Growth on Fin

[Reefer1978]

Hi folks. Would appreciate if and treatment recommendation. I took multiple pictures to get many angles and will add a video.

 

[Reefer1978]

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi folks. Would appreciate if and treatment recommendation. I took multiple pictures to get many angles and will add a video.

This is possibly an isopod and if so, give fish a 5 minute freshwater dip same temperature as display tank and it should fall off

 

[Reefer1978]

This is possibly an isopod and if so, give fish a 5 minute freshwater dip same temperature as display tank and it should fall off

It started as a tiny dot. Can that still be an isopod?

 

[vetteguy53081]

It started as a tiny dot. Can that still be an isopod?

I need a better pic but can be Lymphocystis which is viral and of no harm

 

[Reefer1978]

It started as a tiny dot. Can that still be an isopod?

I need a better pic but can be Lymphocystis which is viral and of no harm

Lympho is usually white, which this is not.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Lympho is usually white, which this is not.

Lympho is white, gray or tan. Please post a video under bright white lighting, no blue for clear id

 

[W31Olds]

Reefer, I looked at your Video and is there also a growth on Dosal Fin? We need some background info.
Are these fish in QT and what meds are in the Tank and for how long?
Did your Neptune have these growths when you got him?
What is the Ammonia Level?
Copper Meds and poor Water Quality can cause issues with Lympho.
These are very expensive fish so you may what to isolate him to a separate Tank.
Can you post a couple of additional pics?
@Jay Hemdal

 

[Reefer1978]

 

[Reefer1978]

Posted a few more videos. They are in the QT, went through copper, prazi will be next. Spots developed in my tank and yes I see 2 more developing.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I presume the fish is newly acquired? If so, 100% this is Lymphocystis. The emperor angel has a bit of it on its tail.

You won't need to treat this, it is a self-limiting viral disease and will go away on its own in a month or so, although it may get worse before it gets better, especially on the emperor.

Here is a write-up I did on this:


Lymphocystis (cauliflower disease)

This is a common viral disease of marine, brackish, and certain freshwater fishes (usually those with marine relatives: glassfish and rainbowfish). It is a chronic (long-lasting) but self-limiting (usually going away on its own) syndrome caused by an iridovirus. The virus causes hypertrophy (enlargement) of the epithelial cells of a fish’s skin and fins.

Initial symptoms consist of off-white to gray nodules on the fish that spread and grow larger over a timeframe of 10 to 90 days. Commonly, when a Lymphocystis nodule forms on a pectoral fin, a new nodule will soon begin to form on the part of the fish that is brushed by the fin, indicating that direct contact can be a mode of spreading the infection.

When Lymphocystis first starts, the small growths can be misdiagnosed as a protozoan infection, such as Cryptocaryon, or even a bacterial infection. The fact that the lesions are long-lasting and do not cause the fish to become acutely ill rules out these more virulent diseases.

Since Lymphocystis is most often seen in newly imported fishes, capture and transport stresses are often mentioned as the stressors that allow this disease to take hold. While this may be true, it may also be that the cause is actually exposure to other infected fish in the aquarium systems of the exporter, importer, or retail suppliers. In any event, it is extremely rare for a fish held in captivity for more than four to six months to suddenly develop this disease.

Treatment with copper sulfate has also been implicated in the development of Lymphocystis in marine fish. The connection is actually not very clear, in that copper sulfate is most often used on newly imported fishes, and those are the ones that develop the disease most often.

Lymphocystis infections can sometimes become more serious, covering large areas of a fish’s body and even interfering with proper feeding if the cell growth involves areas around the mouth. In rare instances, the virus can also cause enlargement of the cells of internal organs, especially in marine fishes (Wolf 1988). This has the potential of causing serious, yet difficult-to-identify diseases in marine fishes.

A variety of cures have been suggested for this disease over the years. Some public aquarists have reported that a reduction in the animal’s environmental stress level will help reduce the severity of an infection. Others have reported that treatment with a mixture of malachite green and formalin (Quick Cure, Formalite, etc.) helps limit the spread of the lesions. Since both of these compounds can damage an aquarium’s bio-filter, and since both are toxic to fish, care must be taken if this method is attempted. By far, the most commonly recommended treatment involves surgically removing the hypertrophied skin cells, followed with a topical antibiotic to hopefully prevent secondary bacterial infection.

The issue with all these suggested treatments is that because Lymphocystis is usually self-limiting, remission of the disease will almost always occur in spite of any treatment undertaken. Additionally, cutting the tissue to remove the lesions releases viral particles into the aquarium, potentially spreading the disease to other fish. Finally, any time a fish is handled, there is a risk to its health due to injury or infection.

The general advice is to never intercede with a Lymphocystis infection—just let it run its course. The only exception might be if the fish develops a severe form of the disease, and its mouth develops lesions that might inhibit it from feeding. Even in those extreme cases, surgery around the mouth will also cause the fish to stop feeding, so it may be better to just wait it out (Hemdal 2014).

Interestingly, aquarists do not seem to report Lymphocystis infections in their fish as often as they did in the 1970’s and 1980’s. Anecdotally, the disease does not seem as common in public aquariums overall as it used to be. The reason(s) for this change are unclear. It may be that more aquarists are familiar with the syndrome, know that it is usually self-limiting, and therefore do not report it. It may also be that marine fish traveling through the commercial supply chain are being handled better, with less stress, making the outbreaks less common.

The table below (adapted from Hemdal 2014) lists the marine aquarium fish groups known to be vulnerable to the Lymphocystis virus (+ = can occur, ++ = commonly infects, +++ = extremely common).

Angelfish (marine)	Pomacanthidae	++
Blennies	Blenniidae	+
Boxfish	Ostraciidae	++
Butterflyfish	Chaetodontidae	++
Damselfish, clownfish	Pomacentridae	+
Dottybacks	Pseudochromidae	+
Gobies	Gobiidae	+
Groupers	Serranidae	+
Hamlets	Hypoplectrus spp.	+++
Moorish idol	Zanclidae	++
Porcupine fish	Diodontidae	+
Rabbitfish	Siganidae	+
Royal gramma	Serranidae	+++
Scorpionfish, lionfish	Scorpaeniformes	+
Tangs, surgeonfish	Acanthuridae	+
Triggerfish	Balistidae	++
Wrasses	Labridae	++

No doubt Lymphocystis will infect marine fish other than those species on this list, but it’s a good starting point of known carriers of this disease. Some marine aquarium fish are so commonly affected with Lymphocystis that diagnosis can be made just knowing that they are the species involved. If an aquarist says they see a growth on a royal gramma, copperband butterflyfish, or hamlet that they just acquired, it is very likely to be Lymphocystis. The only freshwater fish that are prone to this disease are those that are from a family that has marine origins, such as the glassfish, Chanda and possibly Athernidae – the rainbowfishes.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Lympho is usually white, which this is not.

Lymphocystis grows in color based on the skin cells that develop it. Often it is off-white, but gray is very common, even darker. Other colors can develop as well, depending on the fish's coloration.

 

[JumboShrimp]

(What type of fish it that??... it's a beauty.)

 

[W31Olds]

I have had Lympho before and Copper seems to make it worse. However, It usually clears up after the Copper is removed. Make sure you keep a close eye on Ammonia unless your Qt Tank is Cycled.
Beautiful Neptune, BTW. Just make sure you don't have any small fish in your DT. With that mouth he looks like he could do some damage.

 

[Reefer1978]

Lymphocystis grows in color based on the skin cells that develop it. Often it is off-white, but gray is very common, even darker. Other colors can develop as well, depending on the fish's coloration.

Thank you @Jay Hemdal . You are absolutely correct about Imperator, he was covered with lympho, but, it was completely white in color. One thing I thought about lympho. it has to look like califlower. This patch looks very smooth to me.

(What type of fish it that??... it's a beauty.)

Neptune Grouper, and I agree fully, she's a beauty.

I have had Lympho before and Copper seems to make it worse. However, It usually clears up after the Copper is removed. Make sure you keep a close eye on Ammonia unless your Qt Tank is Cycled.
Beautiful Neptune, BTW. Just make sure you don't have any small fish in your DT. With that mouth he looks like he could do some damage.

Yep, I have it covered, The emperator is the only small fish in there, I am hoping they grow at the same pace and Neptune does not outgrow it.

 

[Reefer1978]

@Jay Hemdal I also wanted to respond to your previous comment, and the fish has been in the system for about 5 weeks. Went through copper, finished, I am about to do 2 rounds of Prazi. I see occasional flashing. And 2 similar spots showed up on other fins recently, not sure if you could see them on the video. They start as a tiny spot, and grow.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

@Jay Hemdal I also wanted to respond to your previous comment, and the fish has been in the system for about 5 weeks. Went through copper, finished, I am about to do 2 rounds of Prazi. I see occasional flashing. And 2 similar spots showed up on other fins recently, not sure if you could see them on the video. They start as a tiny spot, and grow.

The grouper may well have other issues, but the large fin lesion is viral Lymphocystis. The smaller, growing lesions likely are as well, but I can’t see them. The flashing is unrelated, and as you know, could be flukes.