Can't keep SPS alive - ICP Water results

[Steverd]

Are you acclimating them to those higher light levels? If so, for how long?

I was thinking this also. My friend had them under higher PAR lights than me. I also put one higher and one on the bottom and both started fading.
Thank you,

 

[slingfox]

Seems like the most simple things to do include:

1. Increase phosphate. There are many ways to do this. Given that your tank is 5 years old the low phosphates are not due to your rocks absorbing all the phosphate from the water column. If I was in your situation I would add a few new fish which would allow you to feed more and thereby increase the nutrient load.

In the meantime you could dose phosphate which would allow you to increase phosphate without impacting nitrates. Or you could just feed more—depends on how you prefer to approach things.

2. Reduce alk and calcium—seems like this is already in your plan.

3. Move the SPS to the higher area of the rockwork.

4. Turn up lights and turn up flow.

5. Look into the high aluminum. I have never had this issue so not sure what the causes might be. Worth further research.

 

[rtparty]

Thanks rtparty, I just posted some photos.
The coral look ok for a week or two and slowly start to fade, not a rapid skin lost.

Lack of light (1 XR15 and 4 T5s is fine for LPS but not SPS) and lack of phosphate/food is where I would start.

Dosing something like Brightwell CoralAmino would likely do wonders. Or even feeding the fish more helps a lot. If you are running GFO or some other phosphate remover, back off of it.

For a couple hundred bucks you can get some Nicrew Gen 2 lights if you want to add more light

 

[Science/G]

A few things, first of all what are you dosing? What combination of T5 bulbs are you running, and when was the last time they were replaced? Are you running carbon?

200 to 300 par of good quality light should be more than enough for SPS like Montipora, Anacropora, and quite a few smooth skin Acropora and other less light demanding Acros like PC Rainbow, Rainbow loom etc

A polyfilter sheet will help to remove that aluminum, but you need to find the source. Some types of media are known to leach aluminum.

Get some measurable phosphates by dosing something like Neophos. Also dosing some Polyp Lab polyp booster (amino acids) along with reef roids should help keeping phosphates and nitrates from bottoming out. Use sparingly and test often. Shoot for 10-20 ppm Nitrate and .03- .1 Phosphate. Success can come with nutrients higher or lower, but this is a solid sweet spot to shoot for in a mixed reef.

Try to keep your parameters close to or slightly above natural seawater levels. Stay close to 8 alkalinity, 420 calcium and 1350 magnesium. Dose trace elements like iodine as needed. Test your potassium also.

 

[Uncle99]

When you say you can’t keep SPS alive, how long do they live once planted?

Do they just go white overnight? Skin fall off.

I find it strange that ICP results show 0 phosphate when you say all else is doing fine, softies and LPS are good consumers of that so If zero, I’d think your others would suffer the same as sticks. Everyone needs phosphate so unless it just hit zero when you sent your water, over months, zero phosphate would show in unhappy looking system.

A full tank shot would be helpful and provide context.

Nothing stands out to me in your ICP. They are not perfect and should be used as only 1 data point.

Someone mentioned light, that’s a good one to look into.

 

[exnisstech]

Are you acclimating them to those higher light levels? If so, for how long?

I was thinking this also. My friend had them under higher PAR lights than me. I also put one higher and one on the bottom and both started fading.
Thank you,

200 - 300 par is not high enough I would expect any SPS needs to be acclimated to. I get 300+ par on the bottom and over 500 up high and have never acclimated an SPS frag.

 

[slingfox]

200 - 300 par is not high enough I would expect any SPS needs to be acclimated to. I get 300+ par on the bottom and over 500 up high and have never acclimated an SPS frag.

For better or worse I am of similar mindset. Some of my rockscape gets 550+ par and the sandbed some areas 300+. My average par across the acro areas is 375. I have added 50 SPS frags to my tank in the last six months (bringing total to 60 SPS frags in my 9 month old tank) and have not acclimated any of my SPS. Zero losses so far.

Key caveat is I have not put anything straight into the 550+ par area, but most have gone into the 300-425 par areas with zero acclimation.

 

[Michael Hughes]

200 - 300 par is not high enough I would expect any SPS needs to be acclimated to. I get 300+ par on the bottom and over 500 up high and have never acclimated an SPS frag.

I've had no issues so far growing monti caps and Stylophora at 100 par...

 

[maroun.c]

While each of ur parameters being low isn't a huge issue on its own, yet so many elements being low/critically low that can stress corals to the point anything that goes a bit wrong can finish them. I would correct each of the low elements as recommended or proceed with multiple large water changes with a quality salt.
Run an icp to verify then dose these elements at low levels for couple months then icp again to fine tune ur dosing.
I would worry most about iodine and po4 as well as fluorine that seems to have considerable effects when low.

 

[exnisstech]

I've had no issues so far growing monti caps and Stylophora at 100 par...

I don't have a problem with monti caps at pretty much any par. I was just replying to SPS needing acclimated to 200 - 300 par. I didn't say they could not be kept under lower par. I've never kept stylophora.

Couple of monticap frags. I'm seeing if they graft. I have no idea idea if they will but I have nothing else to do with them.

 

[Steverd]

Thank you for all of the replies, I have been taking alot of notes here.
So much appreciated!
So far I've order: Neophos, Acropower, Brightwell Iodion Supplement, Brightwell Replenish supplement and the Red Sea Trace Color (A,B,C,D).

I have my Radion at only 20 or 30%, so there is alot of room to increase the light for sure.

The aluminum is still a mystery to me,
EDIT: could it be MarinePure 1.5-Inch Sphere Bio-Filter Media in my sump.
also I just read Phosguard can leach aluminum also, I had been using it, trying to chase a zero for phosphates which I now see was a bad idea.

 

[slingfox]

Thank you for all of the replies, I have been taking alot of notes here.
So much appreciated!
So far I've order: Neophos, Acropower, Brightwell Iodion Supplement, Brightwell Replenish supplement and the Red Sea Trace Color (A,B,C,D).

I have my Radion at only 20 or 30%, so there is alot of room to increase the light for sure.

The aluminum is still a mystery to me.

Of those I assume the Neophos and Acropower will make the biggest difference given your situation. I dose a multi-trace mix (Captive8 MT on an auto doser) as well as iodine and iron by hand but I have no idea if the/3 actually do anything. At least they don’t seem to be doing any harm . . .

 

[Alexander1312]

I can't keep SPS alive in my 90g tank (over 5 years old).
Soft corals, Zoas, seem happy and growing
PAR is between 200 - 300 at SPS locations

I just got my ICP water results back.
Does anything stand out to you that could be the issue.
Everything was normal except these:

KH 9.7 dKH (Above Normal) - (I've lowered my dosing)
CA 490mg/l (Critcally high) - (I've lowered my dosing)
Fluorine 0.73 mg/l (Below Normal)
Iodine 16 ug/l (Critically Low)
Manganese ---- (Below Normal)
Iron ----- (Below Normal)
Zinc 140 ug/l (Critically Low)
P(phos) 0.73 ug/l (Critically Low)
PO4 0.00 (Critically Low)
Alum 140 ug/l (Above Normal)

RO Water has High Silicon (already replaced the resin)

Thank you for any help/suggestions you have.

Clear issue here impacting your SPS: high dkh combined with the low PO4. The lower the PO4, the lower the dkh should be as it stresses your SPS too much. Lower the dkh to 7.5 while raising your PO4 ASAP. You can add a dead clam from the supermarket to your tank to raise your PO4.

 

[Science/G]

My alkalinity rose up to 8.6, my nitrates bottomed out at the same time as my phosphates, (dosing pump issue) and most of my SPS reacted negatively one day to the next. Some partially bleached, others lost their polyp extension, and the rest lost their bright colors and went dull. Uggh. So I'm back to feeding amino acids and reef roids daily, dosing nitrates, and phosphates a few times a week. Things are slowly improving thank goodness. I know it's going to take months to recover from something that took days to occur.

 

[fish_collector]

My acros just did "ok" until I added more fish and fed them the quantity of food they wanted every day. It was as if the corals had their "grow" switch suddenly turned on lol. My nutrients are way high now and coral growth has never been better.

As has been mentioned I use Reef Blueprint Isol8 MT every so often with good results. Whether or not it’s doing anything I don’t know but it’s inexpensive enough to keep using it. I use IO fwiw.

 

[fish_collector]

And my water's ICP analysis says...

I have no idea I've never sent a sample in for testing

 

[David S]

I can't keep SPS alive in my 90g tank (over 5 years old).
Soft corals, Zoas, seem happy and growing
PAR is between 200 - 300 at SPS locations

I just got my ICP water results back.
Does anything stand out to you that could be the issue.
Everything was normal except these:

KH 9.7 dKH (Above Normal) - (I've lowered my dosing)
CA 490mg/l (Critcally high) - (I've lowered my dosing)
Fluorine 0.73 mg/l (Below Normal)
Iodine 16 ug/l (Critically Low)
Manganese ---- (Below Normal)
Iron ----- (Below Normal)
Zinc 140 ug/l (Critically Low)
P(phos) 0.73 ug/l (Critically Low)
PO4 0.00 (Critically Low)
Alum 140 ug/l (Above Normal)

RO Water has High Silicon (already replaced the resin)

Thank you for any help/suggestions you have.

The most striking thing too me is the 140 ug/l of Zinc.
You claim the ICP vendor said it is critically low.
Could it be they said it is critically High?
Which it is.
Ideally, it should not be more than 5 ug/l.
I had critically high at 50 ug/l. Confirmed by multiple ICP vendors.Fortunately it did not affect my corals and fish.
Got it down by discontinuing dosing ZN and using poly filter and Cuprisorb.
But 140....if true, could be the reason for your SPS issues

 

[David S]

I can't keep SPS alive in my 90g tank (over 5 years old).
Soft corals, Zoas, seem happy and growing
PAR is between 200 - 300 at SPS locations

I just got my ICP water results back.
Does anything stand out to you that could be the issue.
Everything was normal except these:

KH 9.7 dKH (Above Normal) - (I've lowered my dosing)
CA 490mg/l (Critcally high) - (I've lowered my dosing)
Fluorine 0.73 mg/l (Below Normal)
Iodine 16 ug/l (Critically Low)
Manganese ---- (Below Normal)
Iron ----- (Below Normal)
Zinc 140 ug/l (Critically Low)
P(phos) 0.73 ug/l (Critically Low)
PO4 0.00 (Critically Low)
Alum 140 ug/l (Above Normal)

RO Water has High Silicon (already replaced the resin)

Thank you for any help/suggestions you have.

Also Iodine is way low. Should be at least 50 ppb. 90 is probably better.