DIY Fluoride

[USMA36]

I use the reef moonshine elements which for the most part are cost effective. All but Fluoride that is. Is there a recipe that I can use to diy Fluoride that will match the concentration of the moonshine Flouride? It’s 20.00 a bottle and from my understanding a fairly weak concentration. According to the rm calculator to raise my current flouride level of .81 mg/l to the recommended 1.5 mg/L I need to dose 74.63 ml X 7 days of the reef moonshine Flouride element into my 200 gallon system. That’s roughly a bottle per month depending on icp results. I was looking at this sodium flouride to use. If anyone has a different recommendation can help me work out the math/recipe would you mind sharing? I understand that flouride needs to be handled safely using the proper ppe and I am able to do that.

https://www.loudwolf.com/storefront/index.php?route=product/product&path=755&product_id=1095

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

There's a fluoride recipe link, among others, here:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/diy-chemistry-archive.987116/

 

[USMA36]

There's a fluoride recipe link, among others, here:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/diy-chemistry-archive.987116/

Wow! What a great resource. Thank you again. I have bookmarked that page. Will the fluoride I linked above be the same concentration? Would you mind checking my math.. I’m a terrible mathematician. If I use your 1 liter formula 165 ml will raise my 200 gallons by 1mg/L my last icp was .8 mg/L. In order to raise my level to 1.5mg/L I’d need to dose 165 x .7 which is 115 ml. Of that how much can I safely dose per day? It’s a much more concentrated dose than the reef moonshine bottle which I’d have to use 500ml spread out over 7 days to get the same rise in fluoride.

 

[KStatefan]

Wow! What a great resource. Thank you again. I have bookmarked that page. Will the fluoride I linked above be the same concentration? Would you mind checking my math.. I’m a terrible mathematician. If I use your 1 liter formula 165 ml will raise my 200 gallons by 1mg/L my last icp was .8 mg/L. In order to raise my level to 1.5mg/L I’d need to dose 165 x .7 which is 115 ml. Of that how much can I safely dose per day? It’s a much more concentrated dose than the reef moonshine bottle which I’d have to use 500ml spread out over 7 days to get the same rise in fluoride.

You could mix up a diy to the same concentration of moonshine then just dose with the information from their calculator

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Wow! What a great resource. Thank you again. I have bookmarked that page. Will the fluoride I linked above be the same concentration? Would you mind checking my math.. I’m a terrible mathematician. If I use your 1 liter formula 165 ml will raise my 200 gallons by 1mg/L my last icp was .8 mg/L. In order to raise my level to 1.5mg/L I’d need to dose 165 x .7 which is 115 ml. Of that how much can I safely dose per day? It’s a much more concentrated dose than the reef moonshine bottle which I’d have to use 500ml spread out over 7 days to get the same rise in fluoride.

The amount to can safely dose is up to NSW each time. If you don't know what that is on a daily basis, because you do not know the daily demand (if any), then I would not be able to suggest a dose.

The recipe I give there is

If you dissolve 10 grams in 1 L, then it is 10 mg/mL NaF and it takes 22 mL of that solution to boost 100 L by 1 mg/L F.

If you want to raise 200 gallons (757 L) by 0.7 mg/L (0.8 to 1.5 mg/L) then you will need 117 mL.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

FWIW, NSW at 35 ppt contains about 1,3 mg/L.

 

[USMA36]

You could mix up a diy to the same concentration of moonshine then just dose with the information from their calculator

That would be ideal but I have no idea what the concentration is for the reef moonshine element.

 

[USMA36]

The amount to can safely dose is up to NSW each time. If you don't know what that is on a daily basis, because you do not know the daily demand (if any), then I would not be able to suggest a dose.

The recipe I give there is

If you dissolve 10 grams in 1 L, then it is 10 mg/mL NaF and it takes 22 mL of that solution to boost 100 L by 1 mg/L F.

If you want to raise 200 gallons (757 L) by 0.7 mg/L (0.8 to 1.5 mg/L) then you will need 117 mL.

Thank you again. I wonder why moonshine splits the dose over the course of a week. Especially if it’s so much more diluted than a diy version. They have me dosing 75ml a day for 7 days instead of doing it all at once in one dose.

 

[Troylee]

Thank you again. I wonder why moonshine splits the dose over the course of a week. Especially if it’s so much more diluted than a diy version. They have me dosing 75ml a day for 7 days instead of doing it all at once in one dose.

It’s how they sell products lol..

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Thank you again. I wonder why moonshine splits the dose over the course of a week. Especially if it’s so much more diluted than a diy version. They have me dosing 75ml a day for 7 days instead of doing it all at once in one dose.

I couldn't tell you why they do what they do, but if you want to add it slowly, there's certainly no reason to not do so.

 

[KStatefan]

That would be ideal but I have no idea what the concentration is for the reef moonshine element.

Looks like theirs is 1000 ppm plugging numbers into their calculator

 

[USMA36]

Looks like theirs is 1000 ppm plugging numbers into their calculator

How does that translate for Randy’s recipe of 10 grams added to 1 liter? Is it 10000ppm basically making the diy 10x stronger than reef moonshine Fluorine?

 

[KStatefan]

How does that translate for Randy’s recipe of 10 grams added to 1 liter? Is it 10000ppm basically making the diy 10x stronger than reef moonshine Fluorine?

That is 10 grams of Sodium Floride but since it is 45% floride that would be 4.5 grams of floride in 1 liter so approximately 4500 ppm compared to the 1000ppm floride in the moonsine product

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

There's nothing wrong with diluting my recipe more if folks want to use online tools with it.

 

[bumpyj38]

How does that translate for Randy’s recipe of 10 grams added to 1 liter? Is it 10000ppm basically making the diy 10x stronger than reef moonshine Fluorine?

Did you ever try this DIY recipe? How did it go? I’m in the same boat.

 

[USMA36]

No, I’m gonna stick with the moonshiner elements for now. After speaking to some people using the diy sodium flouride may not work the same. Something about bioavailability. Could be bs might not, but I don’t know enough about how it all works to say either way.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

No, I’m gonna stick with the moonshiner elements for now. After speaking to some people using the diy sodium flouride may not work the same. Something about bioavailability. Could be bs might not, but I don’t know enough about how it all works to say either way.

I do know, however, and while I have no interest in what you dose, I won’t let a ridiculous myth like that stand unchallenged. It can only have been suggested by someone who does not understand chemistry. We know exactly what form fluoride takes in seawater, and sodium fluoride adds that exact form. It is also unquestionably the form in any fluoride supplement (fluoride ion). Nothing else makes any sense.

I don’t mean that as any criticism of you. Ordinary reefers are not expected to understand such issues and that the reason this forum exists. I do mean it as a criticism of the person who initially started the misinformation.

 

[-JoJoReefing-]

I do know, however, and while I have no interest in what you dose, I won’t let a ridiculous myth like that stand unchallenged. It can only have been suggested by someone who does not understand chemistry. We know exactly what form fluoride takes in seawater, and sodium fluoride adds that exact form. It is also unquestionably the form in any fluoride supplement (fluoride ion). Nothing else makes any sense.

I don’t mean that as any criticism of you. Ordinary reefers are not expected to understand such issues and that the reason this forum exists. I do mean it as a criticism of the person who initially started the misinformation.

Hi! I am also looking for NaF alternatives, and i am not very confident to handle it in powder form, so i find a solution online (NaF reagent solution 2% from AquaPhoenix) https://catalog.aquaphoenixsci.com/...reagents-standards/sf9020-q-sodium-fluoride-2. Wonder if you think this is something that will work?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Hi! I am also looking for NaF alternatives, and i am not very confident to handle it in powder form, so i find a solution online (NaF reagent solution 2% from AquaPhoenix) https://catalog.aquaphoenixsci.com/...reagents-standards/sf9020-q-sodium-fluoride-2. Wonder if you think this is something that will work?

It doesn’t say what the purity is, but it is probably ok. :)

 

[billyocean]

Hi! I am also looking for NaF alternatives, and i am not very confident to handle it in powder form, so i find a solution online (NaF reagent solution 2% from AquaPhoenix) https://catalog.aquaphoenixsci.com/...reagents-standards/sf9020-q-sodium-fluoride-2. Wonder if you think this is something that will work?

Loudwolf sodium flouride is what it use. It's powder but all it needs is a digital scale and some rodi water.