NateRealBig's Truly Minimalist 120g Office Build

[naterealbig]

Patience patience patience. I’m sure the ammonia will go down soon enough. I went thru the same thing setting up my tank. I’m not sure if this helps but could dosing beneficial bacteria help the process finish faster?

Hi and thanks for posting! Agreed on the patience part - I've done this probably 20-30 times before so i put on my seatbelt, and am in for the long haul!

In previous tanks i have either dosed bacteria, or used live rock - but never both. Originally, my thought was to try to maintain the culture of bacteria that was on the live rock, but i think this was really just for consistency's sake...

What would you recommend for the beneficial bacteria?

 

[Petcrazyson]

Hi and thanks for posting! Agreed on the patience part - I've done this probably 20-30 times before so i put on my seatbelt, and am in for the long haul!

In previous tanks i have either doused bacteria, or used live rock - but never both. Originally, my thought was to try to maintain the culture of bacteria that was on the live rock, but i think this was really just for consistency's sake...

What would you recommend for the beneficial bacteria?

I’d recommend “Brightwell Aquatics’” Microbacter Clean. It’s helped me in the past very very well. Which reminds me I need to restock lol

 

[naterealbig]

Couldn't help but try out the new nitrate checker... Standards haven't gotten here yet...




Dosed another round of Ammo-Lock...

 

[naterealbig]

I’d recommend “Brightwell Aquatics’” Microbacter Clean. It’s helped me in the past very very well. Which reminds me I need to restock lol

Gotcha. I had a thought on your post about adding bacteria, and my 'gut' was not to add anything additional, but at the time, I couldn't think of 'why'. I mulled it over last night, and I realized what it was.

During the curing process, I am trying to minimize the amount of cycles the biome goes through. I have the belief that cycles cover a myriad of different events, but is characterized by a specific species of plant or animal outcompeting everything else for energy (food, light, nutrients, etc) to the detriment of the biome (with the cycle completing after whatever resource to the overtaking organism has been used up) to the detriment of the other organisms.

One (I think very good, common) example is Dinoflagellates - where an algae outcompetes all other species (coral, bacteria, etc) in the tank for food and light. Another example (and the one that applies here) would be a particular species of nitrifying/denitrifying bacteria outcompeting another's for resources.

There are a few different reasons that 'cycles' are undesirable:

1) They generally take (what most would consider) a long time (several weeks or months) to complete. During this time, the energy web is disrupted and it is time that the tank and it's inhabitants are not growing - ultimately leading to increased time to full tank maturity.
2) In most instances these cycles are 'ugly'. Algae, Dinos, Cyano covering sand, coral, and other surfaces
3) In some cases they negatively impact other organisms in the tank (and frequently the coral we are trying to propogate):
a) They can impact directly by covering a coral and preventing light from reaching it, or produce toxins that destroy living tissue
b) The can impact indirectly by using using up food or elements, and preventing them from being available to bacteria, other algaes, etc.

For the curing process, 1) in the above list is most applicable. My theory is that, if I inoculate the media with different strains of bacteria, there will be another cycle (a period of time where a particular organism is outcompeting another), and hence, add time to the curing period.

At this stage (mostly because I won't be using the Keys rock in the display ultimately, and because we are so early in the curing process) I suppose it doesn't make too much of a difference. My goal here was to start (and hopefully end) with strains of bacteria that came directly from the ocean, making up the majority of the bacterial portion of the biome. My thought here was that the bacterial strains found in nature would be the 'best' (although I don't have any evidence of this).

I'm open to changing directions on this, if there is some evidence I could find that bacteria from a bottle, would be better/stronger/reproduces quicker/more resilient than that brought in on the rocks from the Keys.

I hope you will let me know your thoughts.

Also - just saw that you were in Clermont! I'm in Winter Garden, right around the corner off of Avalon rd. I hope we are able to meet and chat live in the future - would also love to see your setup!

 

[Petcrazyson]

Gotcha. I had a thought on your post about adding bacteria, and my 'gut' was not to add anything additional, but at the time, I couldn't think of 'why'. I mulled it over last night, and I realized what it was.

During the curing process, I am trying to minimize the amount of cycles the biome goes through. I have the belief that cycles cover a myriad of different events, but is characterized by a specific species of plant or animal outcompeting everything else for energy (food, light, nutrients, etc) to the detriment of the biome (with the cycle completing after whatever resource to the overtaking organism has been used up) to the detriment of the other organisms.

One (I think very good, common) example is Dinoflagellates - where an algae outcompetes all other species (coral, bacteria, etc) in the tank for food and light. Another example (and the one that applies here) would be a particular species of nitrifying/denitrifying bacteria outcompeting another's for resources.

There are a few different reasons that 'cycles' are undesirable:

1) They generally take (what most would consider) a long time (several weeks or months) to complete. During this time, the energy web is disrupted and it is time that the tank and it's inhabitants are not growing - ultimately leading to increased time to full tank maturity.
2) In most instances these cycles are 'ugly'. Algae, Dinos, Cyano covering sand, coral, and other surfaces
3) In some cases they negatively impact other organisms in the tank (and frequently the coral we are trying to propogate):
a) They can impact directly by covering a coral and preventing light from reaching it, or produce toxins that destroy living tissue
b) The can impact indirectly by using using up food or elements, and preventing them from being available to bacteria, other algaes, etc.

For the curing process, 1) in the above list is most applicable. My theory is that, if I inoculate the media with different strains of bacteria, there will be another cycle (a period of time where a particular organism is outcompeting another), and hence, add time to the curing period.

At this stage (mostly because I won't be using the Keys rock in the display ultimately, and because we are so early in the curing process) I suppose it doesn't make too much of a difference. My goal here was to start (and hopefully end) with strains of bacteria that came directly from the ocean, making up the majority of the bacterial portion of the biome. My thought here was that the bacterial strains found in nature would be the 'best' (although I don't have any evidence of this).

I'm open to changing directions on this, if there is some evidence I could find that bacteria from a bottle, would be better/stronger/reproduces quicker/more resilient than that brought in on the rocks from the Keys.

I hope you will let me know your thoughts.

Also - just saw that you were in Clermont! I'm in Winter Garden, right around the corner off of Avalon rd. I hope we are able to meet and chat live in the future - would also love to see your setup!

I think that’s why bottled bacteria is just in a sense better than natural style bacteria, I mean all of it is natural, bottled or not, but I hope you get what I’m trying to say lol. I like your theory, and I’m curious to see how that would play out if it were beneficial. Not entirely but still a little off topic, I found out that if you add a refugium light to an area with the ugly’s, contrary to some, help getting rid of the main part of it. I’m not entirely sure why, but it does. Now I don’t recommend keeping that light on the tank for a long period of time, as it will grow some quote on quote good or “better” nasties. I’ve found that the bacteria from the bottle definitely speeds things up, but the tank could decide that it doesn’t want that extra bacteria and keep going with its own cycle/method.

We‘re almost neighbors lol. I visit Winter Garden readily, so we may bump into each other, but I don‘t know how you look like lol. And if we do I’m happy to exchange some minutes of knowledge You can check out my setup by clicking the Build Thread icon on my profile. But since you really wanted to see it, I’ll treat you with a picture I am going through some nasties too, but I’m hoping that with some Microbacter Clean and with time it’ll clear out. Enjoy!

My female Clown and Angel wave hello!

 

[naterealbig]

I think that’s why bottled bacteria is just in a sense better than natural style bacteria, I mean all of it is natural, bottled or not, but I hope you get what I’m trying to say lol.

Yes, true, all is natural I suppose - I definitely understand what you are saying.

I like your theory, and I’m curious to see how that would play out if it were beneficial.

I'm curious too, and hope it works. I think I will do a 3 month total dark-cure time, and start testing with Acropora 76 days after I add the rock to the display. The limiting factor will be the 76 day prophylactic quarantine that I will complete on all incoming corals (and fish)...

Not entirely but still a little off topic, I found out that if you add a refugium light to an area with the ugly’s, contrary to some, help getting rid of the main part of it. I’m not entirely sure why, but it does. Now I don’t recommend keeping that light on the tank for a long period of time, as it will grow some quote on quote good or “better” nasties.

Very interesting - I've never heard this, but it makes complete sense. A primarily photosynthetic organism outcompeting the 'bad' organisms because they utilize light better than the other pest utilizes light and/or nutrients... Will tuck this idea away for use later.

I’ve found that the bacteria from the bottle definitely speeds things up, but the tank could decide that it doesn’t want that extra bacteria and keep going with its own cycle/method.

Yes, true.

We‘re almost neighbors lol. I visit Winter Garden readily, so we may bump into each other, but I don‘t know how you look like lol. And if we do I’m happy to exchange some minutes of knowledge

Would be great... I hope to see you around. Perhaps we could do some coral trading sometime. There is a person (that_guy) who sells in the livestock selling forum some pretty good corals at great prices. I plan on stopping by his place at some point and picking up some pieces.

You can check out my setup by clicking the Build Thread icon on my profile. But since you really wanted to see it, I’ll treat you with a picture I am going through some nasties too, but I’m hoping that with some Microbacter Clean and with time it’ll clear out. Enjoy!

Yes! I already found it, and thanks for posting pictures. Best of luck with the MicroBacter clean - I'm certain it will make a difference. While I think they are overpriced, I am fond of their products. I particularly like their amino acids. Have you considered adding a small UV to the system temporarily to cure the bacterial/algae outbreak in the water column? I have found these to be very effective, however, usually causes a 'spike' in a different 'nasty' after it is eliminated... Either way beautiful setup and fish. I have some questions, but I'll read through the thread and ask them there.

Thank you for your thoughts, sharing. Cheers!

 

[Petcrazyson]

I'm curious too, and hope it works. I think I will do a 3 month total dark-cure time, and start testing with Acropora 76 days after I add the rock to the display. The limiting factor will be the 76 day prophylactic quarantine that I will complete on all incoming corals (and fish)...

Little iffy if you ask me. Now I’m not a pro, I am quite new to this, but with the little knowledge I’ve gained, adding some acros to only a a few months after the initial setup is just a little, uh, like I said iffy to me. And I‘m just referring to acros not other Sps. Now I don’t think it’s impossible, and I will be curious to see what the Acropora decide. Kudos to you for trying something gutsy!

Very interesting - I've never heard this, but it makes complete sense. A primarily photosynthetic organism outcompeting the 'bad' organisms because they utilize light better than the other pest utilizes light and/or nutrients... Will tuck this idea away for use later.

Happy and hoping this info will help you in the future!

Would be great... I hope to see you around. Perhaps we could do some coral trading sometime. There is a person (that_guy) who sells in the livestock selling forum some pretty good corals at great prices. I plan on stopping by his place at some point and picking up some pieces.

Definitely don’t mind some coral trading I have seen him on here, and once I start adding coral he will be someone to keep in mind. Looking forward to seeing those frags in your tank!

Have you considered adding a small UV to the system temporarily to cure the bacterial/algae outbreak in the water column? I have found these to be very effective, however, usually causes a 'spike' in a different 'nasty' after it is eliminated

Thx for the tip! I am thinking about it, so I may go forward with a UV sterilizer. I always seem to be struggling with some murkiness to the water, so once I can get the Microbacter Clean, I’m hoping with the combined forces of a Reefmat I want to add, will help further. Any tips to solve the cloudiness?

Either way beautiful setup and fish. I have some questions, but I'll read through the thread and ask them there.

Ask as many questions as you like. I’d be happy to answer them!

 

[Petcrazyson]

Ik it’s still early in the build process but do you have any fish ideas you are decided on or thinking about?

 

[naterealbig]

Little iffy if you ask me. Now I’m not a pro, I am quite new to this, but with the little knowledge I’ve gained, adding some acros to only a a few months after the initial setup is just a little, uh, like I said iffy to me. And I‘m just referring to acros not other Sps. Now I don’t think it’s impossible, and I will be curious to see what the Acropora decide. Kudos to you for trying something gutsy!

Definitely gutsy, but I don't feel like it's completely unrealistic. It would be a total of about ~ 5 months.... In comparison, my brother (who has been in the hobby almost as long as I have) is still struggling very much keeping Acros in his 1.5 yr old system... You are right - we will definitely see. I will try 2 or 3 medium-difficulty sticks to test.

Any tips to solve the cloudiness?

The UV sterilizer for sure will almost instantly cure this - have used many times. If you're not planning on running one for parasite 'control', a super-cheap one will do the trick. A used Coralife (or Jabao, etc) would work in a pinch.

Ask as many questions as you like. I’d be happy to answer them!

Thank you!

 

[naterealbig]

Ik it’s still early in the build process but do you have any fish ideas you are decided on or thinking about?

I have several fish in mind, but the most important: Z. Rostratum [Black/Long-nosed Tang] (and specifically, the Hawaiian variant - they look MUCH better than the ones from the Christmas Islands). I actually had one before the Hawaii fishery shut down, and I literally would kick myself in the butt if I could... Would also consider the 'right' Koi Scopas in place of this, but I will try to hold out...

Outside of this:
b) the obligatory pair of clowns (likely mocha/orange storm, or the like)
c) Tailspot Blenny
d) Midas Blenny
e) Possum/8-Line/6-Line/Mystery wrasse (likely the 8-Line)
f) Several 'nano' fish - Hectors/Ranfords Goby/Barnacle Blenny/etc, etc
g) Long-nosed Hawkfish

And trying to decide on a group of fish:
h) 3-4 yellow tangs
or
i) 3-4 purple tangs
or
j) harem of anthias (Dispar or Purple Queen)
or
k) group of Threadfin Cardinals

 

[naterealbig]

OK, so just a little bit of frustration...

Watched ammonia climb from ~ 0.5 to something > 0.5 in ~ 16 hours....



Purchased a Hanna Checker for Ammonia, to make sure I wasn't making changes based on a 'bad' data



Added another dose of Ammo-Lock - this time did the full dose (12.5 ml).... Ammonia dropped as expected within a couple hours to:



And in less than a day had risen > 0.2 ppm above previous reading....

 

[naterealbig]

I know, I know - tracking initial cycle is so boring (and should be 'beyond me' as a 'seasoned' aquarist).... but I can't help it. Combo of being out of the hobby for about a year and a half, being a complete nerd when it comes to (I'm using this term VERY liberally) experiments...

So it turns out I messed this one up from the start... Ammonia continues to rise, and I have been countering it with additions of Ammo-Lock (which I don't particularly like), and for some reason I'm just now realizing it's because I never cleaned the dry rock before I added it to the bin (and probably also after I removed it from my last tank).

Knowing it will be a while (likely weeks) before the bacteria colonies from the Keys rock are big enough to process it (all the while risking high/chronic ammonia levels, also likely for weeks), I decided (@Petcrazyson - this one's for you) to add some bottled bacteria to the curing bin today (thank you, Amazon). I started out with 6 oz of Dr. Tims "One and Only", and will follow up tomorrow with a full dose of Brightwell's MicroBacter Start XLM, and will also follow that up with a full dose of MicroBacter Clean (this one to help break all the gunk in the rock down).

The bad news is I won't be able to attribute anything to the "natural" culture of bacteria I was able to bring in. The good news I guess, is that if it works, the results may be more replicable (as the bottled bacterial cultures are very accessible to most)....

Will test again tomorrow before I add the Brightwell products to see if Bacterial cultures added today have any immediate effect on ammonia levels...

 

[Petcrazyson]

Definitely gutsy, but I don't feel like it's completely unrealistic. It would be a total of about ~ 5 months.... In comparison, my brother (who has been in the hobby almost as long as I have) is still struggling very much keeping Acros in his 1.5 yr old system... You are right - we will definitely see. I will try 2 or 3 medium-difficulty sticks to test.

I think you could get away with a type of Slimer or other Acros that are much better equipped for a still maturing tank. I think with your expertise you can get away with it

The UV sterilizer for sure will almost instantly cure this - have used many times. If you're not planning on running one for parasite 'control', a super-cheap one will do the trick. A used Coralife (or Jabao, etc) would work in a pinch.

The reason I‘m not in favor of getting a UV sterilizer is because the sterilizer doesn’t discriminate between good and bad bacteria. I wouldn’t want another big bacteria bloom as I am dealing with now, or a very low supply of beneficial bacteria. I do want to try the Microbacter Clean and Dr. Tim‘s special water clarifier. If all else fails I’ll use the Coralife one I have. A crappy sterilizer but I’m hoping that if my supply of bottled ingredients doesn’t work then the sterilizer will work juuuuust enough.

 

[Petcrazyson]

I have several fish in mind, but the most important: Z. Rostratum [Black/Long-nosed Tang] (and specifically, the Hawaiian variant - they look MUCH better than the ones from the Christmas Islands). I actually had one before the Hawaii fishery shut down, and I literally would kick myself in the butt if I could... Would also consider the 'right' Koi Scopas in place of this, but I will try to hold out...

Outside of this:
b) the obligatory pair of clowns (likely mocha/orange storm, or the like)
c) Tailspot Blenny
d) Midas Blenny
e) Possum/8-Line/6-Line/Mystery wrasse (likely the 8-Line)
f) Several 'nano' fish - Hectors/Ranfords Goby/Barnacle Blenny/etc, etc
g) Long-nosed Hawkfish

And trying to decide on a group of fish:
h) 3-4 yellow tangs
or
i) 3-4 purple tangs
or
j) harem of anthias (Dispar or Purple Queen)
or
k) group of Threadfin Cardinals

I think I can be a great help with the Black tang. Wanna know something? TopShelf Aquatics, which is near to you carry them frequently funny enough. There was one there a few weeks ago and it may still be there or another would, and, its a Hawaiian. Not sure if they got another one in and it’s a Christmas Island one, but at least you know there is one. That tang has got a heck of a price though.

 

[Petcrazyson]

I have several fish in mind, but the most important: Z. Rostratum [Black/Long-nosed Tang] (and specifically, the Hawaiian variant - they look MUCH better than the ones from the Christmas Islands). I actually had one before the Hawaii fishery shut down, and I literally would kick myself in the butt if I could... Would also consider the 'right' Koi Scopas in place of this, but I will try to hold out...

Outside of this:
b) the obligatory pair of clowns (likely mocha/orange storm, or the like)
c) Tailspot Blenny
d) Midas Blenny
e) Possum/8-Line/6-Line/Mystery wrasse (likely the 8-Line)
f) Several 'nano' fish - Hectors/Ranfords Goby/Barnacle Blenny/etc, etc
g) Long-nosed Hawkfish

And trying to decide on a group of fish:
h) 3-4 yellow tangs
or
i) 3-4 purple tangs
or
j) harem of anthias (Dispar or Purple Queen)
or
k) group of Threadfin Cardinals

Ok ok ok ok ok……IM NOT THE TANG POLICE….but I can’t not say this. Your tank is 80 gallons and a 4 foot right? A group of tangs is a TERRIFYING IDEA in that size tank. I think you could get away with your Black Longnose for several months and maybe a type of Bristletooth, but 4!….ehhhhhhh they will decimate each other especially if the same body shape. I’m not telling you not to do it, it’s your tank, and maybe you can have success, I’m just talking on behalf of myself and a plethora of other reefers.

 

[Petcrazyson]

I have several fish in mind, but the most important: Z. Rostratum [Black/Long-nosed Tang] (and specifically, the Hawaiian variant - they look MUCH better than the ones from the Christmas Islands). I actually had one before the Hawaii fishery shut down, and I literally would kick myself in the butt if I could... Would also consider the 'right' Koi Scopas in place of this, but I will try to hold out...

Outside of this:
b) the obligatory pair of clowns (likely mocha/orange storm, or the like)
c) Tailspot Blenny
d) Midas Blenny
e) Possum/8-Line/6-Line/Mystery wrasse (likely the 8-Line)
f) Several 'nano' fish - Hectors/Ranfords Goby/Barnacle Blenny/etc, etc
g) Long-nosed Hawkfish

And trying to decide on a group of fish:
h) 3-4 yellow tangs
or
i) 3-4 purple tangs
or
j) harem of anthias (Dispar or Purple Queen)
or
k) group of Threadfin Cardinals

I like your fish ideas. Here are my suggestions:

Clownfish: Always a must in my books lol. If you aren’t set on a certain pattern than IMO mocha storms would be nice, or a naked dot, orange or black color like my male. They have the white and black pattern of the regular Storms, but they still have all the circles of orange, and the naked dots look pretty nice and funny.

Tail Spot Blenny: Cute and has a fun personality. They can get aggressive though towards slower moving fish and could pose a problem towards SPS with time. But maybe not and you could get lucky and get a calm Sps tolerant guy, or gal.

Midas Blenny: Love these guys. I’ve you‘ve seen my fish list, that Midas is on there. Both blenny’s could be aggressive towards each other, or at least have a few disputes. Midas are much less probable of being a problem towards Sps but I think it’s worth it. And if you do get a type of Anthias, you will probably find him being with them a lot.

Did you say Possum Wrasse? I’m sure if @i cant think reads this he will have a smile on his face. I personally don’t know much about them, he could be a better source of advice over them than me, but I think they would be a nice addition. They don’t swim out and open like most fish do so it’s a rewarding treat to see them when they do come out.

Eight lined wrasse or Six line wrasse: Little buggers! Pretty little buggers! I don’t support nor decline that choice, just be careful with them. Especially if you want other wrasse and shyer and slower fish.

Mystery Wrasse: A beautiful fish but a it’s a double blade. That wrasse while beautiful has the capability of terrorizing no matter what fish you have in your tank, especially a wrasse, and most especially the little nano fish. If you do settle on the Mystery, I would count out your nano and possum wrasse and tail spot blenny.

Some Nano fish are a good choice. Depends on the ones you get though. They may be really skittish especially with other bigger fish. Some ideas could be Chalk Bass or Firefish or a Court Jester Goby.

Longnose Hawkfish: Another personal fav. Good choice. He could get a little mean though. Saying that though his personality and swim pattern entertains really well.
And he’s a much better candidate if you want to keep some designer inverts as tank mates.

Cardinals: They are pretty just not my choice. If you enjoy them go for it. But I don’t recommend more than a pair or trio.

Anthias: Good choice! I’m sure yk what preferences they have and some require but don’t revolve around that too much. Dispars are nice. Queens could get a little big though. Personally Bimacs would be my choice. 4 or 5 of the Anthias will help you in terms of their comfortability and best attitude and personality.

I would top it off with only 10 to 12 fish. Heres a list I would follow with the number and types of your preferred fish.

x2 Clowns
x4 Anthias
x1 Longnose Hawfish
x1 Midas Blenny
x1 Possum Wrasse
x1-3 Chalk Bass or x1 Court Jester Goby
x Black Longnose Tang (Hawaiian)

This is just my idea, but its your tank do what ever you want lol. Hopefully @i cant think can chime in his ideas and help you out further. I’m sure with whatever you choose it will turn out with success. Happy reefing!

 

[naterealbig]

I think you could get away with a type of Slimer or other Acros that are much better equipped for a still maturing tank. I think with your expertise you can get away with it

Agreed - but what's the fun if I don't try something that's more challenging?

The reason I‘m not in favor of getting a UV sterilizer is because the sterilizer doesn’t discriminate between good and bad bacteria.

Keep in mind the majority of the beneficial bacteria will be on the rock, and not in the water column. Could be a threat to plankton, but it would only be temporary...

I think I can be a great help with the Black tang. Wanna know something? TopShelf Aquatics, which is near to you carry them frequently funny enough. There was one there a few weeks ago and it may still be there or another would, and, its a Hawaiian. Not sure if they got another one in and it’s a Christmas Island one, but at least you know there is one. That tang has got a heck of a price though.

This is great to know, thank you for the tip! I just checked on their website and didn't see anything but I'm going to find some time to drop by the store... I had no idea they were so close! I've got a ton of gift cards from them too right now... And trust me - I know very well aware of the price tag!

Ok ok ok ok ok……IM NOT THE TANG POLICE….but I can’t not say this. Your tank is 80 gallons and a 4 foot right? A group of tangs is a TERRIFYING IDEA in that size tank. I think you could get away with your Black Longnose for several months and maybe a type of Bristletooth, but 4!….ehhhhhhh they will decimate each other especially if the same body shape. I’m not telling you not to do it, it’s your tank, and maybe you can have success, I’m just talking on behalf of myself and a plethora of other reefers.

I have had experience keeping several like-shaped tangs together, and never saw more aggression between them than them and other fish. I don't think a few babies would be terrible for this size tank (ending dimensions will be ~ 52" x 24" x 20"... but you're right - they grow quickly and I'm not hard-set on them. The single Black/Koi Scopas is a must, however.

Clownfish: Always a must in my books lol. If you aren’t set on a certain pattern than IMO mocha storms would be nice, or a naked dot, orange or black color like my male. They have the white and black pattern of the regular Storms, but they still have all the circles of orange, and the naked dots look pretty nice and funny.

I like all of these. See a few pairs at TSA - when I'm ready to buy, I know there will be a pair that 'speak' to me Your clowns are beautiful! Will likely pair these up with a CSB or (my dream) a Nexus Burst.

Tail Spot Blenny: Cute and has a fun personality. They can get aggressive though towards slower moving fish and could pose a problem towards SPS with time. But maybe not and you could get lucky and get a calm Sps tolerant guy, or gal.

Interesting - I've had these guys in almost every tank I've had over the last decade, and have never had a problem with aggression, or bothering corals. Will do some digging on this one - thank you for the heads up!

Midas Blenny: Love these guys. I’ve you‘ve seen my fish list, that Midas is on there. Both blenny’s could be aggressive towards each other, or at least have a few disputes. Midas are much less probable of being a problem towards Sps but I think it’s worth it. And if you do get a type of Anthias, you will probably find him being with them a lot.

Yes - stunning fish, and I saw it on your list. Didn't realize they would 'hang out' with the Anthias - definitely a 'plus' in my book!

Did you say Possum Wrasse? I’m sure if @i cant think reads this he will have a smile on his face. I personally don’t know much about them, he could be a better source of advice over them than me, but I think they would be a nice addition. They don’t swim out and open like most fish do so it’s a rewarding treat to see them when they do come out.

Yes!! They are very unique fish. A little derpy, but that makes them fun, and I've never had one that showed any aggression. They just hover around the rock, looking for the unsuspecting copepod....

Eight lined wrasse or Six line wrasse: Little buggers! Pretty little buggers! I don’t support nor decline that choice, just be careful with them. Especially if you want other wrasse and shyer and slower fish.

Agreed! The 8-Line I think is the less aggressive of these two. If I got one of these, I would forego the Possum.

Mystery Wrasse: A beautiful fish but a it’s a double blade. That wrasse while beautiful has the capability of terrorizing no matter what fish you have in your tank, especially a wrasse, and most especially the little nano fish. If you do settle on the Mystery, I would count out your nano and possum wrasse and tail spot blenny.

Not likely to get this one, but they have always been one of my favorites. We are aligned on the agression issues...

Cardinals: They are pretty just not my choice. If you enjoy them go for it. But I don’t recommend more than a pair or trio.

They definitely aren't my favorite either, but they are one of the few fish that I have seen school/swim together in smaller tanks. For coloration, a group of Anthias are much better...

Anthias: Good choice! I’m sure yk what preferences they have and some require but don’t revolve around that too much. Dispars are nice. Queens could get a little big though. Personally Bimacs would be my choice. 4 or 5 of the Anthias will help you in terms of their comfortability and best attitude and personality.

I've always had pretty good luck with Anthias - I've had Dispars, Queens, Saddle-back, Squareback, Lyretails - all great fish. I've never kept bimaculatus - but they are certainly beautiful!

This is just my idea, but its your tank do what ever you want lol. Hopefully @i cant think can chime in his ideas and help you out further. I’m sure with whatever you choose it will turn out with success. Happy reefing!

I appreciate the thoughtful feedback and ideas - cheers!

 

[Petcrazyson]

Agreed - but what's the fun if I don't try something that's more challenging?

Your right. Where’s the fun lol.

Keep in mind the majority of the beneficial bacteria will be on the rock, and not in the water column. Could be a threat to plankton, but it would only be temporary...

True. Thinking about adding it more.

This is great to know, thank you for the tip! I just checked on their website and didn't see anything but I'm going to find some time to drop by the store... I had no idea they were so close! I've got a ton of gift cards from them too right now... And trust me - I know very well aware of the price tag!

No problem. Always happy to help. Especially since I can’t have one lol, I’d be happy knowing he would be in great hands with you While I love TSA, I’m not too keen on it’s website because it doesn’t show not even a third of the fish they have. I’d figure that something that unique would come up on the website, so I’m not sure if they have it anymore in stock now but hey they could still have it. Something you could do is talk to “Scuba Steve” I believe he is the co-owner if not THE owner, so if you can sweeten up with his character I’m sure he will put double the effort into getting what you want sooner rather than later, especially if you are willing to pay top $$$ lol. Wonder if we could bump into each other in the store sometime! That would give us a good chance to give pointers and progress and ideas. Couple of gift cards ehhh? That’ll help you nicely. Glad you know what kind of customer TSA favors

I have had experience keeping several like-shaped tangs together, and never saw more aggression between them than them and other fish. I don't think a few babies would be terrible for this size tank (ending dimensions will be ~ 52" x 24" x 20"... but you're right - they grow quickly and I'm not hard-set on them. The single Black/Koi Scopas is a must, however.

Experience is key! If you do decide to make a Tang Gang happen, I think you will have enough tricks up your sleeve to ensure it! So soon you will be converting to be a bigger tank? IMO bigger is better! I’m a little curious as of why if you want a bigger set up you go for 4’ 1/2 instead of 5’. I mean might as well right? Or are you planing to add on to the system in some way? Ready to see! Like I said I think your Black tang will work for a bit. Just be ready to make that extension or upgrade when the tang is reaching a certain size as to not need to loose it. Do you know when you plan on doing this?

 

[Petcrazyson]

I appreciate the thoughtful feedback and ideas - cheers!

I’m sure if we bump into each other at TSA more feedback and ideas will be happily given. And maybe some of yours? Happy reefing!

 

[naterealbig]

No problem. Always happy to help. Especially since I can’t have one lol, I’d be happy knowing he would be in great hands with you While I love TSA, I’m not too keen on it’s website because it doesn’t show not even a third of the fish they have. I’d figure that something that unique would come up on the website, so I’m not sure if they have it anymore in stock now but hey they could still have it. Something you could do is talk to “Scuba Steve” I believe he is the co-owner if not THE owner, so if you can sweeten up with his character I’m sure he will put double the effort into getting what you want sooner rather than later, especially if you are willing to pay top $$$ lol. Wonder if we could bump into each other in the store sometime! That would give us a good chance to give pointers and progress and ideas. Couple of gift cards ehhh? That’ll help you nicely. Glad you know what kind of customer TSA favors

I gave TSA a call today, and no luck on the Black Tang I left my name and number with Jed(/b?) the fish manager there, and he said he will take a look. I have also found several WYSIWYG vendors online as well, so I will be sniping for this guy in the coming weeks!

Experience is key! If you do decide to make a Tang Gang happen, I think you will have enough tricks up your sleeve to ensure it!

In my last tank I had a few different Zebrasoma species (Gem, Black, Purple) as well as a few different Bristle-Tooth tang species as well (Convict, Mimic-Lemon Peel, Mimic Eibli) and they all did very well. I quarantined the like genuses, and kept them well-fed. The Black Tang was the largest (and interestingly, the most friendly) of the bunch. I don't plan on having any of the Bristle-tooths this round (although they are GREAT algae eaters), and as you suggested - likely only a single medium sized Zebrasoma (as the 'centerpiece' fish).

So soon you will be converting to be a bigger tank? IMO bigger is better! I’m a little curious as of why if you want a bigger set up you go for 4’ 1/2 instead of 5’. I mean might as well right? Or are you planing to add on to the system in some way? Ready to see!

When I upgrade I will go big: ~ 400 gal (72" x 48" x 30" tall), but likely wont do it until we move into a new house - right now, not sure when that will be...

Like I said I think your Black tang will work for a bit. Just be ready to make that extension or upgrade when the tang is reaching a certain size as to not need to loose it. Do you know when you plan on doing this?

No time-frame yet - I'm good at re-homing - I have given away expensive fish to well-suited homes, so harm to the fish if he/she outgrows the tank.

I’m sure if we bump into each other at TSA more feedback and ideas will be happily given. And maybe some of yours? Happy reefing!

Yes - hope we run into each other. I'm ~ 6'4", blonde, viking beard... can't miss me.