Coral consummations or bad trident test?

[ddc0715]

got several questions here in this post-----so since I have gotten my ph running at 8.3 low and 8.45 H for several days (8 to be exact). I have been watching for a drop in alk, and ca, noting really has swung until today and it was a CA swing. WP at noon yesterday were PHOS-.03, NO3- 20.2, ALK-9.48, CA-535, and MG-1254. I have no in-between reading for CA as I should because I was out of reagents for my trident. once refilled today my WP'S are ALK-9.37, CA-393, and MG-1299.... is that kinda CA swing (142) in a 24 hr period normal? That's alt of CA CONSUMPTION IN A 24 HR PERIOD. is this the growth explosion they talk about when keeping that honey spot ph of 8.3-8.4? I already dose 60 MLS of CA daily is it time to bump that number up? or is something wrong I have retested (trident 2x now).

 

[Biglew11]

Most likely testing error. I'd double check it against a regular test kit. Also run a calibration on the new reagents.

 

[ddc0715]

since I have hit the sweet spot in ph i first had a ca worry. it dropped to 393 I did a recalibration on the trident and It must have a test error because it went back close to the normal range.(spike in the graph).. HOWEVRRRRRR since I have hit the sweet spot in ph my alk drop has been more and more each day. even after the recalibration.

is this normal to see a large drop in alk when the tank starts growing well. I had 1.4 in 22hr or 8.84 to 7.4 dkh

current demand/ dosing (pre 8.3 ph) was 1600ml kalk 24/7, 50 ml soda ash 00:00- lights on 7am.. i have not wanted to mess with it until I saw a consumption sign. is this that sign? tank looks like gold and diamonds.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Do you dose the alk supplement (not the kalk) every day, or was it just a one time thing?

 

[ddc0715]

auto dose via Neptune dose daily between midnight and 7 am. to help the lows of my ph at night. the soda ash mix also contains my tropic marine trace elements. I made several bcarb (baing soda) ph was adjustments last night and bumped it back to 8.5 I'm interested to see if I get another drop as I did yesterday. if I do what does that tell me? good growth rate? I see no precip anywhere in my tank. I'm new to this 8.3 or higher range ph in my tank. its kinda exciting.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Consumption of alk and calcium, the latter of which is harder to detect with hobby testing, can be due to either abiotic precipitation ipitation, which you often cannot readily see, or consumption by calcifying organisms. Both of these effects rise as alk or pH rise.

 

[ZombieEngineer]

I would just set your trident controlled dosing and peg either the soda ash, the kalk, or both to it if you're using a DOS. Start with control bounds of 0.5 dKH to 20% and adjust from there. If it keeps drifting down, adjust your base dosage or increase bounds to 40%. Every month or so I get a good average of the actual amounts dosed and adjust my base dosing to that.

 

[ddc0715]

trident controlled dosing is something I am unsure how it works. I get the concept, but can you provide me an example with a dkh target of 8.5? if I'm off, say trident tests at 8.1 and the target is 8.5 does the dos dump all my alk dosing at once? each and every time I'm low? this method just does not seem consistent but I'm unsure how it functions so my perception is flawed. im off to you tube to revisit this controlled dosing

 

[ZombieEngineer]

trident controlled dosing is something I am unsure how it works. I get the concept, but can you provide me an example with a dkh target of 8.5? if I'm off, say trident tests at 8.1 and the target is 8.5 does the dos dump all my alk dosing at once? each and every time I'm low? this method just does not seem consistent but I'm unsure how it functions so my perception is flawed. im off to you tube to revisit this controlled dosing

Here is an example. It modifies the dosing amount automatically based on the results of each alk test.

Settings.

Control interval: 8.5dKH setpoint. Range set to +-0.5dKH. Limit set to +-20%.

Modify interval set to 1600ml over 24 hours. Testing interval set 4 times daily at 2am, 8am, 2pm, 8pm. So 400ml dosed base level each 6 hour interval.


Let's say at 8am, your trident measures 8.2dKH. That's 60% low on your range, so instead of dosing 400ml it will dose 60% of your range, 12% extra, or 448ml to help bring it in line.

Let's say at 2pm the value overcorrects and it measures 8.7 dKH. That is 40% high so it will underdose and use 368ml.

Let's say at 8pm something caused your Alkalinity to go out of range entirely (like a water change or something) and it was either below 8.0 or above 9.0. The dose will revert back to the scheduled 400ml per period and if you set an alert in your email, you could manually dose, repeat the rest to make sure it's accurate, adjust your range, adjust your base dosing, etc.


Basically within a limited window that you configure, it will automatically adjust your dosing to compensate for changes in alkalinity. I'm pretty good with math and basic chemistry, so I adjust my base to be the average dose over the past week once a month. I then adjust my range and limit so that the extra amount dosed is equal to the amount required to resolve the difference within 24 hours. (Example if my tank consumes 50ml or 1dKH per day, to correct up to the safe value of the lower of 40% extra or 0.8dKH, I need a range of 0.4 dKH to 40%. If my tank consumed 2dKH instead, I would need a range of 0.8dKH to 40%. If my tank consumed 3dKH per day, I would use a range of 0.8dKH to 27%).

 

[ddc0715]

I'm going to re-read this main times today until it clicks thanks. thanks thank thanks..

fyi here's how mine is set up and why im asking this question----you may or may not know but the past two days i have had a 1.0 dkh drop durning lights on to dark (i contribute this to hitting the 8.3-8.4 ph sweet spot a few weeks back. so i need to make an adjustment. either in my kalk or my soda ash dose.

The red arrows are my current soda ash dose of 60 mls set for a start of midnight thru 6 am and controlled by trident testing set at 8.75, with a range of .20 and a % of 30.

My kalk dose is 1800 mls 24/7, not controlled by trident. i consider it a second ato really)

so
Lights on at 7 am and the alk consumption beings, my soda ash dosing stops---- starting alk is 9.2
Blue star- noon tested at 8.82
Red star- 6 pm tested at 8.92
Lights out at 8pm
Green star- midnight tested at 8.84
Soda ash dosing beings
blue triangle – 6 am tested at 9.28.


heres my mental hang up---you and others have stated that the trident should adjust doses based on tests then why is all my soda ash (alk) doses equal from the green star to the blue triangle time period? if i have done something right its pruely by accident. lol

 

[ZombieEngineer]

I'm going to re-read this main times today until it clicks thanks. thanks thank thanks..

fyi here's how mine is set up and why im asking this question----you may or may not know but the past two days i have had a 1.0 dkh drop durning lights on to dark (i contribute this to hitting the 8.3-8.4 ph sweet spot a few weeks back. so i need to make an adjustment. either in my kalk or my soda ash dose.

The red arrows are my current soda ash dose of 60 mls set for a start of midnight thru 6 am and controlled by trident testing set at 8.75, with a range of .20 and a % of 30.

My kalk dose is 1800 mls 24/7, not controlled by trident. i consider it a second ato really)

so
Lights on at 7 am and the alk consumption beings, my soda ash dosing stops---- starting alk is 9.2
Blue star- noon tested at 8.82
Red star- 6 pm tested at 8.92
Lights out at 8pm
Green star- midnight tested at 8.84
Soda ash dosing beings
Green triangle – 6 am tested at 9.28.


heres my mental hang up---you and others have stated that the trident should adjust doses based on tests then why is all my soda ash (alk) doses equal from the green star to the blue triangle time period? if i have done something right its pruely by accident. lol

When you go outside the range, it defaults to the "normal" dose, so dose actually goes up from green star to blue triangle

The DOS will also do adjustments by adding/removing doses, changing quantity per dose, or changing interval between doses. I do not know the details of the actual algorithm behind it, so the easiest way is to look at the graph and change the timescales to get a total for that time period.

 

[ddc0715]

outside the range? bare with me, please

using my settings of
target value 8.75, with a range of .20 and a % of 30.

my target range (including the .20) (acceptable range) is a tested dkh of either 8.55 or 8.95

the green star test was 8.84 this was within range so the doses were divided equally at 1.4 ml ( no need to adjust up or down) until the next test result comes in. correct?

the blue triangle (next test) was 9.28 this was outside of my acceptable range so the dose amounts should have been less correct? there is no way to know now because my dosing stops at the same time as this test runs. but if it ran longer then I would have seen a smaller dose? right

 

[ZombieEngineer]

outside the range? bare with me, please

using my settings of
target value 8.75, with a range of .20 and a % of 30.

my target range (including the .20) (acceptable range) is a tested dkh of either 8.55 or 8.95

the green star test was 8.84 this was within range so the doses were divided equally at 1.4 ml ( no need to adjust up or down) until the next test result comes in. correct?

the blue triangle (next test) was 9.28 this was outside of my acceptable range so the dose amounts should have been less correct? there is no way to know now because my dosing stops at the same time as this test runs. but if it ran longer then I would have seen a smaller dose? right

At the green star, 8.84 is 45% of the way into your range, so that one would run 13.5% below your base level of 50ml down to 43.2ml.

If the measurement had been 9.28 at the beginning of your dosing period, it would be outside your range and default to 50ml.