Fin rot?

[vetteguy53081]

I wouldn’t add Petco product either. I would be more comfortable with melafix

 

[siniang]

I wouldn’t add Petco product either. I would be more comfortable with melafix

They didn't have Melafix.

 

[vetteguy53081]

They didn't have Melafix.

Petsmart generally has it

 

[siniang]

No Petsmart here. As I mentioned, options are VERY limited on my island.

If I can get my hands on Melafix (will check one more local pet store today) - should I wait another day to make sure the Imagiterium product has dissipated enough before adding it? Can one overdose with those kind of things? They're supposedly plant-based?

Can I use Melafix and Furan-2 simultaneously?

 

[siniang]

Should I also add some Stressguard? Just in case?

Hungry and still eating humu doing humu things. Which at least is good, I suppose.

 

[siniang]

I may be able to get Melafix, today.

I dosed the "Bacterial Infection Remedy" (Petco brand) yesterday at 3pm. It says to re-apply every other day.

I'm going to do a 35% water change late this afternoon when I get home after work, maybe 4:30-50ish?

1) Do you guys think I can already add Melafix despite still having some of the other tonic in the system? Should I wait till tomorrow?

2) I removed my filters because they contain carbon and the instructions said to remove them because carbon would filter out the essential oils in the tonic. Should I put them back in now to help get it out of the water faster?

3) Fish is acting fine and eating happily. Fin looks even more frayed today, but - and I'm aware this may be just wishful thinking - I think the larger white part <might> be a little fainter (still lots of milky parts though). Should I hold off with the Furan-2 and do the 3 days Melafix first and see what happens or should I play it safe and add Furan-2 as soon as I get it?

4) Add additional Stresscoat? Would need to buy it, and if you say it's worthless, I'll safe that money.

Please, any advice is appreciated, I'm so afraid of making it worse.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Ok, as soon as I'll get the Furan-2, I'll start treatment.

Is there anything I need to consider except following the instructions? What parameters to watch? Anything I can do to help my fish through it? From what I understand AB treatment is hard on the fish too? What about the blenny that doesn't show any signs of bacterial infections?

I don't want to make it worse while trying to make it better

Fish is up and awake this morning, behaving normal. Haven't fed yet, still waking up.

Some antibiotics can harm your biofilter, so it is always a good idea to monitor your ammonia level when treating with them. Most of the common aquarium antibiotics are pretty mild to the fish.
Is the trigger still eating ok?
Jay

 

[siniang]

Is the trigger still eating ok?

Yes, eating like a champ. Keeps sifting sand looking for another snack. His overall behavior is completely normal.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I may be able to get Melafix, today.

I dosed the "Bacterial Infection Remedy" (Petco brand) yesterday at 3pm. It says to re-apply every other day.

I'm going to do a 35% water change late this afternoon when I get home after work, maybe 4:30-50ish?

1) Do you guys think I can already add Melafix despite still having some of the other tonic in the system? Should I wait till tomorrow?

2) I removed my filters because they contain carbon and the instructions said to remove them because carbon would filter out the essential oils in the tonic. Should I put them back in now to help get it out of the water faster?

3) Fish is acting fine and eating happily. Fin looks even more frayed today, but - and I'm aware this may be just wishful thinking - I think the larger white part <might> be a little fainter (still lots of milky parts though). Should I hold off with the Furan-2 and do the 3 days Melafix first and see what happens or should I play it safe and add Furan-2 as soon as I get it?

4) Add additional Stresscoat? Would need to buy it, and if you say it's worthless, I'll safe that money.

Please, any advice is appreciated, I'm so afraid of making it worse.

Don’t double up on the melafix and the tonic, they may both be melaleuca extract.
Stress coat is not a medication, it has been sold for decades, but there is no evidence that I have seen showing it has antibiotic properties. I would not use it as it could affect your other medications.
Jay

 

[siniang]

So...should I not switch to Melafix at all and just continue with the tonic? Or wait until tomorrow PM when the tonic should be re-applied according to instructions ("every other day") and then switch to Melafix?

Should I wait with the WC until tomorrow, then?

API says their products can be used simultaneously (i.e. Melafix and Furan-2 would be fine, from my understanding), but I'm reluctant to do the tonic and Furan-2 at the same time?

Ok. No Stresscoat.

Anyone else with any suggestions/help? Please I need to know what the best strategy is at this point. I'm terrified of making it worse.

@GoVols ?

@Jay Hemdal Also, THANK YOU SO MUCH for your help so far. You can't imagine how much I appreciate this.

 

[siniang]

There's also conflicting information here: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/bacterial-infections.191511/

In the first post it says, gram-negative infections are most common infections in marine fish, but in a reply further down it says in established tanks, infections are more likely to be gram-positive, and gram-negative would be in new fish fresh from the ocean?

Can someone clarify?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

There's also conflicting information here: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/bacterial-infections.191511/

In the first post it says, gram-negative infections are most common infections in marine fish, but in a reply further down it says in established tanks, infections are more likely to be gram-positive, and gram-negative would be in new fish fresh from the ocean?

Can someone clarify?

That simply isn't true. Almost all of the external pathogenic bacteria in marine fish are gram negative. Mycobacteria, another common internal pathogen is gram negative and acid-fast.

Strep and Staph infections are gram positive, but I've never seen them in fish. The few gram positive bacteria that I know of that infect fish are internal, and some are anaerobic.

Jay

 

[siniang]

Thank you for the clarification @Jay Hemdal !

If gram-negative bacteria are most likely the ones causing infections, are so virulent and can and do kill within 24-48hrs, how come you recommend holding off on antibiotics if possible? Just curious and always learning.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Many cases of "bacterial disease" are actually not severe infections at all, just a tattered fin or a dislodged scale. Flukes and Uronema are also frequently misdiagnosed as bacterial disease, when in fact they are not. Rushing to dose antibiotics isn't always the best course of action. That article says these infections can kill within "24-48 hours", but that depends entirely on what point the diagnosis is made. I think you caught this pretty soon. In many cases, home aquarists miss the first symptoms, so indeed, by the time they notice it, the fish IS almost gone.

Jay

 

[siniang]

Thank you for the explanation @Jay Hemdal !

I just got Furan-2!!

PLEASE ANYONE ADVICE!

I’ll be home around 4:30 today. Will do a 35% water change.

Can I start Furan-2 immediately this evening or should I wait till tomorrow just to give the tonic a chance to dissipate some more?

Can I even start in the evening or will it have a harder impact when the fish are sleeping (slower metabolism)?

Trigger was eagerly eating his lunch. Still acting his usual self.

But, and I may just start getting paranoid at this point, I found a little discoloration on his side under his fin. Not white, it’s hard to see. Not sure if white. Might be a scratch from rocks or some encounter with the blenny... or it could be the infection taking over to his body?

 

[siniang]

Anyone please?!?

I noticed some white patches on the base of his fin, so really leaning towards starting the Furan-2 this evening.

But I'm concerned of the remainder of the tonic in the water as well as them sleeping

 

[siniang]

I decided to start dosing the Furan-2. Will keep the lights on just a little longer. But I just didn't want to take any chances with this, if anything I don't want him to lose his entire caudal fin to this. While I don't think it got worse over the day, today, I still see those milky streaks reaching all the way to the base as well as those small faint white patches at the base of his tail and whatever it is under/next to his pec fin. Better safe than sorry and better treating a fish that's still in good spirits than trying to safe one that's already deteriorating.

He was eating his krill snack I gave him after the WC (and before starting the Furan) as normal.

I had the filters running with filter cartridges for another 1.5-2hrs after the water change to help eliminate some more of the tonic.

I really hope I didn't make a mistake.

(I noticed it said the Furan-2 will turn the water cloudy...it didn't? I used the right amount of packages...so... a little confused. Did I miss anything? I removed the filter cartridges and the ammonia/phosphate media as instructed)

For what it's worth ( @Jay Hemdal ) I'm also generally reluctant with medication, especially antibiotics and try to wait and see if things clear on their own - because with most smaller ailments they do (this humu has had more than its share of scrapes and scratches already). But again...since the fin definitely is rotting away... not risking it. Eventhough I'm kind of scared by all those reports that say antibiotic medication, especially Furan-2, is rather hard on fish.

 

[siniang]

Are parts of the fin that are already milky bound to die/erode off or can they recover/be safed now that antibiotic treatment has started?

How fast should I see improvement and how should it look? If effective, it'll obviously take time to regrow the fin... so how will I know whether the meds work(ed)?

 

[siniang]

This evening:

Sorry I can't get better quality. He doesn't like me getting close with the phone...it would be even worse with my actual camera. The eyes aren't cloudy, they look like that at the right angle and the image quality makes it look cloudy. I hope... I hope I'm not mistaken.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Is the trigger's eyes cloudy? I can't tell from the pictures. Antibiotics generally take 3 to 5 days to slow the issue down and see things start to revert. Unless the fin base is involved, the fins will grow back.

Jay