A discussion on immunity

[Humblefish]

But is that qt or hospital. Would that type of med best be done in hospital.

I've been experimenting with 10 days in a sterile hospital tank (using meds to eradicate parasites & deworm), followed by transfer into an "observation" tank. This is basically just like a DT with rocks, sand, corals, bacteria, all the things Paul likes. ;) In fact, someday it will just be transferring into a DT (after only 10 days QT) once I am completely confident this method works. For now the "observation" tank is my safety net.

The only hiccup is if a fish comes in badly diseased and develops a secondary bacterial infection. This sometimes necessities transfer into "hospital tank #2" for 10 days (or longer) of antibiotic treatment. So, the fish has to wait 10 more days before being placed into "paradise". ;)

 

[mcarroll]

I just fail to understand the camps tha taut no qt, but a stellar diet. I feel that probiotics, fresh ingredients, high variety, frequent feedings, and clean water as the norm, but utilized with qt gets you the benefits of both camps.

I don't think no-QT is part of the agenda....it may end up a natural side-effect though.

Just as it's important to distinguish what kind of "immunity" we're talking about (post [HASHTAG]#207[/HASHTAG] again) I think we need to be clear about the type of QT.

A QT can be as right or wrong as the person googling "QT FISH" and setting it up.

If your QT is another display tank, just apart from your primary display....then you can QT until the cows come home if you want. (I'd have to google "COWS COME HOME")

If your QT is a bare tank laced with copper...well. That should be more like a dip.

I personally don't keep many prs of fish,

+1

You are already three legs up over anyone who's ever posted a wipeout thread.

Posts that encourage people skipping qt are exactly what new aquarists want to hear.

Posts that make people think there's a magic bullet of any kind are what noobs want to hear.

What I think they might not totally mind, is if they were asked not to stock the tanks so full or so fast.

Allow yourself to be a beginner with a single (or very few) fish for a year or two or three. QT if you want (within said limits of good sense).....after that period of time, you will be almost impervious to "tank wipeout threads" due to your own experience and the resistance you've been able to establish in your fish.


"Go slow" for most seems to mean driving the speed limit to go pick up your box of fish.

I don't care how good (you think) your QT is, there's no expertise showing up with that box! ;):)


2¢

 

[Paul B]

I would not use any medication on a healthy "looking" fish.

 

[Paul B]

I always advise Noobs to quarantine, because,well, they are Noobs.

 

[edinphilly]

I always advise Noobs to quarantine, because,well, they are Noobs.

The problem is "noobs" for the most part don't find the forums while planning a tank. It's afterwards when they're trying to figure something out. So you've got a tank with fish that haven't been quarantined, or too big of a fish, or too many fish... and you end up on forums being told the million things you can't do and have done wrong. Of course I refer to the "big" forum in particular... So glad I have almost totally switched to reading on R2R. Threads like this, @Pual B HUGE thread documenting his tank, and @brandon429 thread on cycling are so much more useful. I have a heavily stocked tank, without quarantine, and with a Green Spotted Puffer in the reef (many mortal sins)... and I've had 2-3 years success that I attribute to proper nutrition (Paul's method but I don't stick to it quite as religiously as he does) and to a thorough (but continuously learning) understanding of the cycling process of a tank (and I don't just mean the nitrogen cycle).

 

[Paul B]

Keep doing what your doing, it sounds like a plan to success. My most important thing is I have a Supermodel who takes care of my fish when I am away. The fish love it. :rolleyes:

 

[mcarroll]

I had to re-read that first title about four times before I realized there were no typos. :D

PDF's available on both:

Sociomicrobiology and pathogenic bacteria
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4920084/

The Interplay between the Intestinal Microbiota and the Immune System
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4423786/

 

[Paul B]

I have been saying those things for many years. I guess those scientists who wrote that stuff read my book. ;)

 

[bios]

Sorry i haven't read your book
You can find my scientific pubblications writing on pubmed my name severini r
You are talking about something to bigger for you

 

[mcarroll]

Cool! :)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/?term=severini+r

 

[Paul B]

Sorry i haven't read your book
You can find my scientific pubblications writing on pubmed my name severini r
You are talking about something to bigger for you

That's because you are smarter than me. :D

 

[bios]

That's because you are smarter than me. :D

Or probably because in100 years of researches in immunoreactions we know less then 10percent of what happen
And you in 30 years of fish tank hobby know all

 

[edosan]

We all get your point @bios no need to be agressive about it...relax
Paul B is sharing his experience we can agree with it or not...but he is sharing ideas, experiences and making jokes about it also.

But comments like yours is what make people go away and stay in the shadows not sharing anything at all.

 

[bios]

We all get your point @bios no need to be agressive about it...relax
Paul B is sharing his experience we can agree with it or not...but he is sharing ideas, experiences and making jokes about it also.

But comments like yours is what make people go away and stay in the shadows not sharing anything at all.

Dont want to be aggressiv
Dont say nothing since he
Say that all scientists spending years in researches ....
Dont understend nothing...

 

[bios]

Respect his point of view
I share Something he says
But...

 

[bios]

And i stop here cause im inthis forum to learn ...from others

 

[eatbreakfast]

Respect his point of view
I share Something he says
But...

And i stop here cause im inthis forum to learn ...from others

But this might be an area we can learn from you. What are some of the things you agree with? What do you disagree with? What reasons do you agree or disagree?

 

[edosan]

Humor men just a bit of humor [emoji6]

 

[bios]

But this might be an area we can learn from you. What are some of the things you agree with? What do you disagree with? What reasons do you agree or disagree?

Immuno response is a multifactor response of an organism to an external attack. This can be devided in differents steps wich involve humor helth, nutrition level , enviroment and a chain of biochemical reactions.
What paul say about feeding and water condition and hapiness of his fishes is very important

 

[bios]

I also agree with him when he says that qt is a stress for a fish that can be traduced in low immunorespose to external attacks