Why do EXTREME fixes seem to be the suggested go to on online forums?

[ca1ore]

I wonder what percentage of R2R ‘members’ are less than two years in the hobby? I sometimes look back at older threads and the majority of the posters are long gone. People new to the hobby don’t have the experience to know how to react to a particular issue .... and there are a chorus of equally inexperienced reefers validating an ‘overreaction’. My personal favorite is ‘tank must be leaking because there’s salt creep in the bottom rim’. Bunch of folks chime in that the tank should be emptied immediately and replaced because ‘you dint want xxx gallons of water on the floor’. Maybe the tank IS leaking, or maybe some water got splashed down the outside LOL.

None of that means treatment of something like ich won’t require copper treatment. Maybe a few vitamins can help, or maybe they cannot. I do agree that the trend to blast a new fish with a prophylactic cocktail of meds may have gone a bit too far.

 

[Dolphins18]

Looking forward to updating this thread, I had a quick emergency and had to run out. I look forward to seeing more constructive topics to talk on and will provide my response to all as soon as I get home!
I’d also be happy to use this thread as a place to answer any questions reefers have, I will try to answer any question I’ve experienced in the last 30 years

 

[Montiman]

As a reefer of over a decade I think the OP does have a point. I have learned that pointing the ship in the right direction is more important than where the tank is right now. Problems like Dinos, Ich, and Aiptasia should be solved over months to years rather than days.

I think there are a few things that have caused the trends we see towards radical fixes. The biggest is a complete reversal of one of the reefing mottos I grew up with. I used to hear less technology more biology but now it seems reefer have had a complete reversal.

Combined with this reliance on technology is a totally different goal for a reef tank. Fewer reeftanks are designed to be little slices of the reef and more look like a sterile collection of colored marbles.

Best way to fix Dinos IMO is use live rock. Best way to solve ich is have a well established system of years with healthy well fed fish. Best way to fix Aiptasia is to add peppermint shrimp, Klines Butterfly, Copperband Butterfly, Longnose Butterfly, Margined Coralfish, Matted Filefish, or Tassled Filefish. When you implement any of these fixes wait for a month or more to see results.

 

[Dolphins18]

I dont actually consider all your examples extreme so maybe i am part of the problem in your mind. As for things like aiptasia if i see a single one pop up you can bet i am going to go "extreme" to handle it. I despise it and despite your assurance it can easily be managed i didn't nt find that to be the case once it gets a foothold it becomes a nonstop battle unless you are willing to put a filefish, pep shrimps, berghias in tank(all are "no-go" in my tanks).


To answer this one....yes. it is actually fairly common for people to "bomb" their homes once a twice a year even without seeing pests. I never see pests in my home....probably because it is bombed every spring and late fall.

Fair enough, I sprinkle pest repellant $19.99) Around my home once a year and get maybe a pest or two. I suppose if you find the allergy issues and potential long term issues associated with bombing a home to save you a few bugs, do you.

As far as aiptasia, 2 berghia nudbiranches would've solved your whole problem. And I can guarantee that.

 

[Dolphins18]

I get your point but why is it inherently better/simpler to feed more than to dose nitrate? What if i want to raise nitrate and not phosphate...or the other way around? Think it boils down to their being many ways to accomplish the same exact goal. Your option may be reduced skimming. That is not something i would want to do. I may feed a little more and see how that goes, but dosing nitrate I would consider a much more straightforwards KISS approach. I can easily calculate exactly how much nitrate it is going to add....with most food that takes a lot of research and is still just going to give you a ballpark. Again i think your approach is fine if that is what you want to do, but so is dosing nitrate. Different approaches do not mean one is inferior.

You must realize for a new reefer it is merely simpler to understand, and in the long term, understanding the process is more important than just dosing "nitrates" as a means to keep things under control.
Nitrate dosing was not a thing back in the day, and new reefers have much more trouble than they did back then.

 

[Dolphins18]

I wonder what percentage of R2R ‘members’ are less than two years in the hobby? I sometimes look back at older threads and the majority of the posters are long gone. People new to the hobby don’t have the experience to know how to react to a particular issue .... and there are a chorus of equally inexperienced reefers validating an ‘overreaction’. My personal favorite is ‘tank must be leaking because there’s salt creep in the bottom rim’. Bunch of folks chime in that the tank should be emptied immediately and replaced because ‘you dint want xxx gallons of water on the floor’. Maybe the tank IS leaking, or maybe some water got splashed down the outside LOL.

None of that means treatment of something like ich won’t require copper treatment. Maybe a few vitamins can help, or maybe they cannot. I do agree that the trend to blast a new fish with a prophylactic cocktail of meds may have gone a bit too far.

You are so right, so much bad information, especially from people considered, reef2reef mods because they did what?
Sorry for firing shots, but misinformation ruins the hobby for newcomers.

 

[Dolphins18]

You must realize for a new reefer it is merely simpler to understand, and in the long term, understanding the process is more important than just dosing "nitrates" as a means to keep things under control.
Nitrate dosing was not a thing back in the day, and new reefers have much more trouble than they did back then.

Also to back this up, 15 years ago dinos were never a problem, the insane methods people take, cause a resistance in dinos, and if you do not see it as an experienced reefer you are quite frankly blind.

 

[hds4216]

Also to back this up, 15 years ago dinos were never a problem, the insane methods people take, cause a resistance in dinos, and if you do not see it as an experienced reefer you are quite frankly blind.

You can’t just claim selective pressure inducing resistance without actual (I.e. non-anecdotal) evidence.

 

[Dolphins18]

&& I am pointing for an answer from the "experienced reefers" here, #reefsqaud care to chime in?

 

[Dolphins18]

You can’t just claim selective pressure inducing resistance without actual (I.e. non-anecdotal) evidence.

Well, 15 years ago dinos were not an issue. There is not many ways to prove it other than posting FTS of my current tanks without dinos.
Maybe they weren't an issue because people did not act like they were Armageddon?
And I say this not because they were not an issue for me, they were unheard of. It was not an issue for anyone.

Maybe I don't have dinos because I let them run their cycle, or don't dose peroxide at first sight!

Stop with the bad info!

Also I'd like to say I dealt with dinos recently in a tank I cycled with dry rock, saw them for only a day in a tank I cycled with LR.
I cycle with Dry over and over because they are easy to eliminate, not with insane methods, but with patience and a few weeks.
I imagine the methods mentioned here make them worse.

 

[mdb_talon]

Fair enough, I sprinkle pest repellant $19.99) Around my 4500 sq ft once a year and get maybe a pest or two. I suppose if you find the allergy issues and potential long term issues associated with bombing a home to save you a few bugs, do you.

As far as aiptasia, 2 berghia nudbiranches would've solved your whole problem. And I can guarantee that.

I assume you just ignored where i said berghias are a "no-go" in my tanks? Again getting back to my point your situation may be very different from others. I have tried them multiple times years ago and they made almost zero difference. Likely because there is a very long list of things fish/crabs that will eat them and they struggle with very high flow. Again my strategy is now taking "extreme" measures to prevent an outbreak rather than throw money after it hoping i something done nt eat the nudis on day one.

Your approach is fine if it works for you....so is mine.

 

[Dolphins18]

We want to join this hobby... not be scared away. Experienced reefers, imagine in your first two months someone told you to empl

I assume you just ignored where i said berghias are a "no-go" in my tanks? Again getting back to my point your situation may be very different from others. I have tried them multiple times years ago and they made almost zero difference. Likely because there is a very long list of things fish/crabs that will eat them and they struggle with very high flow. Again my strategy is now taking "extreme" measures to prevent an outbreak rather than throw money after it hoping i something done nt eat the nudis on day one.

Your approach is fine if it works for you....so is mine.

I am sorry, I missed that. What prevents you from individually injecting them every few months with boiling water?
It completely keeps them under control, and while you will see one or two occasionally, your tank isn't "forfeit" Because of it.
Aiptasia should not scare new comers.

In my current pred tank, berghias and any other aiptasia eaters are not acceptable.

Do i consider killing aiptasia a couple times a month a life threating reason to leave the hobby?
Of course not.

 

[mdb_talon]

You must realize for a new reefer it is merely simpler to understand, and in the long term, understanding the process is more important than just dosing "nitrates" as a means to keep things under control.
Nitrate dosing was not a thing back in the day, and new reefers have much more trouble than they did back then.

Lol and what evidence do you have new reefers have it harder than back in the day? Been in the hobby for thirty years and i can say i have the exact opposite impression. The tanks we see commonly today were extremely rare "back in the day". It was not long ago keeping a reef tank stable and sucessful for more than a handful of years was very rare.

 

[Dolphins18]

Lol and what evidence do you have new reefers have it harder than back in the day? Been in the hobby for thirty years and i can say i have the exact opposite impression. The tanks we see commonly today were extremely rare "back in the day". It was not long ago keeping a reef tank stable and sucessful for more than a handful of years was very rare.

Lol, a response like that, quite frankly if you cant find room for aiptasia eaters, and you think that is the end of all for your aquarium and if you cant kill a few here and there to keep them under control, maybe you should leave the hobby.

 

[mdb_talon]

We want to join this hobby... not be scared away. Experienced reefers, imagine in your first two months someone told you to empl

I am sorry, I missed that. What prevents you from individually injecting them every few months with boiling water?
It completely keeps them under control, and while you will see one or two occasionally, your tank isn't "forfeit" Because of it.
Aiptasia should not scare new comers.

Why on earth would i want to repeatedly crawl all around my tanks and constantly inspect for aiptasia to kill? You really think that is less extreme than eradicating the first one you see (even if it means removing that rock/frag).

Why is it so difficult to accept that people doing things different than you is not a bad thing?

 

[Dolphins18]

Why on earth would i want to repeatedly crawl all around my tanks and constantly inspect for aiptasia to kill? You really think that is less extreme than eradicating the first one you see (even if it means removing that rock/frag).

Why is it so difficult to accept that people doing things different than you is not a bad thing?

Its like 2-3 times a year after a while.. if you are crawling around your tank looking for them you should research them, they are harmless unless touching your corals, in other words, you would see them and eliminate them... stop being childish.

This thread is about people doing things different, but not deterring them from the hobby, and if you are scaring people by making aiptasia a big deal, thats exactly what you are doing.

 

[mdb_talon]

Lol, a response like that, quite frankly if you cant find room for aiptasia eaters, and you think that is the end of all for your aquarium and if you cant kill a few here and there to keep them under control, maybe you should leave the hobby.

Comprehension is not your strong suite. I have plenty of room...i dont have tank setups/livestock conucive to keeping them alive.

So i guess it is a good thing that instead i just never let there be an infestation i guess. Apparently i should quit the hobby because i dont have a aiptasia problem?

 

[Dolphins18]

Comprehension is not your strong suite. I have plenty of room...i dont have tank setups/livestock conucive to keeping them alive.

So i guess it is a good thing that instead i just never let there be an infestation i guess. Apparently i should quit the hobby because i dont have a aiptasia problem?

folks, heres the extreme I talked about in the initial post.

 

[mdb_talon]

Its like 2-3 times a year after a while.. if you are crawling around your tank looking for them you should research them, they are harmless unless touching your corals, in other words, you would see them and eliminate them... stop being childish.

This thread is about people doing things different things, but not deterring them from the hobby, and if you are scaring people by making aiptasia a big deal, thats exactly what you are doing.

Actually no they are not harmless as they spread....rapidly in some scenarios. Especially in ky scenario where i feed fine food every other day. Again please just accept that your way is not the only way. Its really funny you are trying to convince me i am doing something wrong because i fo NOT have an issue with aiptasia

 

[Dolphins18]

Actually no they are not harmless as they spread....rapidly in some scenarios. Especially in ky scenario where i feed fine food every other day. Again please just accept that your way is not the only way. Its really funny you are trying to convince me i am doing something wrong because i fo NOT have an issue with aiptasia

Why don't you just kill them? Please explain.. what do you want from me? What is your method, it sounds like you have an issue with them..