Tired of fighting phosphates. About to call it quits.

[KrisReef]

Well I've also been dosing 2ml lanthanum chloride daily with no effect. Was also planning on using gfo.

Do you seen any precipitation? Lanthanum is easier to use that GFO, ime. The liquid you have must be very dilute. I would double or triple the dose and remeasure shortly afterwards to see if you can detect lower levels.

As mentioned before, the binding and unbinding happens fairly quickly, and with .5ppm in solution there must be a boat load "bound" to the substrates.

Even better, take out a gallon of tank water and add 2mls and see if you get precipitation, and measurable lowering of PPM P in the gallon of water. That should help figure out if your LC treatment solution is working, or if it is too dilute for the issue you are trying to address?

 

[bakbay]

Been saying this all along - LC will drop your PO4. If you're not seeing results, increase the dosage. On my SPS-dominant 150g tank, it came out to 80 drops to go from 0.37 to 0.05 (I did this in the summer and will likely need to do this again this month). I typically divide that up over a period of a week and not do all 80 drops in one day. YMMV but it's trial & error.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

I appreciate everyone's response but people talking about whether phosphates being high is an issue or not or if it's what's killing my corals doesn't help me or what I'm after. All my parameters are within range with the exception of phosphates. .5 is way above what's universally accepted isn't it?

Nope!

 

[bakbay]

Sorry — couldn’t help it but this thread feels like this?

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Sorry — couldn’t help it but this thread feels like this?

Yep. Just came back to "unwatch" it, lol.

 

[Bugzin]

So I had a pretty crazy algae problem that I posted about on Nov2 you can reference the picture. Which i took on that day. What I did was i threw in in about 8 more snails and 3 jars of copepods from Algae Barn and my tank is night and day different int he spam of 1 month. I'll put in a picture that I took today Dec 26th. Outside of that I never changed the way I fed. Also my class is dirty because holidays. Too busy to wipe it down, but good luck. I'd recommend trying what I did. Also my tank makes a year in June so i feel like it's doing pretty solid considering how young it is.

 

[QuinnLee512]

The problem was my water source. My rodi filters needed changing. I also changed my DI resin. My tank looks a lot better now. The algae is almost completely gone now.

 

[Coalminer]

Was it showing up as high TDS or did you test your Rodi water for phosphate?

 

[Reef.]

Sorry not read all 6 pages, got to page 3 and no mention of how often you use and change po4 removes and how often you do water changes apart from you don’t keep to a schedule which to me reads as you don’t do water changes regularly as if you did that would be a schedule of some sort.

Very easy to remove po4, couldn’t be easier, do water changes often and use some form of po4 remover and change as soon as it’s exhausted, which for a lvl of 0.4 could be within hours, not days.

Adding a pinch of pellets a day, even if eaten will be adding a load of po4 as fish poo which is po4, not removing that will result in high po4.

 

[QuinnLee512]

So to reiterate, my question was "where could all this phosphate be coming from". Could it be food, leeching from my rocks, water? In my case it was my water source. I had tested my rodi water a few months back and it was good so I didn't think to test it again. I believe my TDS was 0 but I don't think a 0 TDS means 0 phosphate? I used my hanna checker to test my rodi water and it was reading 1.

 

[Vjames]

I've had my 15G peninsula for a little over a year. Been fighting high phosphates for at least the past 6 months. This hobby is no longer fun. I've lost lots of corals. I've used gfo, rowaphos, phosphate e, elimi phos. I have 2 clowns. I feed pellets once a day. I've tested my water source. My phosphates are regularly at least .4. I have caribsea liferock. Was thinking about completely replacing the rocks but without knowing where the phosphate is coming from, don't want to do that yet. Any last ditch effort I can try?

Hello, QuinnLee512! I would definitely suggest you add some red dragon macro algae to your sump or display. Just make sure you don't expose them to high-lighting areas. They will definitely take care of it. Also, If you have a tang, it's a meal for them. Happy Reefing!

 

[ReefGeezer]

How long have you been using the Hanna curvettes (test bottles)? These tend to become scratched or glazed and give high readings after a while. I'm not good at caring for mine. Anytime I get elevated phosphate readings, I get new ones from BRS. They are cheap. Many times, it turns out that dirty curvettes are the source of most the phosphate problem.

I would stop feeding the pellets and maybe switch to frozen food. Less phosphate, more protein.

 

[Digimes]

I feed frozen brine, twice a day. A single block last me 3-4 days. If you use filter floss, make sure your changing that weekly.

 

[jda]

I don't think that food type matters. IMO, the only difference is the water content of dry vs frozen. I have seen studies that say one way, and another that says the other, but if pellets are made from mysis ,spirulina, copepods, fish meal, some vitamins and stuff, then the only difference is the moisture. It isn't like anybody is putting sodium triphosphate in the dry fish food. How is phosphate added by using whole ingredients?

 

[thecodingart]

When starting out my tank, and even a little now, I've been fighting some odd phosphate fluctuations.

The first thing that helped was using ROWA phos in a reactor (this dropped my Phosphate level significantly from > 1 -> 0.01-ish).

RowaPhos Phosphate Remover

Remove phosphates from your reef tank with patented, man-made ferric hydroxide from RowaPhos. Phosphate removal in a reef tank is important because nuisance algae is fed by phosphates. This algae can overrun your expensive corals spoiling the aesthetics of the tank. Additionally, high phosphate...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

From here, my Phosphates started fluctuating between 0.01 - 0.1 for a brand new tank (up and down). Replacing the medium was an easy way to re-lower the level but I wanted a perm solution.

My Alk level was fine (12) amongst all other readings minus low PH (fluctuating between 7.7 - 7.8).

I ended up circulating more air in my home + aiming my return jets at the top of the water to get the PH level up, and lo and behold my Phosphate level started decreasing again.

I also lowered my feeding schedule just a smidge. I was feeding 8 times a day via the Plank auto feeder, now it's 6 times a day.

Just some tidbits from my current experience and battle to help along.

I've been told that once Coral starts growing, that will also help significantly.

 

[minus9]

So there’s a lot to unpack here. First, as you’ve discovered, your RO unit needs an upgrade. I don’t think a 4 stage is cutting it and you may want to add at least two stages of DI. Starting with crappy source water will lead to problems, so it pays to have super clean water from the start. Second, in order for food to be an issue, you would have to add in too much food that goes uneaten for it to turn into PO4. When food is consumed, it’s turned into urea/waste which is food for corals in the form of ammonium. Two tiny clowns are not going to cause PO4 problems from eating alone. Speaking of food, you may want to change up the food instead of only feeding one thing. TDO pellets are far more nutritious than mysis pellets. I would also add in or feed LRS or similar frozen food as well.
Also, here’s a great article by RHF that may help those who are confused about phosphate/phosphorus in our tanks.
Phosphate article
For those in similar situations, never starve your fish in hopes that you’re helping to reduce nutrients, that’s a losing battle and will cause more problems. Algae is really good at life, and you’ll never control them based on nutrient levels. The same conditions corals need are the same conditions algae needs. The difference is, algae can grow under zero nutrient conditions, corals will die under those conditions.
To the OP, beef up your RO unit, trim back the algae manually and employ CUC to help manage it.

 

[DIYreefer]

The problem was my water source. My rodi filters needed changing. I also changed my DI resin. My tank looks a lot better now. The algae is almost completely gone now.

I feel like we don't emphasize how important good, cleans source water is in this hobby. IMO, a good ro/di unit is the most important piece of the puzzle when keeping a reef tank.

You can have all the fancy lights and wavemakers in the world but if your source water sucks, your tank likely will as well.

I'm glad you've found the source of your problem and I hope that you are able to get the po4 issue under control. If I were you, my next big purchase for the tank would be a better ro/di machine. I personally use one of these with a booster pump (booster pump not only makes the unit work far more efficiently, it also prolongs the life of the filters and resins).

7 Stage PRO Plus 75 GPD RO/DI System

Make up to 75 Gallons per day of the Best RODI Water your Reef Tank Will Ever Get! Super efficient with DI consumption Includes BRS Pro resin Produce 0 TDS water Minimal wastewater Includes Float Valve and Inline Ball Valve Multiple source water connections Mur-lok Push Connect dual EPDM O-Ring...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

These units are a bit expensive, and I get that they aren't much fun. However, they will definitely help provide a solid foundation to start from and make the hobby much easier/more enjoyable. I really can't stress enough how important it is to have clean water to start with. Good luck!

 

[thecodingart]

I feel like we don't emphasize how important good, cleans source water is in this hobby. IMO, a good ro/di unit is the most important piece of the puzzle when keeping a reef tank.

You can have all the fancy lights and wavemakers in the world but if your source water sucks, your tank likely will as well.

I'm glad you've found the source of your problem and I hope that you are able to get the po4 issue under control. If I were you, my next big purchase for the tank would be a better ro/di machine. I personally use one of these with a booster pump (booster pump not only makes the unit work far more efficiently, it also prolongs the life of the filters and resins).

7 Stage PRO Plus 75 GPD RO/DI System

Make up to 75 Gallons per day of the Best RODI Water your Reef Tank Will Ever Get! Super efficient with DI consumption Includes BRS Pro resin Produce 0 TDS water Minimal wastewater Includes Float Valve and Inline Ball Valve Multiple source water connections Mur-lok Push Connect dual EPDM O-Ring...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

These units are a bit expensive, and I get that they aren't much fun. However, they will definitely help provide a solid foundation to start from and make the hobby much easier/more enjoyable. I really can't stress enough how important it is to have clean water to start with. Good luck!

This is what I have! Love them.

 

[QuinnLee512]

I actually have this unit plus a single stage DI from BRS. I decided to buy a 2nd DI unit from BRS to make a 7 stage. My problem was due to my own stupidity and laziness. I thought the filters and membrane was on the same replacement schedule. Didn't realize the filters needed to be changed every year.

RO-90 – Ultimate 5-Stage 90 GPD High Output Reverse Osmosis Water Systems for Drinking Water, WQA Certified

Our Ultimate WQA Certified System Provides refreshing crisp taste superior to bottled water High flow 90 GPD production system with super capacity filters Certified with WQA Gold Seal, highest contaminant rejection guaranteed System built with US MADE top tier certified premium quality parts...

www.freedrinkingwater.com

 

[minus9]

I actually have this unit plus a single stage DI from BRS. I decided to buy a 2nd DI unit from BRS to make a 7 stage. My problem was due to my own stupidity and laziness. I thought the filters and membrane was on the same replacement schedule. Didn't realize the filters needed to be changed every year.

RO-90 – Ultimate 5-Stage 90 GPD High Output Reverse Osmosis Water Systems for Drinking Water, WQA Certified

Our Ultimate WQA Certified System Provides refreshing crisp taste superior to bottled water High flow 90 GPD production system with super capacity filters Certified with WQA Gold Seal, highest contaminant rejection guaranteed System built with US MADE top tier certified premium quality parts...

www.freedrinkingwater.com

Membranes can last a year, but filters and resins should be replaced as needed. This all depends on your source water Ana how much you make.