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My Copperband finally passed away peacefully. And she had the courtesy to die stuck to a powerhead near the front of the tank so it was simple to remove her and she didn't become bristleworm food.
If she was near the bottom, It wouldn't have been pretty .
She is the copperband that appears on the cover of my book.
I will get another one when I find a small, good one.
As you know Paul and as I have reported many times on here, on other threads and other forums I have introduced fish that I couldn't see any spots on them in the LFS. However within hours of introduction into my DT (no QT of course as I want fit healthy fish) would develop a few white spotsHow I would set up a non quarantined so called Ich Management tank and why I think people have problems. I hate that term "Ich Management" I prefer immune.
A new tank will not be healthy or immune even if I or the Pope set it up. Not the current Pope, the last one.
I am not exactly sure why, but it is the bacteria that keep the fish happy and healthy. I am now not talking about the bacteria in the fish. That is something else. But the bacteria in the gravel and rocks is what we need
We talk about cycling like that has anything to do with fish health, and it doesn't. Many people feel that after their test kit reads zero ammonia and nitrite they can go out and buy a Moorish Idol and whale shark. They can't and those fish will die. The whale shark may even get ich first. ;Bucktooth
If you want to start a new tank and not have to quarantine and have a healthy tank I feel you need to set up the tank with live rock, live sand or gravel and some water, or a lot of water from either the sea or someone elses tank. Then throw out your test kits, but feed the tank heavily.
Put in some small pieces of clam, pellets, chicken ala king or flakes if you like, anything that will rot.
If the water gets slightly cloudy, you did it correctly. You don't want the water to look like New England clam chowder, but a little cloudy.
Let it clear and do it again, maybe for a couple of weeks.
Then add a fish, not a $100.00 Purple tang. Maybe a clownfish because to kill a clownfish you have to run it over with a school bus carrying Sumo wrestlers after they came back from a hot dog eating contest.
"Do not quarantine that fish"
Add a few more fish but do not dip, medicate, perform palates or put in a separate room 10' away from your TV for 72 days as that will surely cause you to spend time on a disease forum especially if you watch reality TV such as "Who wants to Marry my Grouchy Obese Uncle Bob." ;Meh
From the first day feed those fish only frozen or live food. Live worms a couple of times a week would be great but clams work. Buy them in a grocery store or fish market not clams sold for fish food as they could have been frozen when Nancy Pelosi was born.
I use LRS food every day along with some worms occasionally.
If any of those fish get a couple of spots, don't go on a disease forum or they will have you dipping the poor creature in tree stump remover and polident.
Leave it alone and go out to dinner. Try the Merlot and crab cakes. ;Smug
I recently bought a hippo tank, a few months or a year ago. He scratched a little at first Which is actually a good sign .
Contrary to popular opinion you want living parasites in there. If you don't want them, go ahead and quarantine everything but this thread is about why do some people "not" lose fish in the beginning.
Last week I bought a tiny angelfish. It scratched a few times for a few days. Now he doesn't and no, he is not dead and will probably live 15 years. He is jet black so I would easily see parasites, which I have not seen on any of my fish for over 40 years.
My old, big copperband just died of old age a couple of days ago. No infections or diseases. So I bought a jet black gobi, a citron gobi, sunburst Anthius an angelfish and a couple I forgot. All small fish. But they will never get sick. I will bet Bobby's life on it.
So that is my plan. Other people could post theirs.
How I would set up a non quarantined so called Ich Management tank and why I think people have problems. I hate that term "Ich Management" I prefer immune.
A new tank will not be healthy or immune even if I or the Pope set it up. Not the current Pope, the last one.
I am not exactly sure why, but it is the bacteria that keep the fish happy and healthy. I am now not talking about the bacteria in the fish. That is something else. But the bacteria in the gravel and rocks is what we need
We talk about cycling like that has anything to do with fish health, and it doesn't. Many people feel that after their test kit reads zero ammonia and nitrite they can go out and buy a Moorish Idol and whale shark. They can't and those fish will die. The whale shark may even get ich first. ;Bucktooth
If you want to start a new tank and not have to quarantine and have a healthy tank I feel you need to set up the tank with live rock, live sand or gravel and some water, or a lot of water from either the sea or someone elses tank. Then throw out your test kits, but feed the tank heavily.
Put in some small pieces of clam, pellets, chicken ala king or flakes if you like, anything that will rot.
If the water gets slightly cloudy, you did it correctly. You don't want the water to look like New England clam chowder, but a little cloudy.
Let it clear and do it again, maybe for a couple of weeks.
Then add a fish, not a $100.00 Purple tang. Maybe a clownfish because to kill a clownfish you have to run it over with a school bus carrying Sumo wrestlers after they came back from a hot dog eating contest.
"Do not quarantine that fish"
Add a few more fish but do not dip, medicate, perform palates or put in a separate room 10' away from your TV for 72 days as that will surely cause you to spend time on a disease forum especially if you watch reality TV such as "Who wants to Marry my Grouchy Obese Uncle Bob." ;Meh
From the first day feed those fish only frozen or live food. Live worms a couple of times a week would be great but clams work. Buy them in a grocery store or fish market not clams sold for fish food as they could have been frozen when Nancy Pelosi was born.
I use LRS food every day along with some worms occasionally.
If any of those fish get a couple of spots, don't go on a disease forum or they will have you dipping the poor creature in tree stump remover and polident.
Leave it alone and go out to dinner. Try the Merlot and crab cakes. ;Smug
I recently bought a hippo tank, a few months or a year ago. He scratched a little at first Which is actually a good sign .
Contrary to popular opinion you want living parasites in there. If you don't want them, go ahead and quarantine everything but this thread is about why do some people "not" lose fish in the beginning.
Last week I bought a tiny angelfish. It scratched a few times for a few days. Now he doesn't and no, he is not dead and will probably live 15 years. He is jet black so I would easily see parasites, which I have not seen on any of my fish for over 40 years.
My old, big copperband just died of old age a couple of days ago. No infections or diseases. So I bought a jet black gobi, a citron gobi, sunburst Anthius an angelfish and a couple I forgot. All small fish. But they will never get sick. I will bet Bobby's life on it.
So that is my plan. Other people could post theirs.
I still say that it's your tank that is immune, not so much the fish. If that wasn't the case, the sick fish you have put in your tank wouldn't have recovered within a few days.
I do question if the parasites in your tank lead a happy life though. Your tank is not an healthy place for them, something is pestering them, like it probably happens in the ocean.
At 11pm UK time tonight we will be a free nation again able to decide many things the snowflakes were happy to let others decide for us. Viva the UK viva democracy.
Pepper? Hmmm. Shame you don't see the funny side it wasnt political and even remoaners in the UK laugh at such, well those with a sense of humour do. It was Brit humour ,sorry if you find it distasteful on some way.I don't live in the UK and I don't have an opinion one way or the other about Brexit, but I do wish folks wouldn't pepper political opinions in otherwise interesting and relevant posts. There will always be people on both sides of any political issue on these forums and it just feels like unnecessary taunting to include opinions like this.
Thanks to global warming and the decline of coral reefs there is much research being done on the microbial population of coral reefs. Hopefully in that research we will learn through scientific experiments that @Paul B has been right all along!Hey Paul - thanks for the interesting read at 264 pages
Have you ever tried to find research on crypto immunity in fish? What's interesting to me are your observtions that:
1. existing fish in your tank don't ever show signs of crypto.
2. newly introduced fish show signs for a day or so and then clear up.
Can you confirm #2 for me?
It does seem like there are a couple possibilities to explain this. Possibly, the fish in your system have antibodies that fight the crypto infection. This is probably pretty likely. What I'm wondering is if the existing fish can somehow pass the antibodies on to new fish. Like how mammals pass antibodies to their nursing infants. Just a thought.
I really wish there was more science dedicated to this - with the $ spent in modern fish-keeping, it seems like something that should be able to attract research funding.