Can'tRaise Calcium

[Congaken]

Having trouble raising Ca...been putting in 1/2 capful of Coral Up for a couple of days...seems to go down...360 yesterday...340 today...Alk is 12...and seems to stay constant...Its a 65 gal. with a 20 gal sump...fish are well for 1 or 2 years...mostly softees, but have duncan which is fine and trumpet which I just got and worry about...Can you recommend a better product...arragonite?...something that will balance Ca and alk...or what am I doing wrong...thanks...Ken Pletter

 

[Brew12]

Having trouble raising Ca...been putting in 1/2 capful of Coral Up for a couple of days...seems to go down...360 yesterday...340 today...Alk is 12...and seems to stay constant...Its a 65 gal. with a 20 gal sump...fish are well for 1 or 2 years...mostly softees, but have duncan which is fine and trumpet which I just got and worry about...Can you recommend a better product...arragonite?...something that will balance Ca and alk...or what am I doing wrong...thanks...Ken Pletter

What is your magnesium?

 

[Dr. Reef]

testing error, faulty kit or expired? what are you using to measure? and +1 on mag. magnesium plays as a referee between cal and alk to stablize and keep them balance.

 

[ReefersDelite]

I'm currently using Oceans Blend 1&2. I try to keep my parameters at the levels my salt mixes at. It appears as if your ALK and CAL are working against each other and not together. Are you dosing at night or daytime?

 

[Congaken]

I'm currently using Oceans Blend 1&2. I try to keep my parameters at the levels my salt mixes at. It appears as if your ALK and CAL are working against each other and not together. Are you dosing at night or daytime?

night time...use Caribe Sea Coral up and Coral up B...really do not know what I am doing...

 

[Congaken]

What is your magnesium?

since i am used to softees, never measured mag...if I get a kit...what then...what to look for?

 

[ReefersDelite]

Best thing to do is see what your salt mixes at and try to stay with those parameters at least. My calc is 420. Alk is 8.0ish and mag is at 1230

 

[Brew12]

night time...use Caribe Sea Coral up and Coral up B...really do not know what I am doing...

Make sure you are at least dosing them a few minutes apart so they don't cause each other to precipitate out.

Make sure you magnesium is at 1100 ppm or higher imo. I keep mine closer to 1500ppm.

 

[Larry L]

Like previous folks mentioned, if your magnesium is too low, then the calcium you are adding will just precipitate out as calcium carbonate (especially since your alk is so high). There's a good article about it here https://www.advancedaquarist.com/2003/10/chemistry which says:

In short, calcium carbonate (CaCO3) is supersaturated in seawater, meaning that given enough time calcium ions will interact with carbonate ions and precipitate as calcium carbonate. If you push the concentration of either too high, CaCO3 will start to precipitate. Magnesium interferes with this process, permitting both calcium and carbonate to be elevated above where they would be in the absence of magnesium.

I like to keep mine at minimum 1250 ppm, usually closer to 1400 ppm.

 

[Congaken]

ordered mag test kit and magnesium...hopefully its what I need...

 

[beaslbob]

And while you're waiting for the test kits print out and read dr randy homles Farley's improved diy two part.

here: http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The simple answer is that you are using a nearly useless product, and not much of it.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

https://www.marinedepot.com/CaribSe...nd_Alkalinity-CaribSea-CS00540-FIADTP-vi.html

"With CoralUp’s™ unique dual method approach to calcium supplementation, (both ionic and high surface area, highly concentrated mineral phase) this formula allows you to add nearly three times the calcium of other brands without over dosing, and while growing coral in a more natural , ocean-like pH, calcium, and alkalinity environment. The solid phase not only caters to the slime coat feeding method, but serves as a regulator and monitor of water chemistry by the continual dissolution and re-equilibrating of carbonate crystals as mandated by pH and ionic concentration."

The mineral phase, as they call aragonite sand, is not supplying any useful calcium.

EVEN IF if assume it is all bioavailable (it isn't), it is not enough to boost calcium in the short term..

70 gallons, adding a couple of mL per day is almost nothing. 2 mL of 170,000 mg/L calcium into 70 gallons (265,000 ml) boost calcium by 1.3 ppm per day.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

ordered mag test kit and magnesium...hopefully its what I need...

Likely not necessary, but it won't hurt to know.

 

[Congaken]

Likely not necessary, but it won't hurt to know.

Why don't I need to know...?...have mag now...waiting on test kit...Does Coral up contain mag. too...

 

[Leadfooted]

I had the SAME problem with Coral Up and since resolved. To resolve it I used Reef Complete every other day and and I used the full dose of Coral Up and Coral up B every other day. The Reef Complete will give you the boost you need but raise it only slowly so use half doses the first week and if that's not raising it use a full dose every other day of Reef Complete until you hit at least 410 or 420. Once you raise it to 410 or 420, stop using the Reef Complete and now do a full dose every single day (I add just before lights out). I have 110 gallons total and I'm using two caps of Coral up and 4 caps of Coral Up B. I'm not on 3 weeks of stable calcium and corals are very happy! Good luck and as your corals grow you'll need to increase dosage, if it drops again below 360, go back to adding the reef Complete every other day just the same way.

 

[Leadfooted]

https://www.seachem.com/reef-complete.php

"Reef Complete® is a concentrated (160,000 mg/L) optimized blend of ionic calcium designed to restore and maintain calcium to levels found in natural seawater without affecting pH. Calcium and carbonates are essential to all coral growth. If either becomes deficient, coral growth will cease, followed by a rapid decline in coral health. To prevent this you must provide calcium (Reef Complete®) and carbonates (Reef Builder™ or Reef Carbonate™).

Reef Complete® also includes magnesium and strontium in amounts proportionate to typical utilization ratios (100:5:0.1, Ca:Mg:Sr). This allows one to maintain these two important elements while maintaining calcium.

Reef Complete® is a blended product. It is not simply calcium chloride. Commercially available calcium chloride contains ammonia. Unlike other ionic calcium supplements, Reef Complete® is blended to a higher pH in order to force the ammonia to gas off into the atmosphere. In addition, Reef Complete® is more concentrated than any other liquid product on the market. Reef Complete® contains 160,000 ppm calcium. Our nearest competitor’s product is only 110,000 ppm calcium."

 

[Constrictor6090]

The aquavitro calcification is a good product you could look into, only available in retail stores. Some of the calcium it contains is uncharged, meaning you would most likely not have a precipitation issue, if that is what is wrong. I usually keep my magnesium 3x my calcium level (ppm) to keep an ionic balance. Low mag causes more precipitation. Corals use very little mag when building, so hopefully not the issue as mag should be fine.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Why don't I need to know...?...have mag now...waiting on test kit...Does Coral up contain mag. too...

Because it likely isn’t the problem and likely is not low. Low magnesium does not just happen, it takes a long time of no dosing if magnesium with lots of alk and calcium dosing for it to get low.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The aquavitro calcification is a good product you could look into, only available in retail stores. Some of the calcium it contains is uncharged, meaning you would most likely not have a precipitation issue, if that is what is wrong. I usually keep my magnesium 3x my calcium level (ppm) to keep an ionic balance. Low mag causes more precipitation. Corals use very little mag when building, so hopefully not the issue as mag should be fine.

I strongly disagree. IMO it is a very poorly designed product.
Do you know how much alkalinity it adds to your system? No, you can’t know without knowing exactly what happens to the gluconate.