Success Rate with New Fish

[ivanlm78]

Hi community,

I have what may seem like a simple question, but I am sure there's a lot of depth to it.

I set up my RedSea Reefer XL300 2 months ago, since then the water parameters have been very stable and correct.

I am keeping for now hardy and relatively hardy fish such as clown fish, yellow eye tang, clown tang, wrasses, damselfish, etc.

Except for some unfortunate events (a clown fish jumped off the aquarium and a Damselfish got into the wavemaker and ripped it off), I have noticed to have a success rate of about 1 death of every 3 or 4 new fish I've added. Most deaths occur within the first 2-3 days of adding the new fish into an aquarium.

I always follow the steps that the local aquarium shop told me to follow, eg. leave the new fish in a bucket and add water from my aquarium in small doses every 2min, to acclimatise the fish. I then add the fish after 15-20min

For the most part, fish that died seemed healthy and were very shy and hide since the moment they got in the tank. Some died within 12h, some within 2-3 days.

My question is...is this rate awfully high?

what are the main reason these fish are dying?

should I be looking into other steps when introducing the fish? If so, what do you recommend I do differently?

Thanks
Ivan

 

[Cheese Griller]

I would not consider Clown tangs, especially when young, to be hardy fish. I would also recommend doing at the very least an observational quarantine. Make sure the fish are eating well before adding them to the DT, this also gives you a good opportunity to treat them for any disease that pops up.

 

[Lavey29]

Are you adding community fish into a tank with aggressive fish like clowns and damsels?

 

[ivanlm78]

Are you adding community fish into a tank with aggressive fish like clowns and damsels?

I am not sure what classifies community fish? I have a mandarin fish, two tangs, a yellow goby, etc.

 

[Lavey29]

I am not sure what classifies community fish? I have a mandarin fish, two tangs, a yellow goby, etc.

For instance, I have the same tank. You added a clown tang to a small medium size tank. These fish are very aggressive and grow to 7 inches and have no business being in a small tank. The aggression is probably killing new fish you try to add now.

 

[viceversabrd]

Gotta quarantine, this would always happen to me back in the day when I wouldn't quarantine. My guess is there is some latent disease/parasite that then manifests with the stress of going from the LFS to your tank. Thus in quarantine Im already medicating for ich/velvet/brook with chloroquine before the fish is even dropped in. Also, it's more stressful for the fish getting put into a display tank with established fish and dynamics going on. In a small 10 gal quarantine by themselves or with another new fish or two it give them a "safe" place to start eating. My protocol is 2 weeks in chloroquine at 40mg/gl then swap tanks and do 2 weeks in fresh tank administering prazipro on days 1 and 7

 

[BryanM]

I think your loss rate is quite high.

Your next addition, I'd set up a video camera and record the tank, walk away, and see if someone is bullying the new fish.

I'm no expert, and not bragging, but I have not lost a fish like this since starting my tank 9months ago. I lost one to a jumper, one likely to a mantis shrimp.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

I haven't lost a new fish in years.... sometimes the fish is just not strong enough to survive, but I fully expect 99% success.

Your tank is relatively small for the fish choices (only 65 gallons with 2 tangs?), and also including some very aggressive fish in that tank. The fish choices are poor, in my own opinion, and if you have minimal rock work it will compound the fishes stress even more. Just my 2 cents.

 

[BryanM]

^^^ Good points, can we get a full tank shot? I always forget to ask to see what we're working with.

 

[Lavey29]

I haven't lost a new fish in years.... sometimes the fish is just not strong enough to survive, but I fully expect 99% success.

Your tank is relatively small for the fish choices (only 65 gallons with 2 tangs?), and also including some very aggressive fish in that tank. The fish choices are poor, in my own opinion, and if you have minimal rock work it will compound the fishes stress even more. Just my 2 cents.

It's actually like 50g with rocks.

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

wow I never knew that tangs got so large! This is a part of why you have a problem, we have to respect the animals we care for.

 

[JayM]

I have only ever had one unexplained loss with a dozen or so fish in my tank.

 

[Should I]

you added a fish that gets 15" to a 3ft tank mate i'm not the tang police but leave the big tangs to big tanks get a yellow/purple if you must have a tang :rolling-on-the-floor-laughing:

P.S i have only ever lost 1 fish a blue cheek goby cause like u i did not do my research

 

[EuphyllinOHk]

I'd agree with everyone who's saying that you're overstocking, especially when considering aggression. I'd also agree that you probably want to be quarantining. It's not that your fish are dying to disease, as I would suspect that ALL your fish would have died if you brought in something like velvet, but there are definitely benefits to quarantine. In quarantine, you have a low stress way of getting your fish to eat, where they're not getting bullied by their aggressive tankmates.

When you acclimate, do you try to match salinities? Your acclimation procedure may be a bit lacking, even for hardy fish. A poorly acclimated fish experiences additional stress in their new environment, gets bullied by aggressive, established tankmates, gets bullied away from food, gets weaker, etc. - quick doom spiral. My two cents based on your post.

I think, in order to boost your chances of success, bolster your acclimation procedure (vetteguy has a good one), quarantine your new additions, get them fat, then introduce them into your new tank in an acclimation box. People have a lot of success with those because it stems off that initial aggression that a new addition faces when added to an established tank.

 

[Uncle99]

15-20 minutes would not be enough time IMM to bring fish upwards in salinity more than .001, maybe .002.

So, what I do is first check the salinity in the bag.
In many cases, fish are kept in 1.018-1.020. If they going into a reef setting, say 1.025-1.026, I only raise salinity .002 per 12 hours. This allows time for fish to adjust their processes to the new salinity. So, in real low salinity, maybe 2 days. Temp must be maintained through that period.

If salinity in the bag is the same, or higher than your DT, then only temp must be matched with a 20 minute floating.

Some fish recover faster than others.

Hiding (or resting as I call it) can be a sign of an increase in salinity, and can be hard on fish.

 

[Uncle99]

BTW,
What a stunning wrasse!

 

[Lavey29]

You need to rehome the big fish. Since I have the same tank send me a PM if you would like to know what colorful community fish do well in our size tank.

 

[ivanlm78]

Gotta quarantine, this would always happen to me back in the day when I wouldn't quarantine. My guess is there is some latent disease/parasite that then manifests with the stress of going from the LFS to your tank. Thus in quarantine Im already medicating for ich/velvet/brook with chloroquine before the fish is even dropped in. Also, it's more stressful for the fish getting put into a display tank with established fish and dynamics going on. In a small 10 gal quarantine by themselves or with another new fish or two it give them a "safe" place to start eating. My protocol is 2 weeks in chloroquine at 40mg/gl then swap tanks and do 2 weeks in fresh tank administering prazipro on days 1 and 7

Thank you. What di you mean by fresh tank? do you keep two qt tanks?

I read about starvation as one of the reasons they die, I can tell that is the case of the last 3 deaths. So if I read correctly, you are saying that a qt tank gives them a safe oace for them to relax and be more likely to eat?
Do you medicate all new fish in the qt tanks? or keep an eye and decide after a few days?

tx

 

[ivanlm78]

^^^ Good points, can we get a full tank shot? I always forget to ask to see what we're working with.

Hi Bryan, this is what it looks like. As you can see, I only have one wake maker, which makes me doubt if it is sufficient to create enough oxygen in this aquarium

 

[Jungle Blue]

wow I never knew that tangs got so large! This is a part of why you have a problem, we have to respect the animals we care for.

A little research goes a long way haha