Current Quarantine Protocol

chipchipmofo

Valuable Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2021
Messages
1,378
Reaction score
1,321
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Switzerland
@Jay Hemdal

I need to treat my fish pretty fast with some type of copper or whatever (Marine Velvet). So the usual things are not available here in my country like copper power or cupramine. So the only thing available is Odimor from Aquarium Münster. Is seems to contain Copper aswell and you need to dose 40 drops for 100 Litres.

Is that a treatment I can use and expect my fish to get healed?



Types and quantities of active substances:​

1 ml solution contains:

20 mg copper sulfate pentahydrate

1 mg malachite green oxalate
 
Top Shelf Aquatics
OP
Jay Hemdal

Jay Hemdal

10K Club member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
Messages
15,746
Reaction score
15,890
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Dundee, MI
@Jay Hemdal

I need to treat my fish pretty fast with some type of copper or whatever (Marine Velvet). So the usual things are not available here in my country like copper power or cupramine. So the only thing available is Odimor from Aquarium Münster. Is seems to contain Copper aswell and you need to dose 40 drops for 100 Litres.

Is that a treatment I can use and expect my fish to get healed?



Types and quantities of active substances:​

1 ml solution contains:

20 mg copper sulfate pentahydrate

1 mg malachite green oxalate

I've never used that. Mixing copper and malachite green seems stressful to me. Off the cuff, this appears to be a ionic copper solution, one that needs to be dosed at 0.20 ppm, not the 0.50 of Cupramine, or the 2.0 of copper power. You need a low range copper test kit in order to maintain a dose between 0.18 and 0.21 ppm.

What about chloroquine to treat the velvet? Are you sure of your diagnosis?

Jay
 

chipchipmofo

Valuable Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2021
Messages
1,378
Reaction score
1,321
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Switzerland
I've never used that. Mixing copper and malachite green seems stressful to me. Off the cuff, this appears to be a ionic copper solution, one that needs to be dosed at 0.20 ppm, not the 0.50 of Cupramine, or the 2.0 of copper power. You need a low range copper test kit in order to maintain a dose between 0.18 and 0.21 ppm.

What about chloroquine to treat the velvet? Are you sure of your diagnosis?

Jay
Yeah.. Well its the only medication available here in my country.
I do have the opportunity to buy Sera Protazol but dont know if this will be a better product though.

Yes, I am sure about the diagnosis.

I was going to add the exact amount of drops they recommend. But I do have the sponge filter in the QT tank and they say "dont ilter" but I need to filter because of the ammonia I guess.

Chloroquine isnt available here somehow.. I did search everywhere.
 
Avast
OP
Jay Hemdal

Jay Hemdal

10K Club member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
Messages
15,746
Reaction score
15,890
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Dundee, MI
Yeah.. Well its the only medication available here in my country.
I do have the opportunity to buy Sera Protazol but dont know if this will be a better product though.

Yes, I am sure about the diagnosis.

I was going to add the exact amount of drops they recommend. But I do have the sponge filter in the QT tank and they say "dont ilter" but I need to filter because of the ammonia I guess.

Chloroquine isnt available here somehow.. I did search everywhere.
When they say "don't filter" they must mean don't use chemical filtrants such as copper. A sponge filer is fine with any type of copper, and you'll need that to control the ammonia.

Given how deadly velvet is, I don't see that you have any other options here, you'll need to use it.

jay
 

chipchipmofo

Valuable Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2021
Messages
1,378
Reaction score
1,321
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Switzerland
When they say "don't filter" they must mean don't use chemical filtrants such as copper. A sponge filer is fine with any type of copper, and you'll need that to control the ammonia.

Given how deadly velvet is, I don't see that you have any other options here, you'll need to use it.

jay
thank you jay! I will def. go ahead with the treatment.
Would you say I need an airstone aswell or it the oxygen enough through a sponge filter?
 
OP
Jay Hemdal

Jay Hemdal

10K Club member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
Messages
15,746
Reaction score
15,890
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Dundee, MI
thank you jay! I will def. go ahead with the treatment.
Would you say I need an airstone aswell or it the oxygen enough through a sponge filter?

If the sponge filter is bubbling well, that should be fine.

Jay
 
Nutramar Foods

chipchipmofo

Valuable Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2021
Messages
1,378
Reaction score
1,321
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Switzerland
If the sponge filter is bubbling well, that should be fine.

Jay
Thanks Jay!
Ive noticed that the fish dont eat well after putting them into the QT tank.
So dont know what to do in that case other then just throw in the food and hope they'll start eating..
 
OP
Jay Hemdal

Jay Hemdal

10K Club member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
Messages
15,746
Reaction score
15,890
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Dundee, MI
Thanks Jay!
Ive noticed that the fish dont eat well after putting them into the QT tank.
So dont know what to do in that case other then just throw in the food and hope they'll start eating..

Fish not eating well while in quarantine can have multiple causes: they will feel more stressed than in a regular tank with lots of hiding places, they are newer fish (obviously) so haven't gotten accustomed to aquarium life, they are being medicated, and they may have the start of some disease, or a combination of multiple things.

You need to offer appropriate foods, but then remove uneaten food promptly and monitor the ammonia level.

Jay
 

Kraig

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 24, 2021
Messages
410
Reaction score
1,288
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
St. Louis
Hello,

Question about bringing copper down after 30 day treatment. I see it says to verify levels are below 1 before prazi treatment. Is it okay to leave copper (using copersafe) in at a level lower than 1 (say .08ish or so) for the rest of QT and during prazi treatment or should I work on getting copper as close to 0 as possible.

Also, I have a powerhead pointed at the surface, getting decent surface agitation. I've probably read this already, but is that adequate oxygenation while doing prazi treatment? This is in a 20g tank with oversized HOB filter and the powerhead.

Thanks!
Kraig
 
Last edited:
Avast
OP
Jay Hemdal

Jay Hemdal

10K Club member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
Messages
15,746
Reaction score
15,890
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Dundee, MI
Hello,

Question about bringing copper down after 30 day treatment. I see it says to verify levels are below 1 before prazi treatment. Is it okay to leave copper (using copersafe) in at a level lower than 1 (say .08ish or so) for the rest of QT and during prazi treatment or should I work on getting copper as close to 0 as possible.

Also, I have a powerhead pointed at the surface, getting decent surface agitation. I've probably read this already, but is that adequate oxygenation while doing prazi treatment? This is in a 20g tank with oversized HOB filter and the powerhead.

Thanks!
Kraig

Depending on your test method, you may not get a zero reading for copper. I just try not to dose multiple medications at the same time, thus the idea of getting below 1 ppm with coppersafe prior to dosing with prazi. You can certainly go lower than that, but you can also just leave that copper level in place as you finish up the quarantine.

Jay
 

Kraig

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 24, 2021
Messages
410
Reaction score
1,288
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
St. Louis
Depending on your test method, you may not get a zero reading for copper. I just try not to dose multiple medications at the same time, thus the idea of getting below 1 ppm with coppersafe prior to dosing with prazi. You can certainly go lower than that, but you can also just leave that copper level in place as you finish up the quarantine.

Jay
Thanks Jay. I've been testing with Hanna during this process.
 

mfinn

likes zoanthids
Review score
+7 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Jul 22, 2006
Messages
10,090
Reaction score
6,694
Review score
+7 /0 /-0
Location
Olympia, WA.
Thanks Jay!
Ive noticed that the fish dont eat well after putting them into the QT tank.
So dont know what to do in that case other then just throw in the food and hope they'll start eating..
One trick I use to get fish to eat is to ( I use small frozen mysis) drop the food in front of a small powerhead so that the food appears to be moving. It seems to trigger a feeding response.
 
Nutramar Foods

TroyClark

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 20, 2018
Messages
223
Reaction score
112
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Jay,

I just got 2 blue chin triggers into a 25 gallon bare bottom QT tank with PVC tubes for hiding. I am using an aquaclear 110 with a seeded bag of bio media from my DT. I am planning on using some Copper Power for a 30 day treatment but it wont' get here for another week. Can I do the API General Cure treatment before the Copper Power treatment since I have the API General Cure on hand or must the Copper Power go first?

Thanks

Troy Clark
 

threebuoys

Valuable Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Nov 24, 2020
Messages
1,218
Reaction score
2,062
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Avon, NC
Jay,

I just got 2 blue chin triggers into a 25 gallon bare bottom QT tank with PVC tubes for hiding. I am using an aquaclear 110 with a seeded bag of bio media from my DT. I am planning on using some Copper Power for a 30 day treatment but it wont' get here for another week. Can I do the API General Cure treatment before the Copper Power treatment since I have the API General Cure on hand or must the Copper Power go first?

Thanks

Troy Clark
If you have prazipro, that would be a better choice than General Cure. The praziquantel in prazipro is already in solution. The powdered praziquantel in General cure does not dissolve as quickly. If you choose to use either General Cure or PraziPro first, you should not dose copper until the other meds have been eliminated from the DT. General Cure also contains metronidazole which, while valuable for some treatments, is not part of the standard QT protocol.
 

TroyClark

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 20, 2018
Messages
223
Reaction score
112
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
If you have prazipro, that would be a better choice than General Cure. The praziquantel in prazipro is already in solution. The powdered praziquantel in General cure does not dissolve as quickly. If you choose to use either General Cure or PraziPro first, you should not dose copper until the other meds have been eliminated from the DT. General Cure also contains metronidazole which, while valuable for some treatments, is not part of the standard QT protocol.
I do have prazipro on hand. I just got through reading some threads on how people where having problems with losing fish during QT while using praipro and that General Cure was just as effective and gentler on the fish. I have used prazipro extensively in the past with my freshwater Discus and Angels but hadn't used it on saltwater fish before. Is it considered safe as long as I heavily aerate the QT?

Thanks
 
AquaCave Logo Banner

threebuoys

Valuable Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Nov 24, 2020
Messages
1,218
Reaction score
2,062
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Avon, NC
I normally avoid treating copper and general cure at the same time. In fact, general cure overall is more stressful than treating with Prazipro or pure praziquantel. Just make sure you aerate the tank well, and change a third of the water 48 hours after the general cure treatment/

Jay Hemdal

I do have prazipro on hand. I just got through reading some threads on how people where having problems with losing fish during QT while using praipro and that General Cure was just as effective and gentler on the fish. I have used prazipro extensively in the past with my freshwater Discus and Angels but hadn't used it on saltwater fish before. Is it considered safe as long as I heavily aerate the QT?

Thanks
Actually, Jay feels that prazipro is gentler than General Cure. It is important to add extra aeration. Also. be as accurate as you can when you estimate the amount of water in the QT. It is easy to over or under dose some meds when for example some 20 gallon aquariums only hold 17+/- gallons of water.
 

TroyClark

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 20, 2018
Messages
223
Reaction score
112
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Actually, Jay feels that prazipro is gentler than General Cure. It is important to add extra aeration. Also. be as accurate as you can when you estimate the amount of water in the QT. It is easy to over or under dose some meds when for example some 20 gallon aquariums only hold 17+/- gallons of water.
Whats your opinion on Copper Power vs. Cupramine?
 

threebuoys

Valuable Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Nov 24, 2020
Messages
1,218
Reaction score
2,062
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Avon, NC
Whats your opinion on Copper Power vs. Cupramine?
I think Copper Power or Copper Safe are much easier to use and may have fewer risks. I've used Cupramine successfully in the past, but its chemical composition differs from the other 2. Whichever you choose, follow the instructions on the label carefully. Target concentration for Copper Power or Copper Safe is 2.0 - 2.5 ppm. Concentration for Cupramine is 0.5 ppm. Difference is due to difference in chemical composition.
Be sure to use a reliable copper test kit ( Hanna works well) and keep an eye on you ammonia just in case your biofilter isn't fully active.
 
Orphek OR3 reef aquarium LED bar

TroyClark

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Oct 20, 2018
Messages
223
Reaction score
112
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
I think Copper Power or Copper Safe are much easier to use and may have fewer risks. I've used Cupramine successfully in the past, but its chemical composition differs from the other 2. Whichever you choose, follow the instructions on the label carefully. Target concentration for Copper Power or Copper Safe is 2.0 - 2.5 ppm. Concentration for Cupramine is 0.5 ppm. Difference is due to difference in chemical composition.
Be sure to use a reliable copper test kit ( Hanna works well) and keep an eye on you ammonia just in case your biofilter isn't fully active.
Thanks. I will go ahead and put some Prazipro in tonight and then when the Copper Power comes in, I will do a 1/2 water change and start the Copper Power.
 

Muffin87

Active Member
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
View Badges
Joined
Aug 12, 2019
Messages
272
Reaction score
206
Review score
+0 /0 /-0
Location
Italy / UK
I just verified the LR. I added 10 ml of Coppersafe to 80 l of salt water. As Coppersafe is aprox. 6 mg/ml the final concentration should be 60 mg/80 l = 0,75 ppm. The result obtained was 749 ppb, which is pretty accurate. Today I'll prepare a dilution of the sample and see how it works.
Hi @chema, have you been using the LR copper checker since?

What medications do you use it with? Cupramine?

Thanks!
 

Have you bred fish in your tanks?

  • I have bred saltwater fish

    Votes: 37 13.2%
  • I have bred freshwater fish

    Votes: 119 42.5%
  • Not yet, but I am interested in breeding fish

    Votes: 66 23.6%
  • I think it is an interesting idea, but not my thing

    Votes: 64 22.9%
  • I am not interested in breeding fish

    Votes: 43 15.4%
Gluemasters - your best choice for CA super glue
Top