Replacing gate valve.... help

[John A!10]

FlexPVC.com
They have every possible thing you can imagine.

I still couldn't find a true union gate valve. I think they just don't make them.

 

[John A!10]

Thank you, yes I saw that. Not all ball valves are of the same quality. A garbage ball valve from home depot is not the same as a cepex one. Just throwing out options for OP.

Yes, is still bought a $20 ball vale while not a cepex I still don't think it's much big a difference. It's not just this one it is often heard that a gate valve will give you more control.

 

[John A!10]

On another topic, the reason for adding unions to the gate valve have also been discussed, and there isn't a good reason, so it's more of a question to the reason for the unions. If it's to clean the gate valve, good quality ones like spears can be disassembled and gate removed for cleaning, so the need for the union should be minimal.

if I had started with a gate valve I wouldn't have added a union, the reason I want a union is because I don't want to cut the plumbing and then risk running too short or not plumbing properly because of the way the tank is positioned.

 

[ca1ore]

On another topic, the reason for adding unions to the gate valve have also been discussed, and there isn't a good reason, so it's more of a question to the reason for the unions. If it's to clean the gate valve, good quality ones like spears can be disassembled and gate removed for cleaning, so the need for the union should be minimal.

I think there are good reasons; maybe not in all applications but some. I'd frankly rather clean out my gate valves in the slop sink than try to do them in situ. Personal preference I suppose.

 

[John A!10]

That may be hard to do. Unfortunately the diameter and threading of various true union ball valves are not the same. Nor are all ball valves created equally. Cheaper ones are typically harder to turn - as you are finding. The Cepex ball valves linked earlier are top quality, but I can tell you just from your picture that the unions will not match.

My ball valve is very good quality and actually very easy to turn. If I do buy unions I will buy the same brand of union that is attached currently, and test it before making any permanent changes.

 

[Reefer1978]

@John A!10 if I am understanding everything correctly, this is pretty easily solvable. You will need 2 new unions, I don't think you can re-use the existing ones, but it's a $10 hit, not horrible. Cut the pipe right above the current valve, add a union there, to gate valve, to another union on the bottom. Since you are adding your own unions, you get some room to play with on every side as your new unions don't need to go right to the gate valve, you can add some space like 1 inch on each side.

 

[Uncle99]

I still couldn't find a true union gate valve. I think they just don't make them.

Sorry, I must miss the boat.
I’d have the cut out and replaced with a quality gate valve in 5 minutes for 20 bucks.
1 gate, 2 adaptors, done....$20 bucks

 

[John A!10]

@John A!10 if I am understanding everything correctly, this is pretty easily solvable. You will need 2 new unions, I don't think you can re-use the existing ones, but it's a $10 hit, not horrible. Cut the pipe right above the current valve, add a union there, to gate valve, to another union on the bottom. Since you are adding your own unions, you get some room to play with on every side as your new unions don't need to go right to the gate valve, you can add some space like 1 inch on each side.

Instead of cutting cant is use the other matching side of the union. Making sure that I contact the brand and that the threads are matching.

 

[Reefer1978]

Instead of cutting cant is use the other matching side of the union. Making sure that I contact the brand and that the threads are matching.

I don't understand why? First you have to find the exact same unions, and you are hoping the same company will use the same identical thread on their unions and ball valves - which there are no guarantees to. Second - space will not be the same, ball valves and gate valves are not the same identical size, so you will be off by .5-1" - not sure if that's ok with your system - all of mine are hard plumbed into the sumps so a huge no go for me personally.

There's a simple way to solve this, but you are thinking about over-engineering it. If it's to save $10 on unions - I don't think it's worth it. If there's another valid reason - I may be missing it. Just my 5 cents.

 

[Uncle99]

I still couldn't find a true union gate valve. I think they just don't make them.

I’m not sure what a “true” union gate valve is.
All the measurements to size up “your” two female unions with a “new” $17.41 gate valve with male ends are shown on Flexpvc.com.

Yours looks pretty standard stuff and provided the body of the new gate valve is roughly the same length, your worst case scenario is having to cut the bottom piece, so also purchase 1 female connector is case.

You just want to replace the valve. That should not be hard.

 

[John A!10]

I’m not sure what a “true” union gate valve is.
All the measurements to size up “your” two female unions with a “new” $17.41 gate valve with male ends are shown on Flexpvc.com.

Yours looks pretty standard stuff and provided the body of the new gate valve is roughly the same length, your worst case scenario is having to cut the bottom piece, so also purchase 1 female connector is case.

You just want to replace the valve. That should not be hard.

I’m ordering two unions a gate valve and a coupling just in case I have to attach another piece of PVC.

 

[Gup]

So when I plumed my return I used a true union ball valve. It is really hard to get the right amount of water flowing. It’s always either too low in the overflow or too high and going down my emergency. I haven’t found any true union gate valves, how can I add one without cutting anything or lowering the plumbing too much into the sump by adding a union.

Your post caught my eye, which is perfect timing .

You are so right in your complaint about the ball valve used for your return to your sump. You are fortunate to have plumbed with what appears to me to be schedule 80 PVC. My system came equipped with schedule 20 abs pipe. It is impossible to get a gate valve to replace it. Later today, I'm putting in a call to Zoro Plumbing online. I have to get whatever is closest in schedule 80, to my schedule 20 OD. Then I plan to use neoprene o'rings to make up the difference along with GE Silicone

I am going to put a gate valve in after the ball valve. That way I can make my repair with the ball valve off. I highly recommend you do likewise ASAP. I've labored over the same problem for 3 months. Best of luck

 

[John A!10]

Your post caught my eye, which is perfect timing .

You are so right in your complaint about the ball valve used for your return to your sump. You are fortunate to have plumbed with what appears to me to be schedule 80 PVC. My system came equipped with schedule 20 abs pipe. It is impossible to get a gate valve to replace it. Later today, I'm putting in a call to Zoro Plumbing online. I have to get whatever is closest in schedule 80, to my schedule 20 OD. Then I plan to use neoprene o'rings to make up the difference along with GE Silicone

I am going to put a gate valve in after the ball valve. That way I can make my repair with the ball valve off. I highly recommend you do likewise ASAP. I've labored over the same problem for 3 months. Best of luck

Very interesting. I actually plumbed my tank with schedule 40 PVC from Home Depot. Good luck on your plumbing.

 

[ca1ore]

I still couldn't find a true union gate valve. I think they just don't make them.

 

[takitaj]

I'd suggest you just put a gate valve right after the ball valve. 2 advantages; 1) you can still turn off the drain if you needed to and not have to re-adjust the gate valve 2) you still have the ball valve union if you ever need to temporarily remove that part of the plumbing.

It's easy to figure how much to cut. Measure the width of the valve then measure the depth of the slip joint, then subtract 2 times the slip joint depth from the width. Cut that much out of the pipe for the gate valve.

 

[dadnjesse]

Do you have a link for that valve

 

[Viva'sReef]

They do not exist in the format you are looking for.

Cut the ball valve out and put in a regular slip Gate valve. There is no purpose for a true union gate valve is there? It has a removable gate that can be taken off and cleaned without complete removal

 

[Viva'sReef]

Do you have a link for that valve

I think he made that himself with separate unions and small pieces of pipe so they are flush

 

[Viva'sReef]

The part I circled still comes apart for cleaning and maintenance which would be the only think I can think of that you'd need to do other than tearing apart the tank to move it

 

[ca1ore]

Do you have a link for that valve

Yeah, sorry, meant to come back and add a comment. It’s just a standard Spears gate valve with a couple of unions welded on each end.