Calcium reactor control by Neptune Trident

trido

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Since the beginning of April 2019 I've had my Trident and after a couple weeks when I trusted it, I started experimenting with some programming I thought of well before its release. More people with reactors need to know about this easy to create and use program to help with Alkalinity stability so I'm sharing it on R2R in hopes more reefers see it. A sticky thread would be best. :)

For 15 years prior to the Neptune Trident, my Alkalinity was always on a slow climb, or slow drop due to my laziness. I learned that as long as changes happened slowly my corals don't really care. Because of that, I never worried about dialing my reactor in perfectly and I would often go several months without testing for Alkalinity. I've had Alkalinity as low as 6 and as high as 16. Those two extremes are when my corals showed visible signs of stress and of course I had to jump to action to correct the problem. A 10% WC and slight correction of the reactor is all that was ever needed. The problem happened slowly so correcting it slowly is always best with SPS. Every number in between is pretty safe in my experience. Of course 7-11 is the target. I have not tested for Calcium in over a decade, and rarely test for Magnesium. In my opinion, with a Calcium reactor, those two numbers are not real important, because with a quality media, they will always be balanced.

Enough back story, on to the good stuff.

This program should work with any CO2 regulator with an electronic selenoid. Its very simple and consists of two virtual outlets. One is the high limit of your choice, and the second is the toggle that slows the melt (raises the pH in the reactor) to slowly lower the Alkalinity in the tank.
Screenshot (38).png

This is the high limit Virtual Outlet. I chose 9.03 as a random number for the initial experiment and never changed it. The Target Alkalinity is 9.00.
Screenshot (40).png

This is my OSC Virtual Outlet. For every twenty minute cycle, the CO2 is turned off which raises the reactor pH up about two tenths
Screenshot (39).png

For the reactor CO2, I left my old original programming as a fail safe and simply added the last line. At this point I could remove the second line, but leaving it will make things easier for when I have to take the Trident off line for maintenance.
Screenshot (41).png



Thats it! The program requires you to dial in the reactor to work slightly harder than you need it to and as demands increase the toggle will come on less often as a high limit. This has been successfully working for quite a few large SPS tanks including @melev and @Thales as well as my own. I hope it helps you too.
 
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trido

trido

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I took some screen shots of the Alkalinity graphing from random times to show the average. The graph isnt a perfect day to day cycle, but the average is all that really matters

Screenshot (42).png
Screenshot (43).png
Screenshot (44).png
Screenshot (45).png
 

rivermsl

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I like it. I have my Trident controlling my CO2 doser. However, the Alk is fluctuating more than I like between Trident readings. I am thinking the above programming will help reduce the fluctuation.

I am not an OSC expert. I assume above OSC statement will shut off CO2 for 15 minutes, turn on CO2 for 5 minutes and repeat until the Trident Alk test result is below the high limit of 9.03. Correct?
 
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trido

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I like it. I have my Trident controlling my CO2 doser. However, the Alk is fluctuating more than I like between Trident readings. I am thinking the above programming will help reduce the fluctuation.

I am not an OSC expert. I assume above OSC statement will shut off CO2 for 15 minutes, turn on CO2 for 5 minutes and repeat until the Trident Alk test result is below the high limit of 9.03. Correct?
Yep, that sums it up.
 
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This is excellent. I don't have the Trident (I was holding out for mindstream), but I have automated my calcium reactor using an apex controllable dual continuous dosing pump that I have been developing to control CO2 dosing to the reactor and continuous flow out of the reactor. Seeing this thread almost makes me want to buy the trident, and I might, now knowing that I would be able to program the speed of the pump dependant to the alk test results, and also schedule the pump flow to coincide with daily alk swings.

If you want to take your calc reactor automation to the next level and you would be interested in testing out my pump, send me a message. It is apex ready and I would be interested to see what others think and how accurate and stable an alk can be achieved. Have a look at my threads for pics and vids. the programming would be similar to what you already have in place, but instead of programming on-off outlets, you would be setting profiles to control the variable speed outputs to the pump. One pump to control CalRX ph and the other pump to control alk. No Tridents available in Canada so I won't be able to test it anytime soon.
 

Breadman03

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I don't have a Trident, but I could easily create a virtual outlet to manually toggle such a code. It could also be used during the night to reduce the 24 hour swing. Thanks for the idea!
 

CDavmd

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This program should work with any CO2 regulator with an electronic selenoid. Its very simple and consists of two virtual outlets. One is the high limit of your choice, and the second is the toggle that slows the melt (raises the pH in the reactor) to slowly lower the Alkalinity in the tank.
Screenshot (38).png

This is the high limit Virtual Outlet. I chose 9.03 as a random number for the initial experiment and never changed it. The Target Alkalinity is 9.00.
Screenshot (40).png

This is my OSC Virtual Outlet. For every twenty minute cycle, the CO2 is turned off which raises the reactor pH up about two tenths
Screenshot (39).png

For the reactor CO2, I left my old original programming as a fail safe and simply added the last line. At this point I could remove the second line, but leaving it will make things easier for when I have to take the Trident off line for maintenance.
Screenshot (41).png



Thats it! The program requires you to dial in the reactor to work slightly harder than you need it to and as demands increase the toggle will come on less often as a high limit. This has been successfully working for quite a few large SPS tanks including @melev and @Thales as well as my own. I hope it helps you too.
Great Stuff! I've been running mine a little under demand and making up the difference by dosing with a DOS. I like this better- couple questions:

Your have your Physical CO2 outlet set at Fallback ON....this seem opposite of many of the recommendations on the Neptune forum. Any concern you might turn your media to mush in the event of a communication failure?

Also, I am not sure there is a way to incorporate the "Flow" and "low CO2" Alerts using your method since those are dependent on the rise and fall time of the reactor pH when controlled based on pH setting.

Any thoughts?

Thanks again for posting this code. Very helpful!
 
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trido

trido

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Your have your Physical CO2 outlet set at Fallback ON....this seem opposite of many of the recommendations on the Neptune forum. Any concern you might turn your media to mush in the event of a communication failure?
I'm not worried about a media melt down because I have a carbon doser regulator and it is only set to melt slightly more than I need. If the Apex fails my media wont melt any faster than any other day. The alk would continue to rise, but I have an old Milwaukee controller on standby in case of an issue.

Also, I am not sure there is a way to incorporate the "Flow" and "low CO2" Alerts using your method since those are dependent on the rise and fall time of the reactor pH when controlled based on pH setting.
I dont quite understand which alerts you're talking about.
 

CDavmd

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I'm not worried about a media melt down because I have a carbon doser regulator and it is only set to melt slightly more than I need. If the Apex fails my media wont melt any faster than any other day. The alk would continue to rise, but I have an old Milwaukee controller on standby in case of an issue.

Thanks!

I dont quite understand which alerts you're talking about.
When you set up a calcium reactor with Neptune apex the traditional way- the CO2 Doser comes on and off to keep your reactor pH where you set it. If you look at the time duration when "ON" - the time for the pH to drop to your set point and likewise when "OFF"- the time it takes for the pH to rise to the level that will trigger it on once again; you can use these values as an indicator of clogged effluent flow and low CO2 in canister.

Basically you create a virtual outlet for each and set the time to 1.5 times the normal value.

If your CO2 Doser stays on more than 1.5x the normal it indicates low CO2 and likewise if it takes more than 1.5x the normal for the pH to rise when the CO2 dosed is off, it indicates a clog in the outflow.
 
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trido

trido

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Basically you create a virtual outlet for each and set the time to 1.5 times the normal value.

If your CO2 Doser stays on more than 1.5x the normal it indicates low CO2 and likewise if it takes more than 1.5x the normal for the pH to rise when the CO2 dosed is off, it indicates a clog in the outflow.
I see. In 15 years, I've never had my reactor effluent clog but only slow down a bit. Now I plumb them with 3/8" line in and 1/4" out. This helps to keep the reactor pressurized slightly and keeps the drip rate far more steady long term. On my personal reactor, I have a 1/4" flow meter. I found that with my demand, I get best results with over 2GPH running through it.

When a carbon doser regulator is dialed in well, your reactor ph can rarely swing an stay on for hours or days. A VO wont work as an alarm. I use a simple line of code in my email alarm. "If rxtrpH is > 6.9 then on" This is what will tell me when I'm out of CO2. I keep a second full bottle at all times.

As an apex control freak I typically check my tank status at least a couple times a day, unless I'm in the mountains. Its not often that my tank catches me off guard.
 

mdo

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Trido, what flow meter do you use? I have been looking for a reasonably priced low flow meter for some time. I run between .75 and 1.5 gph out of Ca reactor.
 
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trido

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I use the Neptune flow meters. I have had my Neptune meter reading steadily as low as .75GPH but found that I get better results from my reactor at just above 2GPH.

Screenshot (78).png
 

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I could not get the 1/4” apex flow meter to work with my CaRx. Flow fell below the stated range and the pulsing from my MasterFlex meant the reading was all over the place.
 

Mrsadat

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Since the beginning of April 2019 I've had my Trident and after a couple weeks when I trusted it, I started experimenting with some programming I thought of well before its release. More people with reactors need to know about this easy to create and use program to help with Alkalinity stability so I'm sharing it on R2R in hopes more reefers see it. A sticky thread would be best. :)

For 15 years prior to the Neptune Trident, my Alkalinity was always on a slow climb, or slow drop due to my laziness. I learned that as long as changes happened slowly my corals don't really care. Because of that, I never worried about dialing my reactor in perfectly and I would often go several months without testing for Alkalinity. I've had Alkalinity as low as 6 and as high as 16. Those two extremes are when my corals showed visible signs of stress and of course I had to jump to action to correct the problem. A 10% WC and slight correction of the reactor is all that was ever needed. The problem happened slowly so correcting it slowly is always best with SPS. Every number in between is pretty safe in my experience. Of course 7-11 is the target. I have not tested for Calcium in over a decade, and rarely test for Magnesium. In my opinion, with a Calcium reactor, those two numbers are not real important, because with a quality media, they will always be balanced.

Enough back story, on to the good stuff.

This program should work with any CO2 regulator with an electronic selenoid. Its very simple and consists of two virtual outlets. One is the high limit of your choice, and the second is the toggle that slows the melt (raises the pH in the reactor) to slowly lower the Alkalinity in the tank.
Screenshot (38).png

This is the high limit Virtual Outlet. I chose 9.03 as a random number for the initial experiment and never changed it. The Target Alkalinity is 9.00.
Screenshot (40).png

This is my OSC Virtual Outlet. For every twenty minute cycle, the CO2 is turned off which raises the reactor pH up about two tenths
Screenshot (39).png

For the reactor CO2, I left my old original programming as a fail safe and simply added the last line. At this point I could remove the second line, but leaving it will make things easier for when I have to take the Trident off line for maintenance.
Screenshot (41).png



Thats it! The program requires you to dial in the reactor to work slightly harder than you need it to and as demands increase the toggle will come on less often as a high limit. This has been successfully working for quite a few large SPS tanks including @melev and @Thales as well as my own. I hope it helps you too.
Your the man I just bought a Calcium reactor and my Trident is coming on Wednesday, I was scratching my head trying to figure out how to get the systems to work together. I’m going to try your technique hopefully it will work for me. Thanks for sharing happy reefing.
 
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Here’s mine.
Because I’m testing every 3 hr.
If completely shut of co2 in the 3 hr I’ll lost too much kh.

A way I get around is using defer, When kh is over my set point co2 will still stay on for 100 min then off 60 min till next test

I also force co2 to be on during lights is on.
 
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