Can Dinos kill SPS?

Pete_the_Puma

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Hi all,

I have had all the trouble in the world keeping any SPS alive (even encrusting montiporas I used to have to epoxy to stop from spreading in my old tank). They all seem to weather away and STN from the base and tips and eventually just bleach and die.

My current setup is:

140 gallon tank, established March 2019
Barebottom
Triton "Other methods" supplements
Flow: 1x MP40, 1x Gyre 150 and 1 old school Tunze wavebox. Return to aquarium is a Vectra L1 going to 2 random flow nozzles
Light: 2 x Radion G3 pro with diffuser and 4 x 48W T5s (2x blue plus 2 x coral plus bulbs). Lights are 12 inches off the water, running coral AB+ at 90%. PAR measured with two methods is 150-250 at rocks (mid structure) with 300 on the rocks center below the radion and 450-500 right below the surface of the water.


Parameters now stable for 1-2 months are
Alk 7.5-8.0
Phos: 0.04-0.08
Nitrate: 5-10
Calcium: 450-470

I test manually at least once a week and REEFBOT test for me ALK every day, nitrate and phosphate every 3 days.

Had a number of ICP test with no major red flags, last test in December showed only anomalies were:

Aluminum was 20 micrograms per liter should be 2
Magnesium was 1270 should be 1370 (dosed a bunch of Triton component 1 since then)
Zinc was 11 micrograms per liter should be 4.


Now I say parameters are stable for the last two months because before that I was running barebottom AND full triton method with a fuge running a kessil 380 and had zero nitrates and zero phosphates despite agressive feeding and dosing both nitrate and phosphate at ridiculous levels. I then harvested some cheato and the N and P overshot like crazy leading to round one of SPS loss. I then got rid of the fuge with the cheato and switched from using full triton to the Triton "Other methods" supllements, basically a fancy way to dose two part and magnesium and traces.

I went FOWLR for 2 months and about a month ago reintroduced a bunch of "easy" SPS, encrusiting montis, stylophora and one PC rainbow acro. Again everything died sloooooowly but this time it was covered in Dinoflagellates!!!

Now the real question I have is were the DINOs just moving in on already dead tissue or was the thin film of bacteria (that I tried to blow off as often as possible) causing the necrosis in the first place?

I've since started running carbon and doing the every other day DINO-X. I understand DINOs are a plague and are likely the result of months of undetectable nitrate and phosphate but now that my levels are well within a medium/high range they should eventually go away.

I'm just wondering if there is something in my water that would not show up on ICP and neither on the TDS meter that reads 0 for my RODI???


I'm just exasperated, about ready to go back to Zeovit where I had success in 2012-2016 ish...



TLDR: Can dinos kill SPS or do they just move in on dead tissue?
 

ycnibrc

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How old is the tank? Do u start with all dry rock? What do u dose with triton any bacteria source?
 

zalick

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Following along. I lost all my SPS in a similar way during my tank upgrade. I suspect the Dino's killed/smothered them. Had never encountered Dino's before in 20 years!
 
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Pete_the_Puma

Pete_the_Puma

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How old is the tank? Do u start with all dry rock? What do u dose with triton any bacteria source?

The tank was started in March 2019 with dry rock (MArco rock from BRS). The rocks had been "curing" in heated saltwater with bacteria added for about 4 months before that.I dosed a number of bacterial cultures when cycling the tank, mostly Dr. Tims stuff. I now dose Faunamarin "DINO-X" which might or might not contain some bacteria
 
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Pete_the_Puma

Pete_the_Puma

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I also ordered a little blue bottle of Zeobact for once I am done with the stupid Dinos
 

ycnibrc

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The tank was started in March 2019 with dry rock (MArco rock from BRS). The rocks had been "curing" in heated saltwater with bacteria added for about 4 months before that.I dosed a number of bacterial cultures when cycling the tank, mostly Dr. Tims stuff. I now dose Faunamarin "DINO-X" which might or might not contain some bacteria
Dr Tim is more like nitrifying bacteria for cycling. Your tank might lacking beneficial bacteria which only come with live rock from the ocean. If your parameters are in tack then your tank might lacking bacteria diversity. You can read this thread may be it will help.

 
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Pete_the_Puma

Pete_the_Puma

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Dr Tim is more like nitrifying bacteria for cycling. Your tank might lacking beneficial bacteria which only come with live rock from the ocean. If your parameters are in tack then your tank might lacking bacteria diversity. You can read this thread may be it will help.


I had read that thread a while back.

Certainly there are tons of tanks that start with "dead rock" and never add actual liverock. If I wanted to get those bacteria should I just get a rock from a fellow reefers tank that has success at keeping SPS?
 

ReeferMaddness843

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Yes it can. I added a Jabeo UV 32watt I think. To my 80 shallow and it was gone in 48hrs. But it was too late. This was about half of em. I gave away as much as I could and the rest was already gone. Super healthy when they hit too. Just trying my first piece again after the last outbreak
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ycnibrc

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I had read that thread a while back.

Certainly there are tons of tanks that start with "dead rock" and never add actual liverock. If I wanted to get those bacteria should I just get a rock from a fellow reefers tank that has success at keeping SPS?
Yes or u can order live rock from Tampa Bay I believe they still can get live rock. This is what's my observation is bacteria need to be replenish years ago we have live rock and tank doing well for 4 to 5 years then crash. We used to call that old tank syndrome. My explanation to that is your bacteria population is Max out and your corals grown and consume more than the bacteria can multiply. After awhile it will get depleted then causing tank crash. Nobody know why it happened back then but now I think that bacteria depletion is the cause. Bacteria can multiply in the tank but if the corals consume faster than it can reduce the population.
The reason why zeovit ask u to keep dosing zeobak is to make sure the bacteria is always replenish and can handle the growth of the corals
 

SeaDweller

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In my experience while setting up a frag tank last year, no. I guess I got lucky. They were around for about 3 weeks maybe, and then gone. i let the water and tank dirty up and let algae take over and then the dinos died out.
 

drawman

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I have had dinos take over and kill/smother SPS so yes they can do this. I will also say for whatever reason I haven't had a lot of luck dosing NO3/PO4 with SPS (other corals do just fine).
 

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