Sodium Hydroxide in bleach…ugh

[KrisReef]

It was always my intent to use chlor-out after thorough rinsing the rock. I also will run high end carbon for some time before adding fish while using turbo 900. I’m optimistic after first rinse as the detergent suds really dissipated rapidly. My guess is that the concentration of detergent must have been rather low.

So I now have rinsed with and drained again. Next step will be to remove the leftover rock and all the sand (don't know where to dispose the sand?).

Cat box, bag it and toss it, find a playground sand box, just don’t put it on the beach or in the ocean, let it dry out in the sun or bury it in a landfill.

 

[Dan_P]

I appreciate your feedback but the tank is 650g’s!

You have no choice but to thoroughly rinse whatever was exposed to “no-splash” bleach with freshwater to remove its ingredients.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

For readers who may miss subsequent discussions, I just want to clarify some things in the advice the OP got from his friend that are not optimal answers:

"- he thinks there are little options at this point as the only thing that would clear it out is an industrial waste treatment RODI machine which would also desalinate the water to some extent."

Using RO/DI to try to remove a surfactant from seawater is a total nonstarter. ALL of the salts in seawater will be removed before a surfactant is removed because it is larger than the ions and so will pass through the RO membrane much more slowly.

" there w/b no reason to add Hydroxide to bleach if it wasn’t to include soap which in his mind makes sense as its used primarily for laundry."

Bleach (sodium hypochlorite) is made by combining chlorine (Cl2) and sodium hydroxide. Thus, it is expected that there may be sodium hydroxide in it. Hence the sodium hydroxide lsited on the label. It is no additional concern. The SDS makes it clear the sodium hydroxide is not an additional significant component of the product.

 

[Flame2hawk]

For readers who may miss subsequent discussions, I just want to clarify some things in the advice the OP got from his friend that are not optimal answers:

"- he thinks there are little options at this point as the only thing that would clear it out is an industrial waste treatment RODI machine which would also desalinate the water to some extent."

Using RO/DI to try to remove a surfactant from seawater is a total nonstarter. ALL of the salts in seawater will be removed before a surfactant is removed because it is larger than the ions and so will pass through the RO membrane much more slowly.

" there w/b no reason to add Hydroxide to bleach if it wasn’t to include soap which in his mind makes sense as its used primarily for laundry."

Bleach (sodium hypochlorite) is made by combining chlorine (Cl2) and sodium hydroxide. Thus, it is expected that there may be sodium hydroxide in it. Hence the sodium hydroxide lsited on the label. It is no additional concern. The SDS makes it clear the sodium hydroxide is not an additional significant component of the product.

Thank you. What caused the suds? The no splash feature seems to include some detergent although low amounts. Thank you everyone!!!

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

probaly could be 2 things 1 surfactants in the bleach, , or 2 from all the bio decaying/ reacting with the bleach . Probably 1 and. 2 combo

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thank you. What caused the suds? The no splash feature seems to include some detergent although low amounts. Thank you everyone!!!

Threebuoys posted the safety data sheet for the bleach you used and it shows this material which can cause suds;

 

[Flame2hawk]

Threebuoys posted the safety data sheet for the bleach you used and it shows this material which can cause suds;

So do I have to be concerned about rinsing several times or is the residue harmless. It seemed to disintegrate quickly once i rinsed with fresh water once.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So do I have to be concerned about rinsing several times or is the residue harmless. It seemed to disintegrate quickly once i rinsed with fresh water once.

I’m not sure how much that surfactant might adhere to surfaces such as sand. If you rinse till no suds foam it may be ok.

 

[Crabby48]

Best way to eliminate uronema is 100% dry with no moisture.. good rinse after bleaching tank and rocks then air dry everything thoroughly

 

[Flame2hawk]

Best way to eliminate uronema is 100% dry with no moisture.. good rinse after bleaching tank and rocks then air dry everything thoroughly

I was told to bleach everything first then rinse all in RO water then let dry of you can. The problem with all that is the impact it might have on the seals as they shouldn’t stay dry for too long. The tank is a 4’ tall tank which put allot f pressure on seals. The glass is 1” thick

 

[Flame2hawk]

Well after all the rinsing, it seems like there is still some soap residue (a little foam on the edgs but not bubbles) I took someone’s advice and put some of the water in a plastic 1 qt container with lid and shook it vigorously. No foam or bubbles.DOes this mean that the amount of soap residue is small and thus can be removed by activated carbon and poly filter?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Well after all the rinsing, it seems like there is still some soap residue (a little foam on the edgs but not bubbles) I took someone’s advice and put some of the water in a plastic 1 qt container with lid and shook it vigorously. No foam or bubbles.DOes this mean that the amount of soap residue is small and thus can be removed by activated carbon and poly filter?

Seems like a reasonable approach.

 

[Flame2hawk]

Seems like a reasonable approach.

Thx. Do you know whether poly filter is a better option than activated carbon?

 

[CoralB]

I’m still shaking my head to this method used . And by all means I’m not saying this to be disrespectful I would not use any sand or rock that was subjected to this method it’s not worth the risk IMO . My worries at this point would be that even if you were able to rinse the tank out really good , what effect did the bleach have on the silicone ??

 

[Flame2hawk]

I’m still shaking my head to this method used . And by all means I’m not saying this to be disrespectful I would not use any sand or rock that was subjected to this method it’s not worth the risk IMO . My worries at this point would be that even if you were able to rinse the tank out really good , what effect did the bleach have on the silicone ??

Many hobbyist have used bleach with success and no seam failures. They’ve also reused rock and sand. However they didn’t make my mistake of using the wrong bleach. Just for clarification, I replaced all the sand, Thoroughly bleached ( with he right bleach) the rocks, rinsed them off, rinsed multiple times, had them dry off for 11 days. Bleach actually dissipates rather quickly so thats not the concern but rather the soap ingredient is. Thx and no offense taken.

 

[CoralB]

Many hobbyist have used bleach with success and no seam failures. They’ve also reused rock and sand. However they didn’t make my mistake of using the wrong bleach. Just for clarification, I replaced all the sand, Thoroughly bleached ( with he right bleach) the rocks, rinsed them off, rinsed multiple times, had them dry off for 11 days. Bleach actually dissipates rather quickly so thats not the concern but rather the soap ingredient is. Thx and no offense taken.

Yes I know about using bleach to disinfect . You didn’t list the concentration you used for this tank . I’m always concerned when using certain chemicals in the tank in relation to the possible effects of the integrity of the sealant afterwards . Hydrogen peroxide dissipates as well but depending on the strength it can burn you when it first comes out of the bottle . I’m not saying you will have a issue but for me it’s something I think about having had seams burst on relatively newer tanks after dosing chemicals . In my case strong oxidizers . I read earlier that the bleach you used may have had scent added and not being a chemist , I would wonder if that could be neutralized or removed by rinsing until the water no longer suds up in the rock and sand . Just a thought .

 

[Flame2hawk]

Yes I know about using bleach to disinfect . You didn’t list the concentration you used for this tank . I’m always concerned when using certain chemicals in the tank in relation to the possible effects of the integrity of the sealant afterwards . Hydrogen peroxide dissipates as well but depending on the strength it can burn you when it first comes out of the bottle . I’m not saying you will have an issue but for me it’s something I think about having had seams burst on relatively newer tanks after dosing chemicals . In my case strong oxidizers . I read earlier that the bleach you used may have had scent added and not being a chemist , I would wonder if that could be neutralized or removed by rinsing until the water no longer suds up in the rock and sand . Just a thought .

yes i rinsed and rinsed until no suds. Then left it for 12 days to dry out completely. I did mention earlier that i used 1 3/4 gallons of bleach for 27 hours before i started draining water. It is a custom built tank with 1 inch glass so seams are something to worry about for sure! However if I had a pre manufactured tank with the initials RS, I wouldn’t have even tried it.

 

[CoralB]

yes i rinsed and rinsed until no suds. Then left it for 12 days to dry out completely. I did mention earlier that i used 1 3/4 gallons of bleach for 27 hours before i started draining water. It is a custom built tank with 1 inch glass so seams are something to worry about for sure! However if I had a pre manufactured tank with the initials RS, I wouldn’t have even tried it.

I wish you the best of luck . Keep us posted on the progress

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thx. Do you know whether poly filter is a better option than activated carbon?

I expect it is not better, but do not know for sure.

 

[Flame2hawk]

Well it keeps getting worse. Such a horrible mistake using the wrong bleach, The tank cycled quickly but the soap remained as the fish all started to really suffer…hiding, swimming listlessly, one skipping along the top of the water seemingly looking for a way out. My next step is to take the fish out..dip them in MB to help their gills. Then let the water run for another 5-7 days with carbon and polyfilter. Then yes, drain it again. Yes thats another 635g of RO water….I’m so drained myself…..