All sharks and rays randomly stopped eating/lethargic

[eelman]

How are you making your saltwater for water changes?

I wonder if there is an issue with the RODI system or the mixing station. If you are mixing your saltwater make sure he slump you use to mix is not corroded.

I would also check every other equipment in water to ensure something did not break.

Yes it make sense that there could be some type of mechanical issue somewhere, I’m going to replace my system anyways as i need to upgrade. I will be looking thoroughly into that today. This happened after the water change, At least it amplified whatever is going on

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I just got the bamboo shark a few days ago, the stingray I’ve had for 3 years, he eats like a pig 3 days a week, he just died, I literally don’t get it. I don’t know how any types of metal could be in the water.. I don’t even know where to go about it..

On top of that, no way to get that much water that fast and without knowing what it is, what if doing the water change just puts it right back in?

Try some poly filter - if it turns green, then you know it is absorbing metals. An ICP test would of course be MUCH better, but takes time.

I’m confused - you said you hadn’t added any new fish, but then you said you got the bamboo a few days ago? It could have brought something into the tank - it is really sickly looking.

 

[Marco_99]

Try some poly filter - if it turns green, then you know it is absorbing metals. An ICP test would of course be MUCH better, but takes time.

I’m confused - you said you hadn’t added any new fish, but then you said you got the bamboo a few days ago? It counn look d have brought something into the tank - it is really sickly looking.

He did, and then a paragraph below or so he said..

“The new race and sharks that recently got here both are experiencing similar problems to my other sharks and rays”

I’m sure autocorrect meant *Ray

 

[eelman]

Yes, this bamboo shark came in with the bat Ray and a grouper, what I was implying as I had not added any fish since the other bat ray experiment in my other post, I specifically said that it came with four other fish and all of those fish were fine and survived the initial acclimation period, just like when I previously got the other bat two months ago it also came with four other fish and a ray, and those all survived

The bamboo shark got here last Thursday but he was already very thin when he got here, and my horn shark and Ray went on a hunger strike that Wednesday when I changed the water out I tried feeding them after and they wouldn’t eat so I don’t think it would’ve been quick enough to transfer anything considering that they were already showing some type of symptom before it got there.

I didn’t see any visible signs of any type of parasite exteriorly on the stingray with the horn shark the only symptoms he has are cloudy eyes and very slow breathing the bamboo shark is still alive, but just constantly lays on the back upside down I have transferred those two into a 210 gallon quarantine where I’m going to start treating with prazi

If it is the water, they should already be OK because they’re in a fresh batch of water if it’s some type of parasitic or bacterial infection hopefully the prazi will take care of it, that’s if they survive long enough

 

[eelman]

Should I go and treat the 1000 gallon tank with all the fish in it with prazi pro just to be safe?

 

[jmaneyapanda]

Forgive me if I missed this, but youre not using ozone in the filtration, are you? I didnt see any notes on your filtration.

I find it very hard to believe this is acute response is parasitic or pathogenic. I feel it ahs to be environmental.

 

[eelman]

No, filtration In sump

Uv sterilizer, sro 8000 skimmer, 21 liters of matrix 6 - 8 by 8 by 4 marine pure blocks and macro algae has been added. Inside pond 500 pounds of rock, sand, aeration kit.

Forgive me if I missed this, but youre not using ozone in the filtration, are you? I didnt see any notes on your filtration.

I find it very hard to believe this is acute response is parasitic or pathogenic. I feel it ahs to be environmental.

No, filtration In sump as follows

2 brand new filter socks, Uv sterilizer, sro 8000 skimmer, 21 liters of matrix 6 - 8 by 8 by 4 marine pure blocks and macro algae has been recently added.

Inside pond 500 pounds of rock, sand, aeration kit.

No medications or chemical additives

Only feed frozen food, shrimp, mollusks, tilapia, clams, squid

will be adding the poly filter today as jay recommended


Wednesday, added new pump, new water, aeration kit, new plumbing, tank for sump, 250lbs rock, skimmer randomly started misbehaving as well. But then calmed down.

Grouper that came with shark I’ve noticed has itched gills a few times, but again standard parameters check out. He’s also calm now and already hand feeding

 

[jmaneyapanda]

Wednesday, added new pump, new water, aeration kit, new plumbing, tank for sump, 250lbs rock, skimmer randomly started misbehaving as well. But then calmed down.

Thats a lot of new "stuff" added with a lot of proximity to this event. Not that its faulty decision making, but each one of those things is a potential source for contaminant. Especially with the skimmer acting up, thats diagnostic. I think polyfilter is smart, and maybe even a purigen or cuprisorb.
I am having a hard time thinking this is anything but environmental.

 

[AydenLincoln]

Unfortunately out of the question where im
Located, on top of that, they wouldn’t survive the travel. I’m sure today will me the majorities last day unfortunately and some where along the lines this is definitely my fault

I’m sorry!

 

[eelman]

Thats a lot of new "stuff" added with a lot of proximity to this event. Not that its faulty decision making, but each one of those things is a potential source for contaminant. Especially with the skimmer acting up, thats diagnostic. I think polyfilter is smart, and maybe even a purigen or cuprisorb.
I am having a hard time thinking this is anything but environmental.

Yes, I understand why you would think that now I’ve got the sunset wrasse starting to show some type of symptoms, he’s just laying in the middle of the sand he’ll come up, eat some pallets and then just go back to the bottom and lay in the middle of the sand. His head is pretty banged up from him constantly rubbing. I’m no expert, but I just went ahead and did a cautionary prazi dosage on the whole tank

The bamboo shark is now starting to move a little bit more in the 210 gallon so hopefully that’s promising news it’s a new water and obviously being treated so theoretically, if it was a water issue they’ve been removed from whatever was causing it. If it’s parasitic, hopefully the treatment can take care of it. I’m going to be testing the water for metals. It’s like I don’t see how there couldn’t be something in the water, but at the same time I’m not sure exactly how I could see something being in the water.

The most appealing answers are either something brought a parasite in or somehow somewhere some of the equipment and or the water is the dilemma

 

[Aqua Ultraviolet]

Hello everyone unfortunately my luck just keeps getting better, maybe the bat Ray passing was not such a coincidence after all, he arrived Thursday and passed that following night following this incident now all of my other sharks and rays have suddenly become lethargic, no one is eating I found my bamboo shark laying on his back this morning and one of my Cal rays looks like he went to war.

Water parameters are

Salinity 1.026
Nitrite 0
Ammonia 0
Nitrate 10
Ph 7.9

I did a 600 gallon water change using my RODI water Tuesday two days before all of this happened,

There are 10 fish in this tank with them, including puffers, groupers tangs, grasses, eels none of the fish whatsoever are affected by apparently whatever is going on.

I will attach some photos of the two most lethargic animals in the tank, the bamboo shark, and one of the rays

This has all happened at once overnight.

I have just primed the water just in case there are somehow any trace elements of copper or some type of metal in the water

What would be my best plan of action?

I just purchased garlic, fresh food and prazi pro,

I checked the water parameters myself and then just drove up to my local fish shop as well and both parameters matched I even had them test the salinity on multiple units because the bamboo shark will not stop itching the gills,

I haven’t added any new sharks or raised, and none of the fish appeared to have any parasites or acting anyway they would

The new race and sharks that recently got here both are experiencing similar problems to my other sharks and rays

Yet the timing seems too fast to have onset anything, and I don’t know where they would’ve potentially caught a parasite.

I greatly appreciate any input and any type of course of action I can take. Definitely do not want to see my animal suffer.

Thanks

With multiple sharks and rays becoming lethargic at the same time, I would treat this as a water quality, oxygen, or contamination issue first, rather than assuming parasites. The fact that the other fish appear normal does not rule out a problem, since elasmobranchs can react differently to environmental stress.

I would immediately maximize aeration and surface agitation, verify temperature and dissolved oxygen if possible, and test alkalinity as well as ammonia, pH, salinity, and nitrate. I would also test the new RODI water and display water for copper or other contaminants if you have access to a reliable test. Avoid adding PraziPro or multiple medications until you have a better idea what is causing the problem, as additional treatment can further stress already compromised animals.

Given the rapid onset and the gill irritation, I would also consider having an aquatic veterinarian examine the affected animals if they continue declining. The priority right now should be oxygen, stable parameters, and identifying a possible contaminant rather than treating blindly.

 

[eelman]

With multiple sharks and rays becoming lethargic at the same time, I would treat this as a water quality, oxygen, or contamination issue first, rather than assuming parasites. The fact that the other fish appear normal does not rule out a problem, since elasmobranchs can react differently to environmental stress.

I would immediately maximize aeration and surface agitation, verify temperature and dissolved oxygen if possible, and test alkalinity as well as ammonia, pH, salinity, and nitrate. I would also test the new RODI water and display water for copper or other contaminants if you have access to a reliable test. Avoid adding PraziPro or multiple medications until you have a better idea what is causing the problem, as additional treatment can further stress already compromised animals.

Given the rapid onset and the gill irritation, I would also consider having an aquatic veterinarian examine the affected animals if they continue declining. The priority right now should be oxygen, stable parameters, and identifying a possible contaminant rather than treating blindly.

Yes, I did a manual water test myself twice and then took it to my local saltwater shop which I trust with my life and their readings were very similar and they tested twice, two different manners.

There is massive aeration’s kits, and a heavy flow pump and a larger skimmer, should be plenty of oxygen.

From looking outside in, apparently nothing to be concerned about in terms of most standard readings ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, Ph etc

obviously we haven’t tested for trace elements. I have a poly filter ordered on the way unfortunately there wasn’t any local.

The sunset wrasse is now showing symptoms of vigorously rubbing its gills against the sand to the point where their markings on its head, this leads me to believe there is some Gill agitation going on, I believe it’s narrowed down to either metals in the water or parasitic, all of the sharks and rays have been removed and placed in a 210 gallon holding tank, where I have started treatment. I personally believe if I would’ve left them in that water any longer in the 1000 gallon, they would not be here right now. Still in critical shape, but better than dead.

The horn sharks eyes are also cloudy white, which makes me believe that this is an infection of some sort. Bamboo shark is swimming in slow circles, yet far more active than it was yesterday not sure if this is for better or worse.

I have already ordered a new rodi system, water is primed, prazi has been treated as multiple sources recommended, hopefully this was the correct move. I just couldn’t watch them go through that.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Yes, I did a manual water test myself twice and then took it to my local saltwater shop which I trust with my life and their readings were very similar and they tested twice, two different manners.

There is massive aeration’s kits, and a heavy flow pump and a larger skimmer, should be plenty of oxygen.

From looking outside in, apparently nothing to be concerned about in terms of most standard readings ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, Ph etc

obviously we haven’t tested for trace elements. I have a poly filter ordered on the way unfortunately there wasn’t any local.

The sunset wrasse is now showing symptoms of vigorously rubbing its gills against the sand to the point where their markings on its head, this leads me to believe there is some Gill agitation going on, I believe it’s narrowed down to either metals in the water or parasitic, all of the sharks and rays have been removed and placed in a 210 gallon holding tank, where I have started treatment. I personally believe if I would’ve left them in that water any longer in the 1000 gallon, they would not be here right now. Still in critical shape, but better than dead.

The horn sharks eyes are also cloudy white, which makes me believe that this is an infection of some sort. Bamboo shark is swimming in slow circles, yet far more active than it was yesterday not sure if this is for better or worse.

I have already ordered a new rodi system, water is primed, prazi has been treated as multiple sources recommended, hopefully this was the correct move. I just couldn’t watch them go through that.

Some diseases are seen in both bony fish and sharks / rays, but not all. Flukes and copepods tend to be specific to one or the other. Sharks don’t get marine ich, but can get velvet. I don’t know about gill amoeba.

Here is something to consider though - wrasses are known to be more metal sensitive than other bony fishes are. I’m not saying this as a definite smoking gun, but just an observation.

 

[eelman]

Some diseases are seen in both bony fish and sharks / rays, but not all. Flukes and copepods tend to be specific to one or the other. Sharks don’t get marine ich, but can get velvet. I don’t know about gill amoeba.

Here is something to consider though - wrasses are known to be more metal sensitive than other bony fishes are. I’m not saying this as a definite smoking gun, but just an observation.

Yes I’m gonna get a r

Some diseases are seen in both bony fish and sharks / rays, but not all. Flukes and copepods tend to be specific to one or the other. Sharks don’t get marine ich, but can get velvet. I don’t know about gill amoeba.

Here is something to consider though - wrasses are known to be more metal sensitive than other bony fishes are. I’m not saying this as a definite smoking gun, but just an observation.

I’ll be getting a tds meter today to test the water output of the rodi unit and see if there’s any trace elements in it. That’s a good point, maybe my rodi unit filters are fried even though they don’t look to be. My tds meter on it isn’t working either, go figure

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Yes I’m gonna get a r


I’ll be getting a tds meter today to test the water output of the rodi unit and see if there’s any trace elements in it. That’s a good point, maybe my rodi unit filters are fried even though they don’t look to be. My tds meter on it isn’t working either, go figure

One thing I don’t know is IF the RO system is letting things bypass, is it all dissolved materials proportionally, or can certain elements be allowed through at higher rates? You might want to ask over in the water chemistry forum.

 

[bkwonnn]

I had this once with fresh water rays and it was due to the copper in a medicine. Maybe there is copper in prazi pro?

 

[eelman]

I had this once with fresh water rays and it was due to the copper in a medicine. Maybe there is copper in prazi pro?

I’m treating it with prazi because of the symptoms, not vice versa. So I don’t think that’s it.

 

[eelman]

One thing I don’t know is IF the RO system is letting things bypass, is it all dissolved materials proportionally, or can certain elements be allowed through at higher rates? You might want to ask over in the water chemistry forum.

Here’s the dilemma, all the sharks and rays have exited that system for the last 48 hours, they’ve been placed in a bar 210 gallon tank that has been running is isolated in case of emergencies well, it has two clown fish in it other than that it’s bare. They were removed I added air stones. And the water parameters are good,

Nothing is healing still even with the treatment, I have new water that didn’t come from my ROI system and I have medication, the horn shark is breathing very rapidly now changing from a slow pulse breathing, the bamboo shark is just laying on its back breathing very very slowly I tried gently flipping it over once but I feel like I’m just stressing it out

The other rays seem okay, I want to point out that I did notice that my California rate was underneath the sand for a few days I know that’s pretty common for some reason, but it was very uncommon for him, he was never under the sand at the same time, my horn shark went underneath my rock bed and he’s never under the rock bed I obviously should’ve assumed something was wrong but with all the other fish seemingly to be fine I really didn’t think much of it until it lasted for a few days. I had already gone to my pet store twice to get the water checked, I was told that hunger strikes and this type of behavior can be common from time to time and rays.

Obviously, I’m here now and I’m learning as I go but what do I do from here?

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Here’s the dilemma, all the sharks and rays have exited that system for the last 48 hours, they’ve been placed in a bar 210 gallon tank that has been running is isolated in case of emergencies well, it has two clown fish in it other than that it’s bare. They were removed I added air stones. And the water parameters are good,

Nothing is healing still even with the treatment, I have new water that didn’t come from my ROI system and I have medication, the horn shark is breathing very rapidly now changing from a slow pulse breathing, the bamboo shark is just laying on its back breathing very very slowly I tried gently flipping it over once but I feel like I’m just stressing it out

The other rays seem okay, I want to point out that I did notice that my California rate was underneath the sand for a few days I know that’s pretty common for some reason, but it was very uncommon for him, he was never under the sand at the same time, my horn shark went underneath my rock bed and he’s never under the rock bed I obviously should’ve assumed something was wrong but with all the other fish seemingly to be fine I really didn’t think much of it until it lasted for a few days. I had already gone to my pet store twice to get the water checked, I was told that hunger strikes and this type of behavior can be common from time to time and rays.

Obviously, I’m here now and I’m learning as I go but what do I do from here?

Can you post a video of the horn shark?

As I mentioned, the ray and bamboo shark are both really thin, and in looking again, the ray looks "bedraggled" and has a rip in its underside pectoral fin. I'd like to see how the horn shark looks.

Be careful with the bare 210 tank - if it doesn't have an operating bio-filter, the ammonia is going to spike pretty quickly.

You may have a mixture of issues here - fish in poor conditions, combined with possible disease issues. I'm leaning towards bacterial at this point.

 

[eelman]

I can get a photo of the hornshark later when I get back, he has cloudy white eyes, not as cloudy as they were, but to me looks good weight, no marks on the body exteriorly aside from the eyes, he was locked in that fins out head up position for about 12 hours but is currently moving more frequently now. Just rapid breathing adjustment.

I should have used a better term. It does have a sump and filtration, at the bottom. And sand actually, I meant bare as in not much going on aside the clowns, live rock from main display removed and all the fish had been stripped and added to the pond, but this was months ago. It was where he lived for 2+ years until he out grew it. Been constantly running though.

as for the marking on the underside of the ray, that is most likely from the horn shark, he always does crazy BS during feeding and swims right over top of the horn shark. He’s scratched himself on him numerous times over the years trying to take food from the shark, I’ve witnessed it first hand. In terms of size, he was the exact one in the bat ray photo, so you can see he lost weight exceptionally fast. He was eating every 2 days and I mean eating like a pig, fed vitamins, he was in really good shape and it felt like it came out of nowhere..

He only ate one jumbo shrimp 3 days before he passed but still took food, the day prior to him passing was the first time he has ever declined food.

The bamboo shark has only been here since last Thursday, they said he was eating well. Before shipment. Apparently not.

If it is bacterial what would this mean?