Fin Rot in Established Fish

kkgaskin90 · Jun 21, 2015

I had a trio of Anthias in QT. I mistook fin rot for bullying, therefore introducing fin rot to my display tank. The three Anthias did not make it, as it took me way too long to figure out what was going on. One died in QT of an Ammonia spike (completely my fault. Dumb dumb dumb mistake), then the other two several weeks later.
Now, 3 weeks after the last Anthias died, my Hippo Tang looks like it has fin rot. I was reading Humblefish's write up on bacterial infections, and that seems to indicate that this fish *should* survive, since my tank parameters are all pristine and the fish eats well. Any thoughts? Advice?

Oscaror · Jun 21, 2015

Fin rot is sad

Do fish recover from it? I saw a yellow tang which looked like a half eaten waffle at my LFS about one year ago in their display, still like that

Humblefish · Jun 21, 2015

Typically, fish recover from gram positive bacterial infections via their natural immune system. Of course, maintaining pristine water conditions and feeding vitamin enriched foods helps. However, if you've introduced a gram negative bacterial strain into your DT then the fish are probably going to need antibiotic meds to assist their immune system in overcoming that. I would at the very least start soaking their food with Seachem Kanaplex, and also use Seachem Focus to bind the medication to the food and prevent it from leaching out into the water column. Run carbon as a little extra insurance policy... doing both should make it "reef safe" to use.

The problem with gram positive vs. gram negative is you never know for sure which you are dealing with without a scope ID.

kkgaskin90 · Jun 21, 2015

Awesome-thank you so much!

kkgaskin90 · Jun 30, 2015

Today is the third and final dose of the Kanaplex/Focus combination in their food. I have seen zero losses using the two combined in their food. Will that be sufficient? Im not seeing progression of the fin rot, but I'm not positive on that and not sure how long it would take to progress. All fish are eating and acting normal. Also, how long should I run carbon?

Humblefish · Jun 30, 2015

kkgaskin90 said:
Today is the third and final dose of the Kanaplex/Focus combination in their food. I have seen zero losses using the two combined in their food. Will that be sufficient? Im not seeing progression of the fin rot, but I'm not positive on that and not sure how long it would take to progress. All fish are eating and acting normal. Also, how long should I run carbon?

I would continue feeding the Kanaplex/Focus combination for 10 consecutive days and run carbon that long as well. It's just like when a Dr. prescribes you antibiotics... you don't want to stop taking them prematurely just because you're feeling better.

kkgaskin90 · Jun 30, 2015

Humblefish said:
I would continue feeding the Kanaplex/Focus combination for 10 consecutive days and run carbon that long as well. It's just like when a Dr. prescribes you antibiotics... you don't want to stop taking them prematurely just because you're feeling better.

Ah, ok. I was going off the Kanaplex directions that said "up to 3 doses"

kkgaskin90 · Jul 6, 2015

Should the rotted areas heal, or will they forever look jagged?
Tomorrow will be the tenth dose, I did the first three every other day, so should I continue until Thursday to complete 10 CONSECUTIVE doses?

Humblefish · Jul 6, 2015

kkgaskin90 said:
Should the rotted areas heal, or will they forever look jagged?
Tomorrow will be the tenth dose, I did the first three every other day, so should I continue until Thursday to complete 10 CONSECUTIVE doses?

So long as the rot hasn't reached all the way to fin's base, it should grow back. I would continue until Thursday, and then do a large WC/run carbon.

kkgaskin90 · Jul 6, 2015

Will do. Thank you!

kkgaskin90 · Jul 10, 2015

Humblefish said:
So long as the rot hasn't reached all the way to fin's base, it should grow back. I would continue until Thursday, and then do a large WC/run carbon.

I continued Kanaplex and have run Carbon. Wednesday or Thursday (I was out of town) we lost an Anthias. It had a bit of rot, but nowhere near as much as the Tang and had a fantastic appetite. I can't find a body and hubby is clueless.
Tang looks worse. So I'm not quite sure where to go from here???
This is so disappointing and frustrating :/

Humblefish · Jul 10, 2015

Are you sure you don't also have something like ich or velvet going on in the tank? Bacterial infections are often secondary to a preexisting parasitic infestation. Antibiotics will not help with that. Sorry to hear of your losses.

kkgaskin90 · Jul 10, 2015

I've quarantined everything that's gone in. There's no white specks or velvet appearance, they are all eating like hogs, and my water tested fine Tuesday (I'll check it again today). I'm at a loss. I'll take a picture of the Tang when I get home to see if there are any other ideas. I'm open to try anything.

_Alex_ · Jul 10, 2015

If I cam find the bottle of antibiotics we used for it I'll let you know. It woke great. Our tang lost almost all his tail and this stopped it and he fully recovered.

kkgaskin90 · Jul 10, 2015

Alright, here it is:

Humblefish · Jul 11, 2015

That's HLLE, not bacterial fin rot. More info below.

Head & Lateral Line Erosion "HLLE":

Symptoms - HLLE literally looks as though the skin is rotting or peeling off the fish. Affected areas usually include the face and lateral line, and may be white in color.

Treatment options - This is more of a condition than an actual disease. Since no one can agree on the exact cause, all you can do is address all of the following theories regarding HLLE:

1) Stray voltage - Use a titanium ground probe & test your tank for stray voltage.
2) Running carbon - Don’t use it, or use only premium grade carbon.
3) Nutritional deficiency - Feed high quality nutritional foods. Some have had success reversing the effects of HLLE by soaking food in “fish vitamins” and also feeding nori.

Humblefish · Jul 11, 2015

Once you have addressed all of the issues above, I would start soaking his food in vitamin supplements (Selcon, Zoecon, Vita-chem) on a daily basis. Some have had success reversing HLLE by doing this. See links below.

Before: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=888778

After: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1786961

kkgaskin90 · Jul 11, 2015

Ok. I thought HLLE when it all started but since other fish had fin issues I switched my theory to fin rot.
I'll look in to stray voltage further as I've addressed everything else. I removed and replaced a heater I thought may have been the culprit, but apparently not since it's still getting worse.
Does HLLE affect the fins like that?