Trying to get phosphate under control

[RubyU235]

Hi all,

I recently started a new tank 2 weeks ago.

Over the last week my phosphates have been reading 4.0 (API test, can’t afford salifert, Red Sea, Hanna, etc. at the moment) so I started 5 mls of NoPoX on a dosing pump for the last three days. Checked phosphates again this morning and no change, still 4.0. Did not dose more NoPoX today to reavaluate my strategy.

What should I do next? More info below for consideration.

equipment;

120g display 6ft long, 15 inches wide, 20 inches deep, 20g in sump. 140g total volume. Reef octopus 100, Sicce 5.0.

Durso setup with two return lines draining into fine fikter

Startup;

Water generated from 4 stage RO/DI with new filters (TDS was still 2-3 for some reason, just installed a water softener and need to generate new water to see if this helps, water had a hardness of 17 and comes from Edward’s aquifer in San Antonio) reef crystals used for mix.

recycled (used/previously rinsed/dried) Fiji pink sand

Started bacterial colony with 1 liter of material from another saltwater tank I had and 40 lbs of clean live rock along with water from my other tanks water change waste

Added 2 liters of new sea chem matrix

Cycling

Tank cycled quickly (I think), ammonia 0.25 nitrite 0, nitrate 0 (API test kits, can’t afford the Red Sea or salifert right now)

Stock fish: 2 clowns 1-2 inches, yellow watchman goby, cleaner wrasse, chocolate tang, blue hippo tang (all added incrementally, not all at once) everything is healthy, eating and respirating normally with no signs of stress.

Stock coral: 4 micromussa polyps, 3inX4in GSP mat, firework clove polyp colonies, 3 heads of green hammer coral, small neon green cabbage leather frag, Leptastrea frag, Favites frag, platygyra frag, 3 Ricordeas, and some other blue mushrooms, several colonies of various zoas, and some pulsing Xenia.

No signs of stress in any of the corals… except… the zoas and the GSP have been pretty ticked off, I think because algae keeps growing on them.

Also have a small ball of chaeto

lighting: 3, AI Prime HD on a modified sac by program 4 hour ramp up and ramp down time. Peak output between 30-50%, whites below %30. Reds and greens very low.

Feeding; 3 times a day, pinch of ocean nutrition prime (red and green) flakes, and some frozen meaty food. Once a day, AB+, once a week reef roids.

Dosing: iodine once a week. Fluconazol treatment a week ago to kill some very light, residual hair algae on some of the rocks I transplanted (I feared I had the start of some bryopsis and didn’t want it to proliferate).

I don’t dose 2 part or trace, elements are replenished with water changes, currently replacing 10-20 gallons a week along with top offs of 1-2 gallons a week.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

You did all this in 2 weeks??

 

[Cali Reef Life]

First off I am going to say slow down. I wouldn't jump to chemicals anytime you see some slightly out of normal WC would be a better option. Your tank is brand new and there are going to be elevated levels of nutrients here and there. Get a CUC and know you have some ugly stage to go through. Are you running carbon after you complete each chemical dose? Mixing chemicals could be a dangerous without researching them. Try not to buy any new coral for awhile till your tank settles.

 

[Cell]

40 lbs live rock =skip cycle.

I'd cross reference with a different phosphate test.

 

[Cell]

Dial back feeding and no AB+ daily

Switch from reef roids, known to spike phosphate to Benepets Benereef. Similar stuff minus phosphate spike.

 

[flyfisher2]

Hi Ruby and welcome to the forum. This a fantastic place to learn what to do and what not. Where to start... Your tank is very new. The truth of the matter is we don't know for sure if the tank is cycled or not. Based on that alone I would recommend that you wait to add any more livestock and wait a bit longer to determine if nitrates and or phosphates are high or low. Lots can happen in the coming weeks.
I would recommend testing ammonia, and other parameters during this time. Salifert test kits would be my recommendation.

 

[ReefLife_Guy]

Seems like a lot of additives in a short period. I would start with a water change and see where you are at. I don't believe NOPOX is a significant phosphate remover and will bottom out your nitrates before you get that amount of phosphate down (if that phosphate measurement is accurate). If everything in the tank looks ok, I would stop adding stuff and choose water changes over more additives. If possible, feed only frozen foods for a while and see if your nitrates come up and your phosphates come down. Flake foods, pellets, and reef roids are known to raise phosphates in the tank. Unless your fish are finicky eaters I would stick with frozen variety to include stuff for your herbivores. Frozen foods have much less phosphates in them.

 

[sixty_reefer]

What nitrates do you have? Phosphates could just be due to the old sand and rock although you won’t get any effect from nopox without elevated nitrates.

 

[Cell]

Details details details.

This is more of a tank transfer than a brand new tank with 40 lbs of live rock transferred over. The bacteria on that live rock does not care which glass box you put it in, it still works.

 

[ReefLife_Guy]

I use the hanna checker which is $55 USD but if price is an issue, I think the salifert test kit is more reliable from hearing others experiences and it is only $3 more than the API kit.

I'd cross reference with a different phosphate test.

Agree with cell best to cross reference with another kit for any parameter that is out of normal range like that. I don't know how good api's phosphate kit is but even if it is accurate its always a good idea to test with another kit before doing a bunch to your tank and costing you more in the long run.

 

[ReefLife_Guy]

What nitrates do you have? Phosphates could just be due to the old sand and rock although you won’t get any effect from nopox without elevated nitrates.

They said 0 on the cycling part but not sure when that was taken in relation to the phosphate levels. But I'm guessing that is probably accurate.

 

[Cali Reef Life]

Details details details.

This is more of a tank transfer than a brand new tank with 40 lbs of live rock transferred over. The bacteria on that live rock does not care which glass box you put it in, it still works.

I agree but even with my tank transfer I still had some minor issues with adding some dry rock and die off of live rock and other things. Random algae growth ETC. I only assume my tank is one year old even though I transferred half my rocks from a 4 year old tank. Just want him to be successful and not go to quickly in this hobby most things take time. Welcome to forms and best of luck its a great hobby with a lot of ups and downs.

 

[RubyU235]

Thanks all, I’m not adding anything else lol.

Yes, it was more or less a tank transfer. Established bacterial and mechanical filtration from the start. I do believe it may be coming from the sand and just needs time to be worked out through water changes.

Will limit feeding to frozen. Will limit reef roids (I am experiencing growth strangely, GSP went right on encrusting and the hammer is growing 3 baby heads nicely)

I’ve stopped the NoPoX and don’t plan on dosing anything else except iodine for the next few months.

We’ll see how my water is now that installed a water softener with a fine sediment filter before it. Think I’m going to add either another carbon or DI cartridge to my 4 stage, now that sediment is filtered upstream.

 

[RubyU235]

I agree but even with my tank transfer I still had some minor issues with adding some dry rock and die off of live rock and other things. Random algae growth ETC. I only assume my tank is one year old even though I transferred half my rocks from a 4 year old tank. Just want him to be successful and not go to quickly in this hobby most things take time. Welcome to forms and best of luck its a great hobby with a lot of ups and downs.

I didn’t have any dry rock. Just the sand I think is probably giving me problems, I don’t think my live rock is leaching anything but who knows… could be.

 

[RubyU235]

They said 0 on the cycling part but not sure when that was taken in relation to the phosphate levels. But I'm guessing that is probably accurate.

I’m just as sceptical as all of you lol… I’ve never done it this way but I understand the rationale. I started monitoring daily and it just stayed that way… slight ammonia, no “N’s”… I suspect the API tests aren’t sensitive enough to get me fine measurements on the 0.00ish ranges unless they’re already that fine.

 

[flyfisher2]

Can you tell us a little more about the other tank you had?
How long was it running?
Do you have any parameters on it?
Would like to know so we can determine with more accuracy if it is in fact a tank transfer vs a new setup subject to cycling as such.

 

[Pntbll687]

I would double check that phosphate with another test.

But if your phosphate is at 4.0ppm then it's going to be a LONG road to get it back to "normal" ranges.

Stop dosing coral foods, and slow down on the feeding of fish. Feed once a day, and only what they eat in a minute or two.

For the phosphate, you'll need something like GFO, phosguard, Rowaphos, to help absorb phosphates down to a more manageable level. You'll then need to limit the phosphate input to the tank, and see if levels still rise, and determine where the phosphate is coming from.

 

[Pntbll687]

I’m just as sceptical as all of you lol… I’ve never done it this way but I understand the rationale. I started monitoring daily and it just stayed that way… slight ammonia, no “N’s”… I suspect the API tests aren’t sensitive enough to get me fine measurements on the 0.00ish ranges unless they’re already that fine.

you don't need to be able to test down to .01 right now. You need to get it down to the .25-.5 range to start. The API test should be ok for that

 

[Cell]

Could always just vacuum the sand out and replace with new, well rinsed sand. Re-using sand is not recommended for reasons like this.

 

[Cali Reef Life]

I didn’t have any dry rock. Just the sand I think is probably giving me problems, I don’t think my live rock is leaching anything but who knows… could be.

Exactly when you do a bunch of things in a short period its hard to pin point what's causing the issue. Not saying there's a right or wrong way its just easier to track what you did that caused the issue.