Clownfish bruising/lesion?

[Captain45]

Reviving this old thread as I found it while searching for similar issues.

I just received my clown from a known Quarantined facility laat friday and noticed this bruising behind his fin today. He just finished a week long hunger strike while settling into my tank. Hoping it's not a uronema or similar parasite. The vendor and I are just keeping a close eye on it to see if it's just a bruising or injury or whether it progresses. I'll keep the thread updated.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Reviving this old thread as I found it while searching for similar issues.

I just received my clown from a known Quarantined facility laat friday and noticed this bruising behind his fin today. He just finished a week long hunger strike while settling into my tank. Hoping it's not a uronema or similar parasite. The vendor and I are just keeping a close eye on it to see if it's just a bruising or injury or whether it progresses. I'll keep the thread updated.

That looks like a minor case of whatever it is that we’re seeing in these fish. Hopefully, it will recover on its own.

 

[KGNZ]

Hi all, just joined the forum as I found this thread and it seems like the closest thing to what I am seeing with my clowns.

These two juvenile Ocellaris are captive-bred and about 4 months old. They were added to a new tank after a completed tank cycle a couple weeks ago. These dark red patches appeared on only the white parts of the fish over the first 10 days in the tank. Their tails also seem to have darkened.

Water parameters appear fine: Ammonia 0ppm, Nitrite 0ppm, Nitrate 10ppm, pH 8.4, Water temp 26°C, Salinity 1.024. The fish have been eating fine, a mix of flakes and mysis.

This doesn't seem to be injuries from travel/netting, as the spots have developed since being added to the tank.

This also doesn't seem to be heater burns as - although the heater is in the main tank - it is within a heater guard and I have not observed them hanging out near the heater during the day or night.

My LFS had API Melafix so I picked it up and have dosed the tank for the past three days. Doubtful that the Cajeput oil would do much, but I thought it wouldn't hurt to try. No visible improvement yet.

Worried for my lil guys! I'll add an update in coming weeks. Open to any advice in the meantime!

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Hi all, just joined the forum as I found this thread and it seems like the closest thing to what I am seeing with my clowns.

These two juvenile Ocellaris are captive-bred and about 4 months old. They were added to a new tank after a completed tank cycle a couple weeks ago. These dark red patches appeared on only the white parts of the fish over the first 10 days in the tank. Their tails also seem to have darkened.

Water parameters appear fine: Ammonia 0ppm, Nitrite 0ppm, Nitrate 10ppm, pH 8.4, Water temp 26°C, Salinity 1.024. The fish have been eating fine, a mix of flakes and mysis.

This doesn't seem to be injuries from travel/netting, as the spots have developed since being added to the tank.

This also doesn't seem to be heater burns as - although the heater is in the main tank - it is within a heater guard and I have not observed them hanging out near the heater during the day or night.

My LFS had API Melafix so I picked it up and have dosed the tank for the past three days. Doubtful that the Cajeput oil would do much, but I thought it wouldn't hurt to try. No visible improvement yet.

Worried for my lil guys! I'll add an update in coming weeks. Open to any advice in the meantime!

Yes - that does seem to be the same syndrome. Melafix won’t help - it is just a tonic, and at that, is only active against external issues, and this is an internal problem.

I wish I could offer you another treatment, but so far, we don’t even know the cause.

Good luck and please keep us updated!

 

[MickD]

I too seem to have this issue with one of my clowns. The tank has been running for 2 months. Has cycled, has good parameters and everything in the tank including corals, inverts, and fish seems fine other than 1 of my clowns. Has the red looking bruise on the side of its head. Seemed a little lethargic last evening but tonight seems fine. I would say it looks like it has lost some weight compared with my other clown. I will keep this updated as it may help others with this worrying issue. Thanks Jay for replying to my thread and sending me here.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I too seem to have this issue with one of my clowns. The tank has been running for 2 months. Has cycled, has good parameters and everything in the tank including corals, inverts, and fish seems fine other than 1 of my clowns. Has the red looking bruise on the side of its head. Seemed a little lethargic last evening but tonight seems fine. I would say it looks like it has lost some weight compared with my other clown. I will keep this updated as it may help others with this worrying issue. Thanks Jay for replying to my thread and sending me here.

Is it still eating? If so, just try to feed it small amounts, multiple times a day to see if it will be able to overcome this.....

 

[ekro30]

I have a similar issue with one of my clowns, 6 days ago I saw a little spot on the back fin, she was fighting a little with the other clown.. the do that from time to time so I tought it was normal. Them 4 days ago I saw a bulge on the tail, she wasn’t swimming normal, was doing circles and swimming nose down with trouble moving the tail. Tought was because of the fighting so put her in an acclimation box, still eating.

Couple of days more and was completely on her side, no swimming and at the botttom, today Im seeing red sores all over… im thinking bacterial so im dosing metroplex, kanaplex and had melafix on hand… she’s breathing very fast and not eating much…

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I have a similar issue with one of my clowns, 6 days ago I saw a little spot on the back fin, she was fighting a little with the other clown.. the do that from time to time so I tought it was normal. Them 4 days ago I saw a bulge on the tail, she wasn’t swimming normal, was doing circles and swimming nose down with trouble moving the tail. Tought was because of the fighting so put her in an acclimation box, still eating.

Couple of days more and was completely on her side, no swimming and at the botttom, today Im seeing red sores all over… im thinking bacterial so im dosing metroplex, kanaplex and had melafix on hand… she’s breathing very fast and not eating much…

You may have multiple issues going on here - tough to see brooklynella on white clowns. Can you post a video?

 

[ekro30]

Sadly she died last night… I could not see anything on top of the skin it always seemed internal. These are videos from when she started swimming badly

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Sadly she died last night… I could not see anything on top of the skin it always seemed internal. These are videos from when she started swimming badly

Sorry to hear.

The clown is breathing fast and is swimming in a "stilted" fashion. That can indicate Velvet or Brooklynella, but also some internal issue, like the clownfish bruising syndrome. As I mentioned, seeing Brook on white fish is tough to visualize....

Any other symptoms on other fish in the tank?

 

[ekro30]

tank went fallow for 8weeks after ick outbreak, had only two clowns… they where treated in QT and where doing fine. Two weeks ago they where back in the DT, the other clown is doing fine, eating and with no sign of disease

After returning to the DT i noticed the male returned to his usual spot, but the female looked without a home roaming all the tank… I have a BTA but neither go in yet

 

[MickD]

I too seem to have this issue with one of my clowns. The tank has been running for 2 months. Has cycled, has good parameters and everything in the tank including corals, inverts, and fish seems fine other than 1 of my clowns. Has the red looking bruise on the side of its head. Seemed a little lethargic last evening but tonight seems fine. I would say it looks like it has lost some weight compared with my other clown. I will keep this updated as it may help others with this worrying issue. Thanks Jay for replying to my thread and sending me here.

This one seems to be doing OK. The lesion has gone from the top of his head but there is a small one below the original one. Hardly noticeable so hoping he's recovered

 

[REKWYO]

All,

Over the past two years or so, I've come across dozens of cases on the fish disease forum here of an issue with clownfish that we have not been able to identify. I've never seen it on any clownfish I've had myself, but the issue seems most common on designer clowns, which I don't work with.

Basically, the clownfish show a reddish/dark lesion under the skin that is only visible on the white portions of the fish. The lesions don't seem to break through to the surface like Uronema does. Sometimes the fish dies (but may have had other issues?) and sometimes the fish gets better, but a lot of these cases are "lost to follow up" where the original poster never gets back to us with the outcome.

For the time being, I'm going to call it CBD - Clownfish Bruising Disease. It does not seem to be highly contagious, if at all. External bath treatments are unlikely to help, as the discoloration is clearly deep down in the muscle tissue.

Here are some pictures I've collected here:

Thanks,

Jay


10/22/23: update. A photo came through the forum that showed a newly acquired copperband butterflyfish with a similar lesion. This fish died a few days later. It likely had internal Uronema. It may be that in some fish, the uronema protozoans don't erupt through the fish's skin, and can only be seen in the translucent areas of the body (such as below a white stripe).



#fishmedic


9/12/24 edit:

I should reinforce this: although I call this a “bruise” there is NO evidence that this is caused by an injury….it just looks like a bruise due to the subdermal bleeding.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Welcome to Reef2Reef!

Your post was empty, I just could see a copy of my previous post…..

 

[mpatterson42]

Not sure if this is the same thing but I'm seeing something like it on my black and white clownfish. I thought maybe the orange one was picking on him.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Not sure if this is the same thing but I'm seeing something like it on my black and white clownfish. I thought maybe the orange one was picking on him.

No - that's not the same thing. The "bruising" is completely below the skin level and doesn't stick up on the surface of the fish's skin like this does.

This is more likely an external bacterial infection, possibly from fighting with the other clown. Is it growing larger over time?

 

[mpatterson42]

No - that's not the same thing. The "bruising" is completely below the skin level and doesn't stick up on the surface of the fish's skin like this does.

This is more likely an external bacterial infection, possibly from fighting with the other clown. Is it growing larger over time?

Yeah, they were close to the same size when I bought both of them, now the orange one is a little larger.

 

[xine]

All,

Over the past two years or so, I've come across dozens of cases on the fish disease forum here of an issue with clownfish that we have not been able to identify. I've never seen it on any clownfish I've had myself, but the issue seems most common on designer clowns, which I don't work with.

Basically, the clownfish show a reddish/dark lesion under the skin that is only visible on the white portions of the fish. The lesions don't seem to break through to the surface like Uronema does. Sometimes the fish dies (but may have had other issues?) and sometimes the fish gets better, but a lot of these cases are "lost to follow up" where the original poster never gets back to us with the outcome.

For the time being, I'm going to call it CBD - Clownfish Bruising Disease. It does not seem to be highly contagious, if at all. External bath treatments are unlikely to help, as the discoloration is clearly deep down in the muscle tissue.

Here are some pictures I've collected here:

Thanks,

Jay


10/22/23: update. A photo came through the forum that showed a newly acquired copperband butterflyfish with a similar lesion. This fish died a few days later. It likely had internal Uronema. It may be that in some fish, the uronema protozoans don't erupt through the fish's skin, and can only be seen in the translucent areas of the body (such as below a white stripe).



#fishmedic


9/12/24 edit:

I should reinforce this: although I call this a “bruise” there is NO evidence that this is caused by an injury….it just looks like a bruise due to the subdermal bleeding.

Interestingly, my mocha clownfish developed the purple coloration across almost all of the white on her body and it disappeared entirely within the course of 30 minutes.

I did a 95% water change after having a coral colony die in my dt. She happened to get stuck at a high point on the sand bed and was out of the water for about 1 minute before I realized. In that time she had turned purple, and developed mucus on half of her body (the side that was lying on the sand bed, so I think this was just tissue irritation) that looked like brook. I scooped her over to an area with water and had the tank refilled completely in 5 minutes. She was lethargic, breathing heavily, and lying on her side that whole time.

After 10 minutes the discoloration started to fade and she went into her clay pot and was swimming normally but stressed, after 30 mins it had completely resolved. This morning the mucus was gone as well.

I think that in my case it was a physiological response to oxygen deprivation. I think vasodilation occurs in an attempt to increase countercurrent exchange at the gills as well as oxygen diffusion into tissue. It would also make sense that the discoloration is localized and more enduring in cases of infection or tissue damage, since local immune response triggers increased blood flow to bring WBCs and nutrients to the affected areas. I also have a zombie clownfish, and the purple coloration around the gills (because the gills have such a high density of blood vessels and zombies have transparent skin) looks nearly identical. I feel fairly confident that in all cases the purpose is to increase oxygenation to discolored tissues by vasodilation, so I suspect testing would show a wide variety of pathogens that trigger an inflammatory response and tissue damage.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Interestingly, my mocha clownfish developed the purple coloration across almost all of the white on her body and it disappeared entirely within the course of 30 minutes.

I did a 95% water change after having a coral colony die in my dt. She happened to get stuck at a high point on the sand bed and was out of the water for about 1 minute before I realized. In that time she had turned purple, and developed mucus on half of her body (the side that was lying on the sand bed, so I think this was just tissue irritation) that looked like brook. I scooped her over to an area with water and had the tank refilled completely in 5 minutes. She was lethargic, breathing heavily, and lying on her side that whole time.

After 10 minutes the discoloration started to fade and she went into her clay pot and was swimming normally but stressed, after 30 mins it had completely resolved. This morning the mucus was gone as well.

I think that in my case it was a physiological response to oxygen deprivation. I think vasodilation occurs in an attempt to increase countercurrent exchange at the gills as well as oxygen diffusion into tissue. It would also make sense that the discoloration is localized and more enduring in cases of infection or tissue damage, since local immune response triggers increased blood flow to bring WBCs and nutrients to the affected areas. I also have a zombie clownfish, and the purple coloration around the gills (because the gills have such a high density of blood vessels and zombies have transparent skin) looks nearly identical. I feel fairly confident that in all cases the purpose is to increase oxygenation to discolored tissues by vasodilation, so I suspect testing would show a wide variety of pathogens that trigger an inflammatory response and tissue damage.

In the cases I have reports on, the bruising doesn't fade that fast (if at all). Some fish recover over weeks, and some don't recover at all. I've never seen it resolve in that short of a time period. I do agree that this seems to be some sort of inflammatory response, but we just don't know the cause(s).

One of the issues is that many people don't notice the discoloration, or if they see it, they don't realize that it is an important symptom. We often catch it when they post a picture of their clown, seeking an answer to some other problem.

I wish I had seen cases in my own fish while I was still working at the aquarium - I could have sent samples out for histopathology. I can't do that now because the cost to run a sample can be up to $500.

 

[xine]

In the cases I have reports on, the bruising doesn't fade that fast (if at all). Some fish recover over weeks, and some don't recover at all. I've never seen it resolve in that short of a time period. I do agree that this seems to be some sort of inflammatory response, but we just don't know the cause(s).

One of the issues is that many people don't notice the discoloration, or if they see it, they don't realize that it is an important symptom. We often catch it when they post a picture of their clown, seeking an answer to some other problem.

I wish I had seen cases in my own fish while I was still working at the aquarium - I could have sent samples out for histopathology. I can't do that now because the cost to run a sample can be up to $500.

Yeah it just happened two nights ago and of course I had to scour the internet for any information on why my fish had turned purple for half an hour, which led me here. I couldn’t find any other reports similar to mine, but the bruising looked identical to the photos here and in other threads on the topic, except much more widespread. I wish I had taken a photo but I was rushing to get everything settled to avoid stressing her further. It was quite extreme though. I couldn’t believe what I was seeing at first and thought it had to be a trick of the lighting or that something had somehow stained her skin.

I imagine cases like mine must be pretty rare. She is gravid right now as well, so maybe under heightened stress already which contributed to her having such an extreme reaction.

I’m curious, when you say you’ve seen it fail to resolve, do you mean that you have seen fish that develop the bruising chronically but are otherwise healthy? Or that they have it for an extended period and ultimately die from the underlying cause?

Yeah $500 is a bit steep for a single fish. I’m not in a lab currently, but will be this time next year so if you ever do get a sample I’d be happy to stain the tissue and grab some photos under a microscope to post here for people with more histopath knowledge to look at.