I see many posts indicating that there should be measurable amounts of Nitrate and Phosphate in the water for good SPS health and coloration. I am wondering if direct feeding of products like Reef-Roids and Reef Chili would provide the same nutrition needed by the coral. If I direct feed my SPS 2-3 times a week, would this make up for not having measurable Nitrate and Phosphate in the water? Thanks for your thoughts.
Dissolved Nitrate/Phosphate vs Direct Feeding
- Thread starter ddrueckh
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EmdeReef
2500 Club Member
It might. There are successful tanks with low to undetectable nitrate and phosphate. The only way to know for sure is to start doing it and see how your corals respond.
I would recommend keeping alkalinity on the lower side which will give you some buffer and prevent alk burns.
I would recommend keeping alkalinity on the lower side which will give you some buffer and prevent alk burns.
mfollen
Valuable Member
Not entirely.
The focus in nutrition (to my limited knowledge at least) is not just for the coral but the zooxanthellae, which need phosphate/nitrate to survive.
I'd avoid the mistake that myself and many reefers have made, dont run a tank with undetectable phosphate and nitrate. It can lead to more problems than avoiding.
How old is your system?
The focus in nutrition (to my limited knowledge at least) is not just for the coral but the zooxanthellae, which need phosphate/nitrate to survive.
I'd avoid the mistake that myself and many reefers have made, dont run a tank with undetectable phosphate and nitrate. It can lead to more problems than avoiding.
How old is your system?
Thanks for the replies. My system is a year old. I’m not trying to keep my nitrate and phosphate low...I just can’t get them to rise even when I feed 1 cube of brine, 2 cubes of mysis, and a cube size chunk of Rod’s food once a day. I was hoping that direct feeding would help the coral get the nutrition they need. The system is 300 gallons. My parameters are as follows:
Alk 7.8
Ca 440
Mg 1395
Alk 7.8
Ca 440
Mg 1395
EmdeReef
2500 Club Member
Y
You’re feeding a 10th of what I feed my ~160g. How many fish? You should feed more unless you only have a few fish
You’re feeding a 10th of what I feed my ~160g. How many fish? You should feed more unless you only have a few fish
Nutrient levels are determined by input, consumption and export. Ultimately you’d like to have a steady state at a nutrient level/range/ratio that you determine to be best.
So it’s not really just about how much you feed (input).
Consumption would include how many fish (although fish pass through a majority of food through excretion, how much bacterial consumption (aerobic, anaerobic, live rock, sand, siporax like materials, carbon dosing, etc)
Export would include protein skimmer, filter socks, water changes, chaeto, etc.
Feeding more fish food and or feeding your coral would raise nutrients. But if you overfeed, you may raise your phosphates proportionately more than you may wish. That is why some people will add nitrates if the phosphates are in a range they desire but nitrates are lower than what they believe is an ideal range.
What levels are ideal is open to debate/discussion. Some people like NSW parameters others much higher.
So it’s not really just about how much you feed (input).
Consumption would include how many fish (although fish pass through a majority of food through excretion, how much bacterial consumption (aerobic, anaerobic, live rock, sand, siporax like materials, carbon dosing, etc)
Export would include protein skimmer, filter socks, water changes, chaeto, etc.
Feeding more fish food and or feeding your coral would raise nutrients. But if you overfeed, you may raise your phosphates proportionately more than you may wish. That is why some people will add nitrates if the phosphates are in a range they desire but nitrates are lower than what they believe is an ideal range.
What levels are ideal is open to debate/discussion. Some people like NSW parameters others much higher.
I have the following fish: quoyi parrot fish, yellow tang, 2 clowns, 4 Green chromis, redhead wrass, blue head wrass, algae Blenny and watchman goby. I have the following fish on the way: powder blue tang, kole tang and blue jaw trigger. I should mention that I also feed nori. It seems, though, that I feed a lot less than others do! I better feed more though the fish all look fat and healthy.
If you are feeding those fish enough so that they are actually growing a little bit every year, then that is probably enough coral food for most tanks. It seems to me that you could feed them more.
I am a strong proponent of high throughput (heavy import/feeding and heavy export(skimming/fuge) with low residual numbers, but I typed too much on this yesterday, so I am going to stay out.
Remember that corals prefer to get nitrogen from ammonia/ammonium and not so much from nitrate. Feeding the fish more does this. Think of the fish as processors to feed your corals... it is not just about the fish.
As your tank matures, your P will rise. The aragonite will bind a bunch of it in the beginning. It binds to "equilibrium" with the water and can really mask any kind of issues that you have with husbandry or anything. Eventually, the rock and sand will "fill up" and you will get phosphate levels - soon, you will hate phosphate. A mature tank with lots of rock and a few inches of sand can nearly always keep N low with oxic bacteria - this is normal and fine. After a while, it is normal to have N that stays very low and P that climbs if you do not have a fuge or use some GFO. This is better than tanks that have high nitrate levels and very low phosphate levels - nearly all of which seem to do poorly.
I am a strong proponent of high throughput (heavy import/feeding and heavy export(skimming/fuge) with low residual numbers, but I typed too much on this yesterday, so I am going to stay out.
Remember that corals prefer to get nitrogen from ammonia/ammonium and not so much from nitrate. Feeding the fish more does this. Think of the fish as processors to feed your corals... it is not just about the fish.
As your tank matures, your P will rise. The aragonite will bind a bunch of it in the beginning. It binds to "equilibrium" with the water and can really mask any kind of issues that you have with husbandry or anything. Eventually, the rock and sand will "fill up" and you will get phosphate levels - soon, you will hate phosphate. A mature tank with lots of rock and a few inches of sand can nearly always keep N low with oxic bacteria - this is normal and fine. After a while, it is normal to have N that stays very low and P that climbs if you do not have a fuge or use some GFO. This is better than tanks that have high nitrate levels and very low phosphate levels - nearly all of which seem to do poorly.
AdamB
Valuable Member
I agree. I’ve just had same problem of undetectable phos and nitrate in my second tank I started up 10 months ago. I have chaeto in fuge and trying to feed much more to get them up a little. I also had put carbon matrix in sump and I think that was another unwittingly mistake I done ! I new better lol!
LARedstickreefer
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I have high phosphate (0.11ppm) and zero nitrates. I am upping my feedings and dosing nitrates now.
I’m already feeding so much that my fish are fat and stop eating. How to keep nitrates up naturally?
I’m already feeding so much that my fish are fat and stop eating. How to keep nitrates up naturally?
I’ve noticed my fish are not eating with the same ferociousness as they did when I fed just once a day
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