Refugium or Protein skimmer? or neither?

[permanaccour]

Just ordered a new 50G tank (Innovative Marine 50G with 25G capacity sump). Looks like the sump doesn't have enough compartments or space to have both a refugium and a protein skimmer (Here is the link in case you would beg to differ and can find a way to do both). I'm leaning towards going with a refugium, as I'll want to cultivate copepods for mandarins.

What are the opinions on one over the other? or perhaps there's another alternative?

 

[thomas_neil]

If you have space available you could potentially do a hang on back skimmer in the sump with the fuge in the skimmer chamber. Personally I would pick a skimmer over the fuge. Could always add a turf scrubber on down the road for nutrient control or get a macro algae reactor for pods or hang on back refugium.

With a mandarin in a smaller tank, you will probably need to replenish pod population every month until the fuge/pods get really established, as that's all the mandarin eats, and everything else in the tank will eat at them too.

 

[permanaccour]

If you have space available you could potentially do a hang on back skimmer in the sump with the fuge in the skimmer chamber. Personally I would pick a skimmer over the fuge. Could always add a turf scrubber on down the road for nutrient control or get a macro algae reactor for pods or hang on back refugium.

With a mandarin in a smaller tank, you will probably need to replenish pod population every month until the fuge/pods get really established, as that's all the mandarin eats, and everything else in the tank will eat at them too.

I was thinking of the HOB option as well, but wouldn't the HOB skimmer work better in the return chamber? I wouldn't want to get any chaeto stuck in the skimmer pumps.

Thoughts on if I can put both a Macroalgae reactor+protein skimmer in the same chamber? that could be a possible alternative

 

[thomas_neil]

I was thinking of the HOB option as well, but wouldn't the HOB skimmer work better in the return chamber? I wouldn't want to get any chaeto stuck in the skimmer pumps.

Thoughts on if I can put both a Macroalgae reactor+protein skimmer in the same chamber? that could be a possible alternative

I would recommend a normal skimmer in the skimmer chamber and get a external macro algae reactor, so only the pump is in the sump. I know tunze makes one and poseiden reef. I've used the Poseidon reef one in the past, had great pod population, but chato growth was not impressive. The light that's included with it is not the best.

 

[d2mini]

When i have to choose just one, skimmer all the way. Out of all the filtration options we have, you can't beat a good skimmer.
A fuge is a nice to have but not necessary and not as efficient as a means of filtration.

 

[Seansea]

Def a skimmer first. Skimmer doesnt just remove nutrients can remove toxins in the tank like say you have some soap residual on hand and put in the tank. Or just the crud from mounting corals like epoxy residue. Wouldnt run a tank without one. I use a algae scrubber mounted above my sump but that doesnt create a ton of pods like a fuge does. Hob might be your best bet there.

 

[Widdlyscudds]

For sure a skimmer

 

[permanaccour]

Thanks all - sounds like the protein skimmer would take precedence here. With what @thomas_neil said,

I would recommend a normal skimmer in the skimmer chamber and get a external macro algae reactor, so only the pump is in the sump. I know tunze makes one and poseiden reef. I've used the Poseidon reef one in the past, had great pod population, but chato growth was not impressive. The light that's included with it is not the best.

It sounds like perhaps I can put a skimmer in the center chamber and a small macroalgae reactor (like this one) for copepod cultivation in the return chamber (the 11.4" chamber on the right in the diagram)

Would there be any downsides to having 2 pumps in 1 chamber?

picture for reference

 

[exnisstech]

If you want pods refugium all the way. Skimmer for nutrient reduction and aeration. IME fuges are poor at nutrient reduction but great for pods and other small life forms. Skimmers have a purpose for sure but tanks can be run successfully without one, I did so for years. Skimmers are not a necessity but another tool. If I had to choose I would go fuge since you mentioned keeping a mandarin. I'm not familiar with algae reactors so I'm not sure if pods can live in them or not. It's a new tank I would wait and see if you even need a skimmer.

 

[twentyleagues]

If you have room for a basket of rock rubble in the skimmer chamber might be all that is needed. Hob fuges work well I have a cpr fuge from years ago that worked well.

 

[permanaccour]

If you want pods refugium all the way. Skimmer for nutrient reduction and aeration. IME fuges are poor at nutrient reduction but great for pods and other small life forms. Skimmers have a purpose for sure but tanks can be run successfully without one, I did so for years. Skimmers are not a necessity but another tool. If I had to choose I would go fuge since you mentioned keeping a mandarin. I'm not familiar with algae reactors so I'm not sure if pods can live in them or not. It's a new tank I would wait and see if you even need a skimmer.

Good point...there are a million ways to run a successful reef tank.

Getting a bit more creative here and on the topic of "not needing certain equipment"... Has anyone tried running a tank without filter socks? I'm thinking of just putting the refugium in the chamber that would normally hold the filter socks.

As for what you said @twentyleagues, do you mean rock rubble in the skimmer chamber for the copepods? wouldn't the skimmer suck up some of the pods?

 

[VB313]

+1. Skimmer all the way

There are plenty of options to add a remote refugium or reactor later on

 

[thomas_neil]

Good point...there are a million ways to run a successful reef tank.

Getting a bit more creative here and on the topic of "not needing certain equipment"... Has anyone tried running a tank without filter socks? I'm thinking of just putting the refugium in the chamber that would normally hold the filter socks.

As for what you said @twentyleagues, do you mean rock rubble in the skimmer chamber for the copepods? wouldn't the skimmer suck up some of the pods?

With this you're starting to get into a triton method setup, just minus the water volume. With triton method you use no mechanical filtration, just macro and a skimmer. Socks arnt needed, but you will need to clean the sump more regularly due to detritous build up.

 

[thomas_neil]

Thanks all - sounds like the protein skimmer would take precedence here. With what @thomas_neil said,


It sounds like perhaps I can put a skimmer in the center chamber and a small macroalgae reactor (like this one) for copepod cultivation in the return chamber (the 11.4" chamber on the right in the diagram)

Would there be any downsides to having 2 pumps in 1 chamber?

picture for reference

The reactor wouldn't need to go in the sump, just the pump and return from it. Could also run a manifold off your return pump to feed the reactor and run that directly to the tank.

 

[exnisstech]

I'm thinking of just putting the refugium in the chamber that would normally hold the filter socks.

Many people do this. I tried and it didn't go well. The tank I tried it on has the fuge in the secondary chamber after the socks and skimmer. My chaeto became so nasty from detritus that I has to toss it, clean the chamber and add new chaeto. I am far from a clean sump person and normally do not, clean my sump.

 

[twentyleagues]

Good point...there are a million ways to run a successful reef tank.

Getting a bit more creative here and on the topic of "not needing certain equipment"... Has anyone tried running a tank without filter socks? I'm thinking of just putting the refugium in the chamber that would normally hold the filter socks.

As for what you said @twentyleagues, do you mean rock rubble in the skimmer chamber for the copepods? wouldn't the skimmer suck up some of the pods?

yeah probably but that happens anyway my new set up is doing exactly what you posted in this pic. Techanically that is how my old system was years ago, but I did have socks right before the return pump just to catch anything that made it out of the refugium.

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

Put a skimmer in that chamber and then fill the rest of the chamber with liver rock. Good enough for pods for sure

 

[NorCalReefing]

If you have room in the cabinet, do both. Get a skimmer and an external chaeto reactor. Especially for a new tank, the macro algae will really help!

 

[Jay'sReefBugs]

I run both but if I could only choose one it would definitely be skimmer. It's a dual purpose peace of equipment removing organics / aeration

 

[BubblesandSqueak]

In the RFS 27, there’s a 2.5” space to adjust baffles between the Fuge and the return pump. Was planning on placing extra media in mine.