Alkalinity

[Miller535]

every one drop is 1 dkh. So if it turns green after 7 drops then your dkh.

 

[ReefHomieJon]

The old red sea "Pro" alk kit: Card showed Red as endpoint

You would stop tritration not at Red, but as soon as you saw a color change.

Endpoint could have been orgrangish, pinkish or red.

You would see a flash of gray, then when it turned to one of the above stop, and take your reading.

Salifert:
Stop at the lavender hue, not going until the hot pink.

lol
Just get the Hanna

Aaaaaaand you STILL, didn’t answer, the question.

 

[ReefHomieJon]

Hi. We recently took over maintenance of our two year old 65gal nano tank.

All tests we have performed have come back normal except alkalinity. Seems to be high between 14-16 my main question is about the actual test. We are using a Red Sea multi test kit. My question is in regards to when to start counting. The test says to add one drop of solution then it should be blue... but my samples haven’t turned blue until around 3 drops. It then says to count the number of drops until it turns green. So I am wondering do I count from 1 or 3?
If I count from 1 my alkalinity is 14 dkh but if I count from 3 it is 11 dkh which is much more in range?
Anyone have experience with this kit?

I’m sorry that nobody can answer the question that you asked. I seen this post and was like YES somebody finally asking a question that I’ve been wondering too, so I’ve been waiting on a response but everybody dancin around the actual question that you asked which is making me question some folks reading comprehension. ‍

 

[GoVols]

Aaaaaaand you STILL, didn’t answer, the question.

Lol

I run an Alkatronic and for the most part, crosscheck it with the Salifert alk kit.

But, the endpoint to Sailfert is the lavender hue.

Your right,
Don't know the endpoint color to the "new" Red Sea Pro kit.....;Hilarious

lol
Are you a Gators fan???

gR,
Have a great evening....

 

[GoVols]

Hanna alk test aren’t perfect either, I know of quite a few people recently that got a recent bad batch of reagents that tested WAY off.

Do you know the lot # on that bad batch?

Thank you

 

[MERKEY]

I’m sorry that nobody can answer the question that you asked. I seen this post and was like YES somebody finally asking a question that I’ve been wondering too, so I’ve been waiting on a response but everybody dancin around the actual question that you asked which is making me question some folks reading comprehension. ‍

Simply because each person can start from either point.

Start counting before it turns blue.

Or start counting once it turns blue.

This is the problem I see with this test kit.

So where do you start counting?

 

[Ultra Aquatics]

Do you know the lot # on that bad batch?

Thank you

Looks like it is lot 8478

 

[GoVols]

Looks like it is lot 8478

Looks like a newer batch than mine

But, I agree with Salifert, as long as you know the endpoint hue.

Alkalinity titration endpoint pH & Salifert endpoint color

TL;DR: The endpoint pH is 4.41, and the endpoint color is that "lavender" color I've been telling people about. Over the years, there have been many threads on R2R and other forums debating a couple of basic details relevant to testing for alkalinity in reef aquaria. One of the most...

www.reef2reef.com

Someone needs to post that lot # on Hanna's forum.

 

[ReefHomieJon]

Simply because each person can start from either point.

Start counting before it turns blue.

Or start counting once it turns blue.

This is the problem I see with this test kit.

So where do you start counting?

I try to follow the directions and start “after one drop”. The problem is for me is its not as blue as the kit shows as a sample so I’m always wondering is It only one drop and then start counting or is the starting point when it’s as blue as the sample shows. And that’s what spanman is asking

 

[ReefHomieJon]

Lol

I run an Alkatronic and for the most part, crosscheck it with the Salifert alk kit.

But, the endpoint to Sailfert is the lavender hue.

Your right,
Don't know the endpoint color to the "new" Red Sea Pro kit.....;Hilarious

lol
Are you a Gators fan???

gR,
Have a great evening....

Am I a gators fan?
How many times are you gonna not answer a question or same something irrelevant on one post smh

 

[MERKEY]

I try to follow the directions and start “after one drop”. The problem is for me is its not as blue as the kit shows as a sample so I’m always wondering is It only one drop and then start counting or is the starting point when it’s as blue as the sample shows. And that’s what spanman is asking

Yes and that was why my answer is still the same...each person starts counting at a different point and ends at a different point.

Color tests are terrible for this reason because I may see blue after 1 drop where someone right next to me doesn't see blue until 3 drops.

We saw our test results while using red sea, giessmann, Hannah, and Elos that red sea was closer and more consistent to start the count after the 5 drops rather than starting the count after the 1st drop or 3rd drop.

Yes the blue was turning at 3 drops but all other kits were within each other and red sea was way off until we started counting at 5. Im not saying to do this but it is unfortunatelywhat we went through.

...yes we tried multiple kits of red sea to make surs it wasn't a bad kit.

It really comes down to consistency of testing and stability.

If his corals are happy at red sea alk when he starts the count at 3...I say consistently test the same way to get as close to a consistent test result as possible for stability.

So at the end of the day....start at 1 or 3 but aim for stability.

If it bothers the op like it did me...I suggest get a bunch of other test kits from other manufacturers and see what number is closest to the rest when you start with 1 drop or 3 drops.

 

[GoVols]

Am I a gators fan?
How many times are you gonna not answer a question or same something irrelevant on one post smh

You know:
I thought we were just playing around and having some fun, between the two of us.

Now is time to use the member ignore option.

Happy reefing...

 

[GoVols]

Yes and that was why my answer is still the same...each person starts counting at a different point and ends at a different point.

Color tests are terrible for this reason because I may see blue after 1 drop where someone right next to me doesn't see blue until 3 drops.

We saw our test results while using red sea, giessmann, Hannah, and Elos that red sea was closer and more consistent to start the count after the 5 drops rather than starting the count after the 1st drop or 3rd drop.

Yes the blue was turning at 3 drops but all other kits were within each other and red sea was way off until we started counting at 5. Im not saying to do this but it is unfortunatelywhat we went through.

...yes we tried multiple kits of red sea to make surs it wasn't a bad kit.

It really comes down to consistency of testing and stability.

If his corals are happy at red sea alk when he starts the count at 3...I say consistently test the same way to get as close to a consistent test result as possible for stability.

So at the end of the day....start at 1 or 3 but aim for stability.

If it bothers the op like it did me...I suggest get a bunch of other test kits from other manufacturers and see what number is closest to the rest when you start with 1 drop or 3 drops.

Check out the Red Sea Multi kit / alk's accuracy

To their Pro alk

I just can not recommend that Multi alk kit.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Relax folks. This isn't rocket science. I expect the confusion is just a poor translation, as is the best explanation I can think for for other issues from Red Sea where what they say does not actually make sense.

The kit says nothing about subtracting any drops needed to get to the start color, and there's no reason you should.

Just follow the directions as written, and ignore the fact of seeing a difference at step 3.

What matters in a titration kit is the liquid needed to get to the endpoint color (step 4), not what happens along the way.



KH Test – directions for use Red Sea’s Marine Care KH test kit provide an easy measurement of °KH with a resolution of either 0.5 or 1 °KH as desired

1. Using the syringe provided, place exactly 10 ml of the water to be tested into the glass vial in order to measure °KH levels in 0.5 °KH resolution, or 5 ml of the water to be tested in order to measure °KH levels in 1 °KH resolution.

2. Draw KH indicator into the dropper.

3. Add 1 drop of KH indicator and shake for 10 seconds. The test sample will obtain the titration “start” color as shown on the instruction card.

4. Continue to add KH indicator one drop at a time (shake for 10 seconds after each drop) until the color of the sample in the glass vile changes to the corresponding “end” color as shown on the instruction card. Count the number of drops required to reach the end color.

5. Return any unused indicator to the bottle and ensure that the bottle is closed tightly.

6. Each drop of indicator corresponds to 0.5 °KH (0.18 meq/L) or 1°KH (0.36 meq/L) depends on the water sample volume. 7. If the last drop gave the overdose color instead of the end color reduce the calculated level by 0.25 °KH (0.09 meq/L) for 0.5°KH resolution or 0.5°KH (0.18 meq/L) for 1°KH resolution.

 

[MERKEY]

Does it tell you to not count the first drops? No.

Randy as much as I follow you and respect what you have done for this hobby and I thank you for that....on this certain topic I have to simply disagree.

The red sea test kit is flawed with its color drop system.

I am not saying it does not give you a reading within a reasonable result. I have only been in the hobby for 5 years so please bare with me.

What I am trying to convey is that compared to other test manufacturers that my fiance and I tried side by side with red sea over a 6 month period... the red sea was not in line with other tests until we started counting after 5 drops on the red sea. Which was after it had turned blue for 2 or 3 drops. So NO we don't count the first drops but my point is we don't even start to count when it turns blue...we had to go 2 or 3 drops more to be in line with other kits.

I am not telling anyone to do this!!

However my fiance and I and documented our results and for us we found this to unfortunately be true.

I'm sorry if this is unclear on what I am trying to explain.

 

[Miller535]

Randy as much as I follow you and respect what you have done for this hobby and I thank you for that....on this certain topic I have to simply disagree.

The red sea test kit is flawed with its color drop system.

I am not saying it does not give you a reading within a reasonable result. I have only been in the hobby for 5 years so please bare with me.

What I am trying to convey is that compared to other test manufacturers that my fiance and I tried side by side with red sea over a 6 month period... the red sea was not in line with other tests until we started counting after 5 drops on the red sea. Which was after it had turned blue for 2 or 3 drops. So NO we don't count the first drops but my point is we don't even start to count when it turns blue...we had to go 2 or 3 drops more to be in line with other kits.

I am not telling anyone to do this!!

However my fiance and I and documented our results and for us we found this to unfortunately be true.

I'm sorry if this is unclear on what I am trying to explain.

You were doing something wrong then, or had a bad kit. I used red sea for close to 10 years before switching to hanna, I have also used other test kits, and red sea is always close to the other test's by following the instructions exactly as Randy stated and I stated earlier in this thread.

 

[MERKEY]

You were doing something wrong then, or had a bad kit. I used red sea for close to 10 years before switching to hanna, I have also used other test kits, and red sea is always close to the other test's by following the instructions exactly as Randy stated and I stated earlier in this thread.

I guess my main point is red sea isn't off it just reads higher than others for my liking.

It is only varied at most by 2dkh which is acceptable in test kits so in reality I just wanted red sea to be closer to my other test kits so I modified the testing of red sea to test closer to all the test kits I ran the experiment with.

 

[MERKEY]

I guess my main point is red sea isn't off it just reads higher than others for my liking.

It is only varied at most by 2dkh which is acceptable in test kits so in reality I just wanted red sea to be closer to my other test kits so I guess ypu can say I modified the testing of red sea to test closer to all the test kits I ran the experiment with. Not telling anyone to do that either.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Randy as much as I follow you and respect what you have done for this hobby and I thank you for that....on this certain topic I have to simply disagree.

The red sea test kit is flawed with its color drop system.

I am not saying it does not give you a reading within a reasonable result. I have only been in the hobby for 5 years so please bare with me.

What I am trying to convey is that compared to other test manufacturers that my fiance and I tried side by side with red sea over a 6 month period... the red sea was not in line with other tests until we started counting after 5 drops on the red sea. Which was after it had turned blue for 2 or 3 drops. So NO we don't count the first drops but my point is we don't even start to count when it turns blue...we had to go 2 or 3 drops more to be in line with other kits.

I am not telling anyone to do this!!

However my fiance and I and documented our results and for us we found this to unfortunately be true.

I'm sorry if this is unclear on what I am trying to explain.

I didn't say anything about the accuracy of this kit. If you found a way to mess with it that gives what you think is a more accurate result, go for it.

But there is ZERO scientific rationale that someone's tank water might need more acid added (that is, alkalinity subtracted out) than others do to be able to even start an alkalinity titration. Maybe Red Sea weirdly wants you to not count this first drop (though that makes no sense). There is no justification to think anyone else might need extra drops "not counted'.

 

[Miller535]

I guess my main point is red sea isn't off it just reads higher than others for my liking.

It is only varied at most by 2dkh which is acceptable in test kits so in reality I just wanted red sea to be closer to my other test kits so I modified the testing of red sea to test closer to all the test kits I ran the experiment with.

Who is to say that what you measured from another kit is right? Or that you are not accidently making an error with the other test's? And then altering the red sea test to make it match. That's a very slippery slope. For the record, I am not arguing that red sea is the best. Imo it's about .5-1dkh either way off from my hanna. But altering a test just to make it match another may just mean duplicating inaccurate results.