SCA 50 PNP basic sump questions

[Philipgonzales3]

Hi,

I am heavily thinking about getting into saltwater tanks. It all started when my girlfriend wanted one of those "cute" Red Ear slider turtles about 6 years ago. She quickly lost interest in it and I started reading up about their space requirements and got a 40 gallon breeder with the heat lamp/floating dock and what not. I then got a 55 gallon tank that I cycled with the turtle and eventually had a handful of Cichlids. Had that setup for a couple of years and then we moved and were unable to bring then with us so we gave them away to our LFS.

With my turtles I ran a Filstar XP XL Canister filter and an internal Fluval U3 filter and I believe for the fish I ran a XP L. Or something like that.

My point is that I have never bought an aquarium with a sump before. I want to do a FOWLR with two Ocellaris Clown fish. The current house we rent is only like 880 square feet, so I have been approved of approximately a 2 foot by 2 foot square by the boss...I mean my wife.

I was going to get this one.https://m.drsfostersmith.com/Product...m?pcatid=21183. All items are 20% off with a promo code.

All the supplies (RODI 100gpd, sand, test kit, heater, hydrometer, etc.) come out to 645 before tax and 521 with the promo code.

So it's perfect right? Well I'm like 28 gallons is pretty small and I know I'll want to add more fish in the future. I'm thinking a six line wrasse and maybe a red star fish. I would love a blue tang or whatever Dory is but I think that will have to wait until we move and buy our own house.

Anyway there is the life story, now down to my question.

Would the SCA 50 PNP be overkill for my needs? Like is a sump/protein skimmer, etc of much value in a FOWLR tank? Assuming I never go to reef keeping?

http://www.scaquariums.com/product-p/sca-50gpnpb.htm

If I do get the SA 50 PNP should I ask for anything special to be able to convert it over from flexible tubing to PVC? Different bulkheads? Should I ask for it to be drilled for a Herbie setup? I'm kind of confused how exactly the tank is drilled and what I would need to do to modify it and also what to run in each chamber. I believe I would want to add a check valve to the return and a ball valve to the supply? I've never plumbed anything so any advice/direction would be great.

 

[davocean]

I have an SCA myself, very happy w/it and their customer service is awesome.
I would very much lean that way over the biocube.

If you are going to do custom drill or overflow I strongly suggest doing the shadow overflow w/ a bean animal drain, that would be best.
This would be a tank that would help you as you advance in hobby and would keep for a long while.

No check valves, keep locklines up high for early siphon break.

There is a very long running thread for SCA owners I can post that might really help you

 

[davocean]

This thread spans years, most of what you need to know would be last handful of pages.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2450598

 

[Philipgonzales3]

I have an SCA myself, very happy w/it and their customer service is awesome.
I would very much lean that way over the biocube.

If you are going to do custom drill or overflow I strongly suggest doing the shadow overflow w/ a bean animal drain, that would be best.
This would be a tank that would help you as you advance in hobby and would keep for a long while.

No check valves, keep locklines up high for early siphon break.

There is a very long running thread for SCA owners I can post that might really help you

Ok, thanks. Maybe I should just stick with the Durso for simplicity. Honestly I have never even worked with PVC before so I'm a little unclear on how the PVC connects to the bulkhead. I've been watching different videos from BRS TV and have been skimming the build thread on this forum. Since the SCA 50 PNP comes with flexible tubing I was curious as to if I need different bulkheads or an adapter.

I am a bit intimidated as it looks like there are so many options to customizing a sump. If I do get the SCA 50 PMP I will likely need some guidance on the plumbing and extra supplies.

For now the plan is FOWLR, live sand for substrate. Reef Saver Dry Live Rock. I would want at least some mechanical filtration. I think one of those sock things, maybe some sponge type? I wouldn't mind cleaning them weekly in tank water. I am not looking at getting into any coral or refugium or anything advanced yet.

 

[davocean]

I have a durso as that is what mine came set up for stock, and it's fine, but I wish it was the shadow w/ a bean drain, and really it's no more complicated than any other sump and drain set up, but I totally understand this stuff sounds intimidating when new to sumps.

There are a lot of people on that thread that can walk you through it, and there is also an SCA thread on this site too, and plenty here that would assist on the finer points.

You will want some corals as time goes, it's just too simple to add at least softies, you will have the vessel, everyone comes to this point eventually.

We don't use a lot of mechanical filtration like FW, no sponge or pads, they often become nitrate sinks, and while many do use socks, they must be changed every 3-4 days or they will bump trates

 

[Philipgonzales3]

I have a durso as that is what mine came set up for stock, and it's fine, but I wish it was the shadow w/ a bean drain, and really it's no more complicated than any other sump and drain set up, but I totally understand this stuff sounds intimidating when new to sumps.

There are a lot of people on that thread that can walk you through it, and there is also an SCA thread on this site too, and plenty here that would assist on the finer points.

You will want some corals as time goes, it's just too simple to add at least softies, you will have the vessel, everyone comes to this point eventually.

We don't use a lot of mechanical filtration like FW, no sponge or pads, they often become nitrate sinks, and while many do use socks, they must be changed every 3-4 days or they will bump trates

I will keep that in mind. I guess I am used to FW and turtles. I used to run two trays of sponges, a little bit of polyfil and a tray of ceramic. Old habits are hard to break. I'll let you know which option I go with. I am awaiting a reply from SCA about any discount on the grey wood stand as it will match our kitchen table. This will go a long way as far as the WAF goes.

 

[davocean]

Most of us started w/ FW, and the best thing most of us have done is take a great deal of that experience and throw it right out the window!
It helps a little in understanding certain things, but they are 2 different animals, and it takes most a while to ditch the mentality and methods that come w/ FW exp.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

Most of us started w/ FW, and the best thing most of us have done is take a great deal of that experience and throw it right out the window!
It helps a little in understanding certain things, but they are 2 different animals, and it takes most a while to ditch the mentality and methods that come w/ FW exp.

Still no reply from SC aquariums yet. Called the 800 number today an no answer.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/R-amp-J-...HVXYTxmnxWvLGfahBdHlUL-aFqr6YqMMaApjgEALw_wcB

This looks kind of appealing but probably best to wait. Since I prefer the dimensension for the 50 gallon cube. I decided on a Herbie style overflow setup. Barrett on one of the build threads helped me figure out what plumbing I would need for this.

 

[davocean]

Still no reply from SC aquariums yet. Called the 800 number today an no answer.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/R-amp-J-...HVXYTxmnxWvLGfahBdHlUL-aFqr6YqMMaApjgEALw_wcB

This looks kind of appealing but probably best to wait. Since I prefer the dimensension for the 50 gallon cube. I decided on a Herbie style overflow setup. Barrett on one of the build threads helped me figure out what plumbing I would need for this.

I have to imagine w/ the Holiday and black Friday/Cyber Monday they could possibly be busy, but I'd be surprised if it takes long for them to reply.

I've never heard of that tank manufacturer from walmart, but keep in mind it's acrylic, and looks like an MDF stand.

 

[mattzang]

i have the SCA 50 gallon, i got it from my lfs for 600, but upgraded the stand to a taller one made of real wood for 100 more. ive seen the same tanks lurking on offerup and craigslist here and there. some added risk, but if money is tight maybe worth a shot

the sump perplexed me too, and thats with the lfs having the same exact tank setup at their store, but now that i have it, its really pretty simple. water pours into one chamber (put whatever u want in there, i got a filter sock holder and a filter cup, i toss some filter floss in there once or twice a week, also have some marinepure balls and a poly filter. then it goes into the skimmer section, put the skimmer in there. then the middle chamber is kind of whatever you want. i'm trying to do a refugium, but it's a really small section. so i have more marinepure balls, miracle mud, and chaeto. then in the last chamber put the return pump in. (and for good measure i have a bag of seachem matrix. i didnt do any hard plumbing. i did pay way too much for some nice tubing from an lfs (buy it from a pool store). i think the tanks all come with the bean animal overflow (3 holes) 1 is for return pump, other 2 for drains. make one higher than the other and it makes it quieter i guess?

im a big fan of the tank, cant beat the price. glass is nice and clear. if you want to go all out replace the return plumbing with black pipe because the white really stands out in a bad way.

if you end up getting it and want some pics of the sump ill send u some

 

[Philipgonzales3]

I have to imagine w/ the Holiday and black Friday/Cyber Monday they could possibly be busy, but I'd be surprised if it takes long for them to reply.

I've never heard of that tank manufacturer from walmart, but keep in mind it's acrylic, and looks like an MDF stand.

Steve must have saw my post because he replied to my email late last night. I was actually afraid that I may have offended him because I asked him to throw in the stand for free. I feel bad asking for such a discount but this endeavour is going to hit the pocketbook pretty good. I am honestly feeling a little guilty about spending this much money on "myself", but I work hard, I suppose I should just stop overthinking it and enjoy it. As I expected he was not able to throw in the stand for free but did offer a fair discount, which on top of the sale price I thought was more than fair. I am hoping to be order today. Wohoo!

 

[homer1475]

Love my SCA 80G cube tank. The stock sump on the other hand......... But if your not used to plumbing or knowing how you want a sump setup, then the stock will work just fine.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

i have the SCA 50 gallon, i got it from my lfs for 600, but upgraded the stand to a taller one made of real wood for 100 more. ive seen the same tanks lurking on offerup and craigslist here and there. some added risk, but if money is tight maybe worth a shot

the sump perplexed me too, and thats with the lfs having the same exact tank setup at their store, but now that i have it, its really pretty simple. water pours into one chamber (put whatever u want in there, i got a filter sock holder and a filter cup, i toss some filter floss in there once or twice a week, also have some marinepure balls and a poly filter. then it goes into the skimmer section, put the skimmer in there. then the middle chamber is kind of whatever you want. i'm trying to do a refugium, but it's a really small section. so i have more marinepure balls, miracle mud, and chaeto. then in the last chamber put the return pump in. (and for good measure i have a bag of seachem matrix. i didnt do any hard plumbing. i did pay way too much for some nice tubing from an lfs (buy it from a pool store). i think the tanks all come with the bean animal overflow (3 holes) 1 is for return pump, other 2 for drains. make one higher than the other and it makes it quieter i guess?

im a big fan of the tank, cant beat the price. glass is nice and clear. if you want to go all out replace the return plumbing with black pipe because the white really stands out in a bad way.

if you end up getting it and want some pics of the sump ill send u some

3 holes is Herbie, bean animal actually has 3 drains and one return for a total of 4 holes. Assuming you ran the return through a bulkhead and not over the tank, which would look tacky in my opinion,. I have been watching videos on overflows lol. I would love to see a pic of your Sump. For this filter sock holder and filter cup, are these a one size fit all type of thing or is there a specific one to get for our sumps? Any links would be appreciated. I am going to Copy Barrett's sump plumbing. Schedule 40 red PVC with Schedule 80 fittings. About $150 in just PVC alone!

First page a few posts down you can see a pic of it.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/sca-50-gal-build-thread.302883/

 

[Why-Me]

3 holes is Herbie, bean animal actually has 3 drains and one return for a total of 4 holes. Assuming you ran the return through a bulkhead and not over the tank, which would look tacky in my opinion,. I have been watching videos on overflows lol. I would love to see a pic of your Sump. For this filter sock holder and filter cup, are these a one size fit all type of thing or is there a specific one to get for our sumps? Any links would be appreciated. I am going to Copy Barrett's sump plumbing. Schedule 40 red PVC with Schedule 80 fittings. About $150 in just PVC alone!

First page a few posts down you can see a pic of it.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/sca-50-gal-build-thread.302883/

This site will help you wrap your mind around what needs to be done and what goes where and most importantly WHY.
http://gmacreef.com/herbie-overflow-reef-tank-plumbing-method-basics/

Here is a great place for the sump info as well, same site.
http://gmacreef.com/reef-aquarium-sump-tank-design/
There's a great pic close to the top of a "Basic Three Chamber Sump Design" which is what will be coming with your sca 50...a basic 3 chamber sump

 

[mattzang]

3 holes is Herbie, bean animal actually has 3 drains and one return for a total of 4 holes. Assuming you ran the return through a bulkhead and not over the tank, which would look tacky in my opinion,. I have been watching videos on overflows lol. I would love to see a pic of your Sump. For this filter sock holder and filter cup, are these a one size fit all type of thing or is there a specific one to get for our sumps? Any links would be appreciated. I am going to Copy Barrett's sump plumbing. Schedule 40 red PVC with Schedule 80 fittings. About $150 in just PVC alone!

First page a few posts down you can see a pic of it.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/sca-50-gal-build-thread.302883/

yeah that's what I was going for, see how little I know and haven't royally messed up yet? lol

that's basically what my sump looks like, I have cluttered it up big time with adding a ton of marinepure balls and other stuff. i really need to remove a bunch of stuff in there. maybe use the first section just for any kind of media you want to do, skimmer section clear of stuff, then just pack in the marinepure balls in the refugium. i kinda went overboard on bio media as my display had way too much rock (still does..)

i'd also add a lot of people were not big fans of the stock return pump and stock skimmer. i have replaced both, however, they weren't really performing badly. after a water change my return pump wasn't able to return water to the tank, so i thought it was the check valve, replaced that, still nothing. freaked out, went to lfs, bought a new return pump. got that going, still nothing.. turns out i had to clean the return jets, some macroalgae had gotten in there and blocked it, lol. so not the return pumps fault, but now i have two return pumps

skimmer was decentish, did the job i guess, but it was always needing to be tinkered with, so i ordered an aquamaxx fc80 from marine depot last week, hoping that'll do a better job. i have 8 fish in my tank which i think is definitely in the realm of heavy bioload so yeah. perhaps $160 i didn't need to spend, but it didn't sound like people had the stock skimmers last for super long. backup skimmer ready to go i guess

https://www.marinedepot.com/AquaMax...ilter_Media-AquaMaxx-UJ94531-FIFMMEFS-vi.html

https://www.marinedepot.com/High_Fl...imer_Machine_Shop_LLC-6V3465-FIFMMEFS-vi.html

you could go with the bigger cup i guess, i think the two section in the sump are both the same 8 in x 8 in. the 4 inch cup seems to overflow fairly quickly (3-4 days) with filter floss in there

like i said i just used tubing for plumbing stuff, so i dont really know the advantages or disadvantages of hard plumbing. that stuff was way beyond me, people throwing in manifolds and stuff. i dont have any reactors

and lastly i just have 1 ai prime on my tank as of now. it does the job for sure, and if youre smarter about aquascaping than me you could probably get away with it. i bought a massive shelf rock that kinda takes away the lower areas of the tank and if my corals grow out ill probably need a second light. i think you said youre just going FOWLR, so not an issue for you, until you decide in a couple months you want corals! it'll happen! i started just wanting some basic saltwater fish and before i knew it the corals were in my tank.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

This site will help you wrap your mind around what needs to be done and what goes where and most importantly WHY.
http://gmacreef.com/herbie-overflow-reef-tank-plumbing-method-basics/

Here is a great place for the sump info as well, same site.
http://gmacreef.com/reef-aquarium-sump-tank-design/
There's a great pic close to the top of a "Basic Three Chamber Sump Design" which is what will be coming with your sca 50...a basic 3 chamber sump

Thanks, I actually read the first article multiple times. I've been "studying" about sump and now have a basic understanding of the herbie and how to "tune" it, the wet vs dry emergency arguments, etc. Still a lot of other things I don't understand like what a manifold is, but I'm feeling better about the plumbing ahead.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

yeah that's what I was going for, see how little I know and haven't royally messed up yet? lol

that's basically what my sump looks like, I have cluttered it up big time with adding a ton of marinepure balls and other stuff. i really need to remove a bunch of stuff in there. maybe use the first section just for any kind of media you want to do, skimmer section clear of stuff, then just pack in the marinepure balls in the refugium. i kinda went overboard on bio media as my display had way too much rock (still does..)

i'd also add a lot of people were not big fans of the stock return pump and stock skimmer. i have replaced both, however, they weren't really performing badly. after a water change my return pump wasn't able to return water to the tank, so i thought it was the check valve, replaced that, still nothing. freaked out, went to lfs, bought a new return pump. got that going, still nothing.. turns out i had to clean the return jets, some macroalgae had gotten in there and blocked it, lol. so not the return pumps fault, but now i have two return pumps

skimmer was decentish, did the job i guess, but it was always needing to be tinkered with, so i ordered an aquamaxx fc80 from marine depot last week, hoping that'll do a better job. i have 8 fish in my tank which i think is definitely in the realm of heavy bioload so yeah. perhaps $160 i didn't need to spend, but it didn't sound like people had the stock skimmers last for super long. backup skimmer ready to go i guess

https://www.marinedepot.com/AquaMax...ilter_Media-AquaMaxx-UJ94531-FIFMMEFS-vi.html

https://www.marinedepot.com/High_Fl...imer_Machine_Shop_LLC-6V3465-FIFMMEFS-vi.html

you could go with the bigger cup i guess, i think the two section in the sump are both the same 8 in x 8 in. the 4 inch cup seems to overflow fairly quickly (3-4 days) with filter floss in there

like i said i just used tubing for plumbing stuff, so i dont really know the advantages or disadvantages of hard plumbing. that stuff was way beyond me, people throwing in manifolds and stuff. i dont have any reactors

and lastly i just have 1 ai prime on my tank as of now. it does the job for sure, and if youre smarter about aquascaping than me you could probably get away with it. i bought a massive shelf rock that kinda takes away the lower areas of the tank and if my corals grow out ill probably need a second light. i think you said youre just going FOWLR, so not an issue for you, until you decide in a couple months you want corals! it'll happen! i started just wanting some basic saltwater fish and before i knew it the corals were in my tank.

Thanks for the info. Any reason for so much biological and mechanical filtration? From what I've read live rock is the best bio filtration for saltwater. It seems many people run the sock thing but not the polyfil / filter floss right? Or do they put polyfil and filter floss in their sock. Hmm I'm going to consult YouTube videos. Are polyfil and filter floss the same thing? I thought they were? Sorry obviously I still have a lot of questions to things. I'll get there slowly but surely.

 

[Philipgonzales3]

This site will help you wrap your mind around what needs to be done and what goes where and most importantly WHY.
http://gmacreef.com/herbie-overflow-reef-tank-plumbing-method-basics/

Here is a great place for the sump info as well, same site.
http://gmacreef.com/reef-aquarium-sump-tank-design/
There's a great pic close to the top of a "Basic Three Chamber Sump Design" which is what will be coming with your sca 50...a basic 3 chamber sump

Do you think it is unreasonable to think I can plumb my sump, fill with sand/rock and water in one day. I ask because of how patient you are at waiting to set yours up. Should that be an unreasonable time frame?

One more question. I already have this light I used to use on my 20 gallon chiclid fry tank. Will this light do me any good. It's a little too long but the feet adjust inward. I have 3 daylight bulbs in it.

Aqueon Modular LED Aquarium Light Fixture, 30-Inch https://www.amazon.com/dp/B009P63VGU/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_sf0.BbF0QPC12

 

[mattzang]

Thanks for the info. Any reason for so much biological and mechanical filtration? From what I've read live rock is the best bio filtration for saltwater. It seems many people run the sock thing but not the polyfil / filter floss right? Or do they put polyfil and filter floss in their sock. Hmm I'm going to consult YouTube videos. Are polyfil and filter floss the same thing? I thought they were? Sorry obviously I still have a lot of questions to things. I'll get there slowly but surely.

i just was under the impression the more biofilter the better, so i went all out on rock and biomedia. i kinda wish i'd done less rock and about the same amount of biomedia in the sump.

polyfilter i think is especially good at removing particulates from the water.. and people like it. i just imitate what other people do

https://www.marinedepot.com/Poly_Fi...oly_Bio_Marine-PB1111-FIFMMEPM-PB1111-vi.html

filter floss just kinda removes gunky stuff i think. shrug, there's just a lot of videos that swear by poly filter lol. my water seems pretty clear so something is doing something right. i figure the more stuff i can just manually remove from the water the better, rather than rely on the skimmer or something. if i had a bigger refugium i'd maybe worry less about floss.

 

[Why-Me]

Do you think it is unreasonable to think I can plumb my sump, fill with sand/rock and water in one day. I ask because of how patient you are at waiting to set yours up. Should that be an unreasonable time frame?

One more question. I already have this light I used to use on my 20 gallon chiclid fry tank. Will this light do me any good. It's a little too long but the feet adjust inward. I have 3 daylight bulbs in it.

Aqueon Modular LED Aquarium Light Fixture, 30-Inch https://www.amazon.com/dp/B009P63VGU/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_sf0.BbF0QPC12

(IMO) I would let the plumbing dry a day to fully cure and air out, also depending on your situation it may take a while for you to produce 50+ gallons of RO/DI water. Timing isn't unreasonable, just make sure not to rush it so you don't have to pull it apart or start messing with it right away. That being said if it will take you anywhere near 24hrs or more to make all your water then you can start that while the plumbing is airing out/curing.
As for the light I'm not sure whether that's sufficient or not. I'm sure it will do fine for the time being but you may want to upgrade if you want corals.