Skimmer Time

[GMay]

I recently reduced my skimmer run time to 6 hours. I have very low PO4 and NO4, each running frequently at or near zero based on ULR Hanna and Nyos tests respectively. I also run a refugium to help maintain low values but also dose Neonitro and Neophos to keep them up.

I was curious how others deal with this. I feed generously twice a day. I have a very mature tank, running for 6 years and the critters seem fine and grow.

I am a firm believer that it isn’t broke don’t fix it. I am just thinking of going no skimmer to help boost PO4 and NO3.

I include a picture from today as a reference.

 

[Lasse]

I would consider to run it 7/24 because the skimmer is important as a gas exchanger. If you think that it picks out to much P and N - run it without a skimmer cup. I´m not sure that a skimmer can affect the P concentration - however it can affect the N because it can aerate out NH3 gas. But as an oxygenator is it very important.

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Dan_P]

I recently reduced my skimmer run time to 6 hours. I have very low PO4 and NO4, each running frequently at or near zero based on ULR Hanna and Nyos tests respectively. I also run a refugium to help maintain low values but also dose Neonitro and Neophos to keep them up.

I was curious how others deal with this. I feed generously twice a day. I have a very mature tank, running for 6 years and the critters seem fine and grow.

I am a firm believer that it isn’t broke don’t fix it. I am just thinking of going no skimmer to help boost PO4 and NO3.

I include a picture from today as a reference.

The refugium which I assume contains macro algae can strip a system of nitrate, phosphate and probably some micro nutrients like iron. The same cannot be said for a skimmer. You should look for ways to throttle back the refugium performance not the skimmer operation. Maybe get rid of the refugium. Your system may not need it.

 

[jgirardnrg]

I would consider to run it 7/24 because the skimmer is important as a gas exchanger. If you think that it picks out to much P and N - run it without a skimmer cup. I´m not sure that a skimmer can affect the P concentration - however it can affect the N because it can aerate out NH3 gas. But as an oxygenator is it very important.

Sincerely Lasse

This... just run it without the cup or skim dry.

 

[Uncle99]

I leave the skimmer going 24-7 for gas exchange, but dose up my nitrate to 5ppm and phosphate to 0.07ppm.
IME, it’s easy to scale these up and maintain.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

Skim 24/7 stop the dose. Lol.
D

 

[JCM]

Skim 24/7 stop the dose. Lol.
D

I think they meant they had to dose nitrate and phosphate to keep the levels up. I'd leave the skimmer running and add half a dozen more fish, but I'm an overstocker so maybe don't listen to me.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

Ur tank will balance nitrates and phosphates with ur filtration capability and maintence habits ect.
Ppl are controlling things and wondering why they get cyano or dinos or why this or that. Lol.
Run the skimmer 24 7 and stop the dose. Yes u can add fish or feed more if u think itll matter. Lol.
D

 

[JCM]

Ur tank will balance nitrates and phosphates with ur filtration capability and maintence habits ect.
Ppl are controlling things and wondering why they get cyano or dinos or why this or that. Lol.
Run the skimmer 24 7 and stop the dose. Yes u can add fish or feed more if u think itll matter. Lol.
D

Hmm, I agree some people get OCD with controlling parameters. It's certainly possible to strip a tank of nutrients though, are you saying that's not possible? I'll always advocate for feeding the tank more though rather than straight dosing po4/no3.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

No. With the products out today even in the past u could strip nutrients and coral would bleach or brown out.
D

 

[JCM]

No. With the products out today even in the past u could strip nutrients and coral would bleach or brown out.
D

I must've misunderstood, I agree. Either way, I don't think turning the skimmer off is the answer. I'd ditch the refugium before the skimmer. But personally I'd add more fish and feed more.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

Ppl are spending $ on un needed chemicals imo is all. Who started all this? I want names? Whos the dino flagellates osteosprosis vibrant king? Tell me! Lol.
D

 

[JCM]

Ppl are spending $ on un needed chemicals imo is all. Who started all this? I want names? Whos the dino flagellates osteosprosis vibrant king? Tell me! Lol.
D

Heck if I know. The only aquarium chemical I own is Seachem prime. And that's for my daughters little planted tank ‍

 

[Jekyl]

I use NoPox to maintain levels. I heard it is beneficial for coral on top of that.

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

I have brs soda ash i mix with rodi. Lol. Aquavitro ions for calcium.
D

 

[Lasse]

Ur tank will balance nitrates and phosphates with ur filtration capability and maintence habits ect.
Ppl are controlling things and wondering why they get cyano or dinos or why this or that.

Yes - if they get the nutrients levels too low. In this case the OP had to rise the levels in order not to get cyano/dino problems. Important to note is that if PO4 have run at 0 for a long time - dosing will not give any readings. no readings. no readings. no readings and suddenly high readings. Its the ketchup effect. Do not rise the dose too much in the beginning if there is no result with the initial dosing. Even if you not can see any leftover in the water - you know that your system gets PO4 just because your daily dose and that+s important - not the left over. The easiest way to reduce the light regime for the refugium if you want to reduce the effect from the refugium - on the other hand - low nutrients left over often also means vey low growth of the refugium.

Sincerely Lasse

 

[monkeyCmonkeyDo]

"In this case the OP had to rise the levels in order not to get cyano/dino problems"
Say that again to urself. Over and over again. Lol. Lmk when it makes sense.
D

 

[WallyB]

I recently reduced my skimmer run time to 6 hours. I have very low PO4 and NO4, each running frequently at or near zero based on ULR Hanna and Nyos tests respectively. I also run a refugium to help maintain low values but also dose Neonitro and Neophos to keep them up.

I was curious how others deal with this. I feed generously twice a day. I have a very mature tank, running for 6 years and the critters seem fine and grow.

I am a firm believer that it isn’t broke don’t fix it. I am just thinking of going no skimmer to help boost PO4 and NO3.

I include a picture from today as a reference.

Interesting topic, and something I've been pondering about for a while.

I actually now turn off my skimmer for a few hours after lights out. It's during that time that I dose amino acids and my goal is to allow the amino's to circulate thru the system without being skimmed out. Many corals feed at night when the lights are out. You will see them extended their feeder tentacles, so why not allow the corals an Extra Boost opportunity to eat before your skimmer takes out the nutrients (Fish poo, and the aminos). So long as you have surface agitation, and plenty of water movement in your sump via splashing and passing over baffles, the gas exchange in your system isn't reduced very much.

This idea came about when I was doing a basement renovation, and I was so busy that I didn't clean my skimmer for days at a time. I'm talking a week would go by, the cup was so full that the skimmer couldn't skim anymore.
This went on for about 3 months, and what I noticed is my SPS only tank that I've struggled with for years finally took off. Corals colored up, and started growing like never before.

That experience led me to think that maybe I was over skimming, since I have a very old classic oversized EuroReef Skimmer in my sump.

However I thought about it more, and a specific BRS TV video topic came to mind. Not sure which BRS video it was, but they talked about reducing Phosphates, and that you can run Chaeto Reactors, Algae Scrubbers, Skimmers or GFO reactors, but you should not run all of them in your system.

I actually have been runing a Algae Scrubber for quite some time. It's a hybird design that doesn't grow fast growing green hair algae, it grows Macro Algae (Cheato), so I guess you could say it as Cheato reactor.

I do meticulously use very small amount of RowaPhos (GFO) in a reactor that I change every two weeks. That along with my other equiptment keeps my phosphates in the range of 0.05 to 0.1 ppm which is just right for me. I do feed my fish a lot so if I don't use all my P control methods, my P will easily go much higher.

Sorry about the detailed babble, but my conclusion is that turning off my skimmer for a few hours every night after lights out has been the best thing I've ever done for my tank in last 20 years. It's now been 6 months with the skimmer off cycle and the positive impacts continue.

My other experience is having more fish which means more feeding and results in more fish poo (nutrients) is the easiest and most effective way to bring up Phosphates. Just feeding a few fish more isn't enough, since if they can't consume and digest all the food, the food floats around, goes into your sump and rots.

BTW this tank is 3 years old. Rocks older, so my situation is not a fresh startup up first year setup situation.

 

[Lasse]

"In this case the OP had to rise the levels in order not to get cyano/dino problems"
Say that again to urself. Over and over again. Lol. Lmk when it makes sense.

Do not know where you have been the last years - more and more evidences has been gathering together that show that just Cyano/dino thrives in low nutrient tanks because they have alternative ways to get nutrients

Laughs best who laughs last as we say in Sweden

It's during that time that I dose amino acids and my goal is to allow the amino's to circulate thru the system without being skimmed out.

The old and whole name of a saltwater skimmer is protein skimmer. It was developed just because the air bubbles will act as a beater for albumen. Amino acids is the base compounds of protein ( albumen) and if you dose that - it is of cause not good to skim them out in next step. But you can use the skimmer without a skimmer cup or let it drain back to the sump

Sincerely Lasse

 

[WallyB]

Do not know where you have been the last years - more and more evidences has been gathering together that show that just Cyano/dino thrives in low nutrient tanks because they have alternative ways to get nutrients

So what are those alternative means that Cyano's thrives on? Is it light? And if light, is it the white or red spectrum?
I've been fighting a thin layer of cyano on my rocks for many months. I blow it off the rocks and in two days the film is back. No corals are damaged by cyano, so it just the look of the rocks. Beautiful purple coraline get's covered by cyano and my tank rockscape starts looking very redish.

My Nitrates have been around 5-10ppm, my Phosphates around 0.08-0.1 ppm so my tank is certainly not a ultra low nutrient tank.

Ever since my cyano started that is when my SPS corals started doing best, so I certainly can live with a Cyano, and dare not make any significant adjustments to not break what's working. I did try Cyano Clean which is bacteria to outcompete the Cyano....that reduced the cyano a tiny bit.

I will never use Chemi clean since a while back I did and the treatment damaged my sps due to the fact that water clarity got so clear I believe the SPS frags got burned due to the spike in lighting intensity.

It's not a low flow , dead spot issue, since my the flow in my tank to the point where my fish struggle to swim. I do turn down the flow at night to give fish a peaceful sleep time.

My best guess is my Amino dosing is fueling the Cyano, but at this point the benefits to the sps outweighs the Cyano effect. I can't conclude it's Aminos since my Cyano started before I started using Aminos.

I figure that once my SPS get bigger, they will encrust the rocks and eventually get even bigger and shade the rocks, thus the space for Cyano will eventually be less.