Time to Change the Sump

[dbl]

I’m planning on swapping out my sump and am looking for a little input from those that have changed a sump in an existing system. I typically live by the motto of “if it isn’t broken, don’t fix it”, and I’ve had great success with this system, but I simply hate my existing sump. Besides, the BK skimmer I picked up will not fit, so the sump has to go!

Some quick facts:
• Well established 120g mixed-reef running for 2 ¾ years
• Currently using a converted 55g as a sump (drain & skimmer/return/fuge/ato)
• I do use a sock on the drains
• I used Miracle Mud and about a 4” sand bed in the small Refugium (because I was new and that’s what I was told to do), along with Chaeto
• I also have some live rock in the sump
• Everything is hard plumbed to and from the DT, but have plenty of unions along the way

Plans:
• Remove existing sump, get new sump set and hard plumbed on day #1
• Let all plumbing “cure” for 24 +/- hours, and fire it up on day #2

Questions:
• As long as I have ample internal flow in the display, including having the surface agitated for oxygen exchange, my inhabitants will be okay for the short period while I make the change? 24 hours? 36 hours? 48 hours?
• My new sump has a larger Refugium area but I was planning on skipping the Miracle Mud and sand this time and just going with live rock and chaeto in the fuge. Thoughts?
• I’m assuming 24 hours is sufficient time to allow PVC to cure and lessen any vapors?

Sorry for the long-winded post, but just trying to provide facts. I would appreciate any feedback I can get and thank you in advance for your help. Just trying to do this correctly and avoid any casualties.

For those interested, I was originally going to build my own sump, but ended up getting a great deal on a new Trigger Systems 36” Elite. I did end up building a new ATO storage container. More details can be found in build thread below.

 

[jsker]

It looks like you have this well planed and you to have enough circulation to keep the system aerated. If this is a concern drop in a air stone with and pump to add even more air. I have glue and fired everything up with PVC glue letting it set for as long as it holds so 24 hours is more than enough.

Look forward to seeing the new sump in place

 

[Alfrareef]

Hi dbl

I tested the new sump with tap water previous to the change.
Then cover the floor avoiding trouble with wife.
Placed the new sump close to the old.
Placed the heater inside the tank.
Stopped everything inside the sump.
With a external pump that I use for WC emptied the sump to 2 large containers.
Placed inside the containers the live rock, crabs, urchins and snails that were inside the sump.
Remove the skimmer from the sump and the return pump was suspended by a small rope near the frame. (I use flexible tubbing).
Then pulled the old sump outside and inserted the new one.
Placed the return pump inside the sump and start to fill with new SW I had prepared.
While filling, inserted the new skimmer adjusting to the new water level with a plastic mattress.
Since the new sump takes twice more water I've topped of with the old SW water. (Don't forget to put the LR before filling the sump)
Started everything, placed the heater back in the sump and after a while adjusted the ATO sensor.
All this I believe toke me about 2hours with no issues (except adjusting the skimmer height) and all livestock didn't realize what as happened...

Only thing I regret was not replacing the screws on the side panels with magnets so I gain easy side access to the sump area. Next time ...

Rgds and good luck.
AR

 

[cromag27]

You have a good plan. skip the miracle mud this time around. also, use primer and glue on the pvc, don't use the all-in-one junk. do you know how to cement pvc? there's a certain technique.

 

[dbl]

It looks like you have this well planed and you to have enough circulation to keep the system aerated. If this is a concern drop in a air stone with and pump to add even more air. I have glue and fired everything up with PVC glue letting it set for as long as it holds so 24 hours is more than enough.

Look forward to seeing the new sump in place

Thanks for the help Jeffrey.

 

[dbl]

Hi dbl

I tested the new sump with tap water previous to the change.
Then cover the floor avoiding trouble with wife.
Placed the new sump close to the old.
Placed the heater inside the tank.
Stopped everything inside the sump.
With a external pump that I use for WC emptied the sump to 2 large containers.
Placed inside the containers the live rock, crabs, urchins and snails that were inside the sump.
Remove the skimmer from the sump and the return pump was suspended by a small rope near the frame. (I use flexible tubbing).
Then pulled the old sump outside and inserted the new one.
Placed the return pump inside the sump and start to fill with new SW I had prepared.
While filling, inserted the new skimmer adjusting to the new water level with a plastic mattress.
Since the new sump takes twice more water I've topped of with the old SW water. (Don't forget to put the LR before filling the sump)
Started everything, placed the heater back in the sump and after a while adjusted the ATO sensor.
All this I believe toke me about 2hours with no issues (except adjusting the skimmer height) and all livestock didn't realize what as happened...

Only thing I regret was not replacing the screws on the side panels with magnets so I gain easy side access to the sump area. Next time ...

Rgds and good luck.
AR

Wow, thanks for the info. I will certainly have tested the new sump prior to install. I only wish I could get this done in a couple hours. I'm completely changes things up and all is hard plumbed, so things are going to have to be cut and re-run. Thanks for the great tips.

 

[jsker]

David
Just read the last few post on your build thread. You did a great job on the acrylic work. If you need a hand I can alway use a short road trip

 

[dbl]

You have a good plan. skip the miracle mud this time around. also, use primer and glue on the pvc, don't use the all-in-one junk. do you know how to cement pvc? there's a certain technique.

Thanks...I was hoping to get confirmation to skip the mud. I always use a clear primer and clear glue so no issues with the plumbing part - that one I know how do do.

 

[dbl]

David
Just read the last few post on your build thread. You did a great job on the acrylic work. If you need a hand I can alway use a short road trip

Thanks. I had just about given up on acrylic until @cromag08 and others jumped in with pointers in another thread. And you are always welcome to make a short road trip!

 

[cromag27]

I use oatey. primer is grey and cement is purple (I think). make sure you do the twist and hold.

Thanks...I was hoping to get confirmation to skip the mud. I always use a clear primer and clear glue so no issues with the plumbing part - that one I know how do do.

 

[jsker]

Thanks. I had just about given up on acrylic until @cromag08 and others jumped in with pointers in another thread. And you are always welcome to make a short road trip!

Just let me know

 

[AcanSkywalker]

Throw a block or a box of spheres of Marine pure in your new sump and forget about the MM.

 

[saltyhog]

I only waited about an hour before firing up my sump when I changed from my Trigger 36 to a 44 inch x 20 inch custom Trigger. No problems.

Agree with losing the MM.

 

[dbl]

I only waited about an hour before firing up my sump when I changed from my Trigger 36 to a 44 inch x 20 inch custom Trigger. No problems.

Agree with losing the MM.

Did you change/add/glue up PVC also, and only waited an hour?

 

[saltyhog]

Did you change/add/glue up PVC also, and only waited an hour?

Yes. I only had to change/glue one pipe. The others I was able to unscrew unions and use them as before. I have never waited 24 hours for PVC joints to cure.

 

[cromag27]

Eh, cure time can be as little as 1 hour depending on pipe diameter. but off-gassing can take longer. I have done a lot of pvc work and I would not use it for at least 48 hours.

 

[dbl]

Eh, cure time can be as little as 1 hour depending on pipe diameter. but off-gassing can take longer. I have done a lot of pvc work and I would not use it for at least 48 hours.

That's always been my thought as well. I'm not worried about glue cure time as much as fumes. I actually will have quite a few newly glued joints due to the difference between the two sumps.

 

[427HISS]

You have a good plan. skip the miracle mud this time around. also, use primer and glue on the PVC, don't use the all-in-one junk. do you know how to cement pvc? there's a certain technique.

Please be clean with the primer & glue. It drives me crazy when people have a stained purple mess with the primer outside of the joint. There's no need for that much anyway, stay inside the joint apx, 1/4" inside the joint, just coat, then wipe off any excess if there's any.

Also, do not mix the primer and glue together,..... to save time. The primer is made to slightly melt the PVC (that's why the PVC gets sticky) so that the glue can adhere to both parts best.

 

[helen ann]

Don't have a sump in the BC29 but will have one with the new 56g, might as well take some notes ... following along!

 

[dbl]

Please be clean with the primer & glue. It drives me crazy when people have a stained purple mess with the primer outside of the joint. There's no need for that much anyway, stay inside the joint apx, 1/4" inside the joint, just coat, then wipe off any excess if there's any.

Also, do not mix the primer and glue together,..... to save time. The primer is made to slightly melt the PVC (that's why the PVC gets sticky) so that the glue can adhere to both parts best.

I'm right there with you. It's another reason I use clear primer. I actually take the time to remove the printing off pipe and fittings. I'm a stickler on that.

Gluing methodology isn't my concern, the lingering fumes/gases was my question. On my original build, all hard plumbed, I let it dry for a couple days because it wasn't filled with livestock yet.