Royal Gramma Pale/White and Flashing

[Cornelia_Reefer]

I have a 30 Gallon Red Sea Nano Max G2 XL which was setup 81 days ago. My last numbers are:

Temperature: 77.3
Salinity: 33.5 ppt
pH: 7.7
Nitrate: 6.6 ppm
Phosphate: 0.18 ppm
Alkalinity: 6.6 dKH

I do a 12L water change with seawater I make from RODI I make and Red Sea Salt.

I got a Royal Gramma from an LFS 51 days ago and did my best to do an observation QT with at least 15 minutes a day of solid direct observation. On some days I observed for hours. During that time I saw flashing exactly once. She ate happily from day one.

I placed her in my DT 38 days ago. Until two days ago she seemed healthy and eating.

I added two Biota clownfish to the tank 20 day ago. I only did one week observation since they came from Biota and the cycle had gone in my QT tank.

I'm doing a slow light acclimation so my lights aren't very bright. I decided to turn them on in full white mode for observation two days ago and noticed that her purple are appeared as if there was a white sheen. Life interfered and I haven't been able to follow up until today. As of two hours or so she has been constantly flashing.

She still ate at the feeding 1:30 minutes ago. But she is flashing almost constantly now.

I don't have the QT tank setup right now, but I can make some saltwater and get it setup relatively quickly if needed. I have ich-x.

I'm still getting the ropes which is why my numbers are so out of wack. I had my hannia salinity checker drift and I didn't realize, which is why my salinity is so low. But that would have happened gradually with water changes, not all at once.

My water has a bunch of small floating objects. I assumed they were just detritus and I haven't gotten my flow setup correctly, but who knows.

I am an absolute beginner in the saltwater world, so please be patient with me.

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

I'm not great at getting photos, these are the best I could get.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

The gramma’s tail is shredded, there is some aggression going on. #f#fishmedicsor more help.

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

I haven’t seen any aggression except at feeding time and even then no nipping or anything.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

Did you buy the fish with a shredded tail? In that case it might have happened at the LFS. But if the tail was intact when you bought it, then it happened in your tank. There is rarely aggression when we are in the room, it happens when they are alone. The fishmedics will be able to help more, good luck.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I'm not great at getting photos, these are the best I could get.

I suspect flukes which they are prone two and the damage likely from scratching. Have you noticed the fish itching, sudden darting or hiding?

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

I'm not great at getting photos, these are the best I could get.

I suspect flukes which they are prone two and the damage likely from scratching. Have you noticed the fish itching, sudden darting or hiding?

It’s often hid from the day it was added to the DT. She has a little cave that’s her home base. But she only darts there if I come towards the tank suddenly or lights suddenly flip on. And she always comes out when I cut the pumps to feed them.

I thought that most likely and planned on buying prazi tomorrow when the stores are open.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

It’s often hid from the day it was added to the DT. She has a little cave that’s her home base. But she only darts there if I come towards the tank suddenly or lights suddenly flip on. And she always comes out when I cut the pumps to feed them.

I thought that most likely and planned on buying prazi tomorrow when the stores are open.

I agree, this is probably flukes. I also think that the shredded tail, although pretty minor, bears watching as it could get worse.

Your pH is a bit low for a newly set up tank. If you trust your measurement device, then I would add an air stone to see if there is any carbon dioxide that can be driven off to try and raise the pH.

For dosing praziquantel, here is a post I made with general instructions for the various products out there:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/dosing-praziquantel-pzq.1105700/

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

My tank is in the basement and there’s a lot of co2 in the air. I’m planning on getting a CO2 scrubber when I can.

Thanks, I’ll start on that immediately.

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

It’s often hid from the day it was added to the DT. She has a little cave that’s her home base. But she only darts there if I come towards the tank suddenly or lights suddenly flip on. And she always comes out when I cut the pumps to feed them.

I thought that most likely and planned on buying prazi tomorrow when the stores are open.

I started the prazipro pro treatment yesterday.

But today I see the clowns are also now covered in a light powder dusting. That fish is also flashing. Is this ich? Should I start an ich-x treatment?

Feeling kind of guilty right now. I’m not off to a great start.

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

I started the prazipro pro treatment yesterday.

But today I see the clowns are also now covered in a light powder dusting. That fish is also flashing. Is this ich? Should I start an ich-x treatment?

Feeling kind of guilty right now. I’m not off to a great start.

 

[Fish Fan]

That looks like Brooklynella to me, something that Clownfish are particularly susceptible to. Do you have access to Ruby Reef Rally Pro?
https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/rall...E4tNEsigPgkBQToyYdROseeQg929MdWa5jbABCbyheyej

 

[Fish Fan]

I started the prazipro pro treatment yesterday.

But today I see the clowns are also now covered in a light powder dusting. That fish is also flashing. Is this ich? Should I start an ich-x treatment?

Feeling kind of guilty right now. I’m not off to a great start.

That looks like Brooklynella to me, something that Clownfish are particularly susceptible to. Do you have access to Ruby Reef Rally Pro?
https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/rall...E4tNEsigPgkBQToyYdROseeQg929MdWa5jbABCbyheyej

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

I tried every local shop and none of them carry it. I’ve ordered some but it won’t be here until Tuesday.

Is there anything I can do until it comes?

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I started the prazipro pro treatment yesterday.

But today I see the clowns are also now covered in a light powder dusting. That fish is also flashing. Is this ich? Should I start an ich-x treatment?

Feeling kind of guilty right now. I’m not off to a great start.

Can you post a video of the clownfish? I need that to tell if the us brooklynella versus other issues.

This came on since Friday? That’s very fast…..

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

I started the prazipro pro treatment yesterday.

But today I see the clowns are also now covered in a light powder dusting. That fish is also flashing. Is this ich? Should I start an ich-x treatment?

Feeling kind of guilty right now. I’m not off to a great start.

Can you post a video of the clownfish? I need that to tell if the us brooklynella versus other issues.

This came on since Friday? That’s very fast…..

Looking back through my logs, I thought the royal gramma looked discolored on 09/12, but she was eating and behaving normally and to be honest it slipped my mind.

I noticed again on the 23rd two days before I posted here.

I didn’t see anything on the clowns until today.

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

They are up towards the front right because I turned off the pumps so they think it’s food time.

 

[astrofish]

Your tank looks super clean, with almost no algae of any kind, even after 3 months. I guess it's still pretty early to put fish that are disease prone. People say clownfish is tough but in my experience they aren't. They are only tough in mature tank environment, but they get ick very easily in newer tanks... If you want fish, stick to fish like gobby or bottom feeders. Very tough tho!

I went through this same "disease phase" when I first started my tank years ago. It felt like whatever fish I added would get ich or some other disease, or just die within a few weeks.

It finally stopped after I stopped adding new fish for a few months and just let the tank mature. I didn't reset the system or clean. From what I remember, it took at least 6–8 months before things really stabilized. Once the tank matured, I rarely had problems with ich or other diseases anymore, assuming the fish I added were healthy to begin with.

Unfortunately, clowns with brook are really difficult to save once it gets to the stage shown in your picture. If he's still actively eating, though, there's definitely still some hope with proper treatment and care.

Personally, I'd avoid copper with the small sized fish like clown. It's pretty harsh, especially when the fish is already weak. The royal gramma is pretty tough, so hopefully he'll pull through.

I'd move the sick fish into a separate treatment tank or bucket and keep the water extremely clean. Frequent water changes can help a lot with ick. Some shops also use tank-transfer-type (few water changes a day) methods for ich rather than immediately relying on harsher medications.

Most importantly, keep them eating. Give them nutritious food, keep them well fed, and try to keep stress as low as possible so their immune systems have the best chance of fighting it.

For now I would stop adding new fish. Just let your tank mature. To cycle your tank faster, I recommend you get live rock, bio media or established water from shops or natural sea water. It takes a lot of time to mature with death rock, brand new water, and sand.

Good luck! Hopefully they pull through.

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

Your tank looks super clean, with almost no algae of any kind, even after 3 months. I guess it's still pretty early to put fish that are disease prone. People say clownfish is tough but in my experience they aren't. They are only tough in mature tank environment, but they get ick very easily in newer tanks... If you want fish, stick to fish like gobby or bottom feeders. Very tough tho!

I went through this same "disease phase" when I first started my tank years ago. It felt like whatever fish I added would get ich or some other disease, or just die within a few weeks.

It finally stopped after I stopped adding new fish for a few months and just let the tank mature. I didn't reset the system or clean. From what I remember, it took at least 6–8 months before things really stabilized. Once the tank matured, I rarely had problems with ich or other diseases anymore, assuming the fish I added were healthy to begin with.

Unfortunately, clowns with brook are really difficult to save once it gets to the stage shown in your picture. If he's still actively eating, though, there's definitely still some hope with proper treatment and care.

Personally, I'd avoid copper with the small sized fish like clown. It's pretty harsh, especially when the fish is already weak. The royal gramma is pretty tough, so hopefully he'll pull through.

I'd move the sick fish into a separate treatment tank or bucket and keep the water extremely clean. Frequent water changes can help a lot with ick. Some shops also use tank-transfer-type (few water changes a day) methods for ich rather than immediately relying on harsher medications.

Most importantly, keep them eating. Give them nutritious food, keep them well fed, and try to keep stress as low as possible so their immune systems have the best chance of fighting it.

For now I would stop adding new fish. Just let your tank mature. To cycle your tank faster, I recommend you get live rock, bio media or established water from shops or natural sea water. It takes a lot of time to mature with death rock, brand new water, and sand.

Good luck! Hopefully they pull through.

I hadn’t planned on any more fish, I was just trying to get things stable with this stocking level. It’s only a 30 gallon.

Honestly, I thought I was taking it slow and steady. I added bottled bacteria and did a fishless cycle. I added TBS live rock and sand, microbacter 7, and PNS deep cycle. I kept the first fish in QT for 30 days observing it under bright light every day.

The lack of algae may be because I started off with my lighting at a very low percentage and have it set to ramp up over 40 days.

 

[Cornelia_Reefer]

I did only keep the clownfish in a QT tank for a week. I was under the impression that it would be relatively safe since they were ordered directly from the breeder.