Update - nitrate imbalance - running out of options

[joelat]

Hi all,

It’s been a few weeks since my last post, regarding my high nitrate issue I am experiencing.

Originally the issue was thought to have been high nitrate and undetectable phosphate however I have had an ICP and the phosphates are actually 0.1 so this dosnt seem as bad.

However the nitrates have reached a level of 107ppm which I have never seen before, all fish seem fine and swimming nicely, some of my Zoas don’t look too happy but I have had nothing die off yet so I am trying to fix the problem before this happens.

I have tried everything I can think of as follows.

- several large water changes (I look at this as more of a cover up than a solution, I need to find the root cause)

- dosing the required following icp (vanadium, manganese, iron & cobalt) I believe these have a small effect on the nitrogen cycle?

- adding cheato reactor - the cheato is growing like weeds I have harvested a full reactor full in just over a week.

- cleaned all detritus from sump.

- tested RO for nitrate contamination

Can anyone suggest anything obvious I am missing, this seems like an uphill battle at the moment!

Thanks in advance.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

How much does your nitrate drop after a large water change?

 

[Subsea]

Did you remove Ecosand as a source of high phosphate? Do you have a tank journal that details your system?

 

[joelat]

On the salifert test I have it dosnt seem to make a big difference, still bright pink/purple.

My lfs has a spin tester which I’ve been using every 7-10 days, I’d brought them down from 108ppm to 104ppm.

 

[joelat]

Did you remove Ecosand as a source of high phosphate? Do you have a tank journal that details your system?

I used ecosand in the initial start up of this tank and it caused high phosphates but I switched to caribsea straight away and it’s been fine since.

No I don’t but I can add one, is that a feature on here? I haven’t seen it before.

 

[blecki]

Sounds like you might already have the solution running with the chaeto reactor - how big is it? I wouldn't harvest too eagerly; the more chaeto, the more there is to grow, and the more nitrates it will remove.

 

[joelat]

Sounds like you might already have the solution running with the chaeto reactor - how big is it? I wouldn't harvest too eagerly; the more chaeto, the more there is to grow, and the more nitrates it will remove.

I just harvested when it looked full and the water was brown so I harvested and refilled with fresh salt water during water change.

At the rate it’s grown I would have expected a nitrate reduction but it hasn’t come just yet?

 

[blecki]

It's pretty good but it's not magic. But still most people harvest too soon. I don't consider the refugium 'full' until the chaeto starts trying to grow emersed.

 

[Subsea]

I used ecosand in the initial start up of this tank and it caused high phosphates but I switched to caribsea straight away and it’s been fine since.

No I don’t but I can add one, is that a feature on here? I haven’t seen it before.

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[ReefGeezer]

So, reducing nitrates by water changes is purely a math thing. A 50% water change (with RODI based fresh ASW) will drop nitrate, phosphate and other tings not contained in the new ASW by 50%. The problem you may be having is the high range resolution of the Salifert Kit and the Spin Tester. You might not be seeing the drop, particularly if you are doing occasional large water changes.

I don't know how big your system is, but doing back to back 50% water changes will drop the nitrate and phosphate levels. If you are really at 107 ppm, one change will get you to around 50 ppm, and a second will get you to about 25 ppm, & etc. At that point, you should be able to see changes with your salifert kit. HOWEVER, your nitrate level may be higher, in which case it might take 3 or more back tp back changes to get you there.

A Cheato reactor is great as long as you harvest the Cheato regularly. If it is large enough, it should help maintain your system. Unless it is really large, it might not lower the nitrate level very fast.

 

[joelat]

So, reducing nitrates by water changes is purely a math thing. A 50% water change (with RODI based fresh ASW) will drop nitrate, phosphate and other tings not contained in the new ASW by 50%. The problem you may be having is the high range resolution of the Salifert Kit and the Spin Tester. You might not be seeing the drop, particularly if you are doing occasional large water changes.

I don't know how big your system is, but doing back to back 50% water changes will drop the nitrate and phosphate levels. If you are really at 107 ppm, one change will get you to around 50 ppm, and a second will get you to about 25 ppm, & etc. At that point, you should be able to see changes with your salifert kit. HOWEVER, your nitrate level may be higher, in which case it might take 3 or more back tp back changes to get you there.

A Cheato reactor is great as long as you harvest the Cheato regularly. If it is large enough, it should help maintain your system. Unless it is really large, it might not lower the nitrate level very fast.

I have been doing around 20%

I will go for some larger water changes over the next few days to see if I notice a reduction, yes you are right once the level gets to a certain point it is just “high” and the colour change isn’t distinguishable I have ordered a phos and nitrate hanna but they said it may take up to 14 days because of the Christmas post.

I have just retrofitted the D&D liquid reactor as a cheato reactor and seems to be working, granted it isn’t a huge area inside so may not be effective as the bigger models.

 

[joelat]

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I have updated a thread on here

 

[KrisReef]

I recently moved a tank into a temporary holding bin. I can't replace nitrates and phosphates removed by simply feeding extra food to the fishes. Nitrate and Phosphate show up in the water from my fish feeding. If I cut that down, the fish get mad but the water gets cleaner (especially if I do a water change.)

How many buckets of food, and how many times per hour do you feed these fishes?

Otherwise, you will never be able to keep up with water changes until your input goes down, ime.

 

[joelat]

I recently moved a tank into a temporary holding bin. I can't replace nitrates and phosphates removed by simply feeding extra food to the fishes. Nitrate and Phosphate show up in the water from my fish feeding. If I cut that down, the fish get mad but the water gets cleaner (especially if I do a water change.)

How many buckets of food, and how many times per hour do you feed these fishes?

Otherwise, you will never be able to keep up with water changes until your input goes down, ime.

It gets 1 frozen cube per day, sometimes less depending on how quickly it gets eaten.

You would think that I’ve just dropped a rotting tuna in there or something with these levels but if anything I’d say some of the fish are underfed rather than overfed.

 

[KrisReef]

If you have a lot of algae growing the fish will process that into NO3 for you?

Not to mention pods.

 

[joelat]

If you have a lot of algae growing the fish will process that into NO3 for you?

Barely any, apart from the usual build up on the glass. One thing I’ve not really had an issue with on this tank. The sand bed and rock work has always been pretty algae free.

 

[Troylee]

How many fish and what size tank? Carbon dosing would bring them down quick.. I struggle to keep nitrates above 5 and I have about 30 fish and feed 5 times a day lol..

 

[joelat]

How many fish and what size tank? Carbon dosing would bring them down quick.. I struggle to keep nitrates above 5 and I have about 30 fish and feed 5 times a day lol..

This would be a perfect world for me

I think there are 6 fish and they are fed once a day I’d like to feed more often to the tangs but impossible with these nitrates.

It’s 550 litres inc sump.

 

[Subsea]

How many fish and what size tank? Carbon dosing would bring them down quick.. I struggle to keep nitrates above 5 and I have about 30 fish and feed 5 times a day lol

This would be a perfect world for me

I think there are 6 fish and they are fed once a day I’d like to feed more often to the tangs but impossible with these nitrates.

It’s 550 litres inc sump.

@joelat

Sounds like carbon dosing with white vinegar will fix you up.

PS: I am considering dosing vinegar and I don’t have a protein skimmer. I already dose silicates, ammonia, iodine and liquid seaweed concentrate,

 

[Charles Zinn]

Socks or Roller. how often do you clean?
Clean up crew..How mant types and numbers?
Do you add pods?