
Ph: 7.8
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
Phosphate: 0

nervousmonkey · Sep 30, 2016

Rick.45cal said:
I am not discounting the possibility of copper from the distillation process. However you ARE discounting a nitrogen deficiency.

Your take on Nitrates is totally wrong. Adding 2.5ppm will neither "pollute" the tank or accelerate the die off. Obviously if the OP is running 0 nitrates, that he has an effective removal source. 2.5ppm will likely disappear overnight due to a surplus of DOC. (Dissolved Organic Carbon). It's likely that surplus that's driving the bleaching event. There is a real simple test to see if it is nitrate deficiency, add nitrates and maintain a couple parts per million. If the RTN STN/bleaching event ceases and the coral begin showing signs of recovery in a few days then it was a nitrogen deficiency. If it doesn't stop the event then you don't have to dose anymore, you can check that off of your list of possibilities.

In the meantime you can wait for your triton test results to see if there is heavy metal contamination and address the issue! I totally agree 100% GET A NEW SOURCE OF WATER.

It amazes me how many aquarist are resistant to adding an ionic form of NO3 but have no problem squirting mystery bottles of amino acids, and "trace elements" into their tanks on a regular basis.

Aminos will add NO3 anyway, so I agree in the long term that it is strange that people will add what will turn into NO3 but won't add NO3. All aminos do is turn into ammonia then process from there.... I'd rather know the exact amount of nitrates I am adding to my system.... +1 to this advice. It's simple, easy, and let's the OP rule NO3 out, or it fixes the problem.
IMO, it's probably multiple things. If there is copper, there is nothing to do but get a poly filter pad to check and then get a LOT of Cuprisorb. Happened to me once from a faulty pump, never again.
Either way, die off is likely multiple bad things happening at once.
Just start with the basics @TheAsian0328 , forget all of the detailed stuff. Do what you did when you started your system. Inspect every little thing including plumbing, manual WC's, testing and most of all looking. If everything goes, you can't help it if you've done your work. And lastly don't let it drive you crazy.