Should I be worried? Dots all over quarantined fish

[Slocke]

+1 on this looking like marine ich on that wrasse.

It may take days before the other fish start to show it. You *might* be able to manage it in your display with a powerful UV, nightly siphoning of the sand and perhaps using polyp lab medic , a peroxide salt. Otherwise, if it spreads you’ll need to separate the fish from the inverts and run hypo or copper on the fish.
Jay

Did the fish definitely have this before getting to my tank or could it have gotten it from my tank after arriving. In other words could the fish contract ich and look like it does in the photos in less than 24 hours?

 

[Slocke]

So I've got the 10 gallon set up. I also have a 44 gallon brute can that I was about to hook up to my other tank.

Many of my fish are copepod dependent however and overall it's 18 fish. That's not including the other tank that got a fish from the same source and has 11 large fish.

 

[Slocke]

Could I get a UV recommendation. All I see on BRS is what appears to be a pipe with a light bulb in it that costs several hundred dollars.

 

[Petcrazyson]

Could I get a UV recommendation. All I see on BRS is what appears to be a pipe with a light bulb in it that costs several hundred dollars.

That is basically what a UV is lol. I don’t have any recommendations but steer clear of the CoralBox ones. They suck lol.

 

[Tcook]

Add to that, this vendor doesn’t like to ship from Dec 15-Jan5th or so.

So it's TSM?

 

[Slocke]

Sent the vendor this email along with the photos:

Good evening,

One of the quarantined fish I got from you yesterday appears to be covered in ich. Otherwise both fish seem really healthy but having ich negates all that. I’ve only ever heard great things about you so maybe I’m wrong. I don’t want to blame you as I do not know how quickly this can cover a fish like this. Pictures are from this morning so about 24 after entering my tank. Only realized after posting them and people pointed it out tonight. As far as I know I have never had ich before and I photograph my fish and post the pictures most days. None have ever appeared to have dots like this.


You have no idea how much self control it took to be that nice....

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Did the fish definitely have this before getting to my tank or could it have gotten it from my tank after arriving. In other words could the fish contract ich and look like it does in the photos in less than 24 hours?

If this is ich (visual IDs are never 100%) then I would say yes, the fish had tomonts on its skin before arrival to your tank. Now, were the tomonts large enough to see prior to shipment? Perhaps not.

In your second photo, I can count about 20 white spots on the right side of the fish and its fins. IMO, if there was ich in your tank that would cause that many tomonts in 24 hours, then I cannot see how that could have happened without some other fish, already in your tank, having active ich.

Just seeing white spots is not confirmation of ich. Mucus plugs, microsporidians and even sand grains also cause white spots on fish. You need to try and confirm it is ich through other clues - spots on the clear parts of fins (which I think I can clearly see) is an indication of ich over mucus plugs or microsporidians. Sand grains will fall off and not return.

With ich trophonts - they will come and go, changing location and relative number over time, say 24 to 36 hours. Sometimes, the spots go away entirely, and then return a few days later (when the disease is first starting up).


Jay

 

[Slocke]

If this is ich (visual IDs are never 100%) then I would say yes, the fish had tomonts on its skin before arrival to your tank. Now, were the tomonts large enough to see prior to shipment? Perhaps not.

In your second photo, I can count about 20 white spots on the right side of the fish and its fins. IMO, if there was ich in your tank that would cause that many tomonts in 24 hours, then I cannot see how that could have happened without some other fish, already in your tank, having active ich.

Just seeing white spots is not confirmation of ich. Mucus plugs, microsporidians and even sand grains also cause white spots on fish. You need to try and confirm it is ich through other clues - spots on the clear parts of fins (which I think I can clearly see) is an indication of ich over mucus plugs or microsporidians. Sand grains will fall off and not return.

With ich trophonts - they will come and go, changing location and relative number over time, say 24 to 36 hours. Sometimes, the spots go away entirely, and then return a few days later (when the disease is first starting up).


Jay

Thanks that's very helpful.

Though at the same time it's very disappointing to hear this about this highly respected vendor. I want to hear what they respond to my email with. However if anyone is concerned and would like to know wether their order is from this vendor you can can private message me.

 

[Slocke]

So the vendor just called me to say that he has never had ich get through his system before and that he guarantees the cost of my entire tank and livestock if it is ich and I have any losses. That is honestly incredible and I can't believe he is willing to go that far.

 

[Hungrypede]

That is amazing. Mike truly is first class.

How are the exquisite and other fish looking today?

 

[Slocke]

That is amazing. Mike truly is first class.

How are the exquisite and other fish looking today?

It's really hard to tell because it has sparkly scales around the head but I don't see anything on the fins. Mike is convinced it's not ich.
But what else could it be?

 

[Slocke]

New photos from this morning. I see no dots on the fins and the dots on the body appear blue not white and like the fish's natural color?

I have no idea though.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Could I get a UV recommendation. All I see on BRS is what appears to be a pipe with a light bulb in it that costs several hundred dollars.

No corallife or aquatop

Pentair
Lifeguard systems
aqua ultraviolet

 

[Jay Hemdal]

New photos from this morning. I see no dots on the fins and the dots on the body appear blue not white and like the fish's natural color?

I have no idea though.

Possibly mucus plugs, those can be a reaction to some stressor (and ich can cause them as well).

The reason I mentioned spots on the fins is that the clear fins don't have the same mucus producing cells as the fish's body does. Ich will infest the gills, skin and fins, while the mucus plugs just show up on the skin.

Jay

 

[Slocke]

Possibly mucus plugs, those can be a reaction to some stressor (and ich can cause them as well).

The reason I mentioned spots on the fins is that the clear fins don't have the same mucus producing cells as the fish's body does. Ich will infest the gills, skin and fins, while the mucus plugs just show up on the skin.

Jay

Thanks again!

A couple other questions if you don't mind:
How long would they stay on the fins? Because there seems to be nothing on the fins now. Also would I be seeing any signs of poor health? As the fish is still acting very healthy.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Thanks again!

A couple other questions if you don't mind:
How long would they stay on the fins? Because there seems to be nothing on the fins now. Also would I be seeing any signs of poor health? As the fish is still acting very healthy.

Not to intervene but a simple analogy to your question of how long, when you can provide GOOD water quality and also diet, you boost the immeune system and lower stress and improve the fish's overall health potential and recovery from most conditions. Test Kits give you a range of where tank is at and it is important to use the best kits possible. You invested in tank and livestock, no advantage to not do the same with test equipment.
You said fish are acting healthy - ACTING is a key term and often fish carry parasite such as flukes or ich and become noticeable at day 5. 7 and so forth.

 

[Slocke]

No corallife or aquatop

Pentair
Lifeguard systems
aqua ultraviolet

Thanks I was really struggling to find some other than aqua ultraviolet.

Not to intervene but a simple analogy to your question of how long, when you can provide GOOD water quality and also diet, you boost the immeune system and lower stress and improve the fish's overall health potential and recovery from most conditions. Test Kits give you a range of where tank is at and it is important to use the best kits possible. You invested in tank and livestock, no advantage to not do the same with test equipment.
You said fish are acting healthy - ACTING is a key term and often fish carry parasite such as flukes or ich and become noticeable at day 5. 7 and so forth.

Sorry but I'm struggling to understand this. Where did test kits come from? Do you want aquarium parameters?

The point of my question is to try and make sure this is ich. No photos before or after the two taken yesterday show spots on the fins. Nor does the video taken just after nor have I seen any. The dots (or at least many) on the body look more like its natural coloration than ich to me.

 

[Slocke]

Are these dots not natural color?

 

[Hungrypede]

Great picture!

I think you’re best bet now is to be patient. Get your QT set up in case things go south, but I think you have a few more days of watching to see if the exquisite goes south or other fish show symptoms.

 

[Cthulukelele]

Why are we not mentioning the vendor? I think this community needs to hold vendors accountable -- it will keep QT vendors honest as well as push them to increase their bio security standards.

In theory the vendor could do something, but in this case I don't agree it's the vendor's fault.

There is a very very very high chance there was ich in the display already. Depending on the location of collection and time of year, >90% of wild collected fish have ich present. An incredibly small portion of them present covered in dots.

The qt protocol is stressful to the fish. It moves from clean tank to dirty tank with almost certainly ich in the display(unless rigorous qt has been done there is an approaching 100% chance ich ends up in a display over time and can come in on inverts, rock, corals, literally anything). That stressed fish is susceptible and gets spots.

I don't see this as a vendor issue.