Help! My Dragon Soul torch is looking bad!

[NichMusc]

So recently (29th of Jan 2023) I managed to get my hands on a dragon soul torch head (which was splitting). The torch coral was very healthy in the reef tank of the original owner. From the second it was placed in my reef tank the torch coral never fully extended.

First call of blame was lighting and flow. However the light intensity was decreased through acclimatation mode and even the torch was introduced in a low flow area. On the 7th of Feb, I caught my sand-sifting goby picking at one of the tentacles, and the fish was moved into the sump.

Something which I also noticed, the tissue of the torch seemed to split down (by creating a small hole and later on ripping at the bottom of the tissue.. (Not sure if you guys can understand this statement). This makes me think whether the coral is splitting hence why it is not extending.

I have attached some photos of the coral when it was introduced and also photos of the coral yesterday.

Parameters as of 07/02/2023:
Temp 24.5 Celsius or 76 Fahrenheit
Salinity: 1.026
Alk: 9.6 (tested again today still 9.6)
Nitrate: 5
Phosphate: 0.05
Calcium: 460
Magnesium: 1350

 

[Dave1993]

@Dburr1014 got any ideas?

​

 

[Dburr1014]

So recently (29th of Jan 2023) I managed to get my hands on a dragon soul torch head (which was splitting). The torch coral was very healthy in the reef tank of the original owner. From the second it was placed in my reef tank the torch coral never fully extended.

First call of blame was lighting and flow. However the light intensity was decreased through acclimatation mode and even the torch was introduced in a low flow area. On the 7th of Feb, I caught my sand-sifting goby picking at one of the tentacles, and the fish was moved into the sump.

Something which I also noticed, the tissue of the torch seemed to split down (by creating a small hole and later on ripping at the bottom of the tissue.. (Not sure if you guys can understand this statement). This makes me think whether the coral is splitting hence why it is not extending.

I have attached some photos of the coral when it was introduced and also photos of the coral yesterday.

Parameters as of 07/02/2023:
Temp 24.5 Celsius or 76 Fahrenheit
Salinity: 1.026
Alk: 9.6 (tested again today still 9.6)
Nitrate: 5
Phosphate: 0.05
Calcium: 460
Magnesium: 1350

When you say you had a hole in the flesh and it split down, the first thing that comes to my mind is damaged during transport. It doesn't take much to poke through the flesh if it jarred up against the side of a container.

How close are all your numbers to the tank that it came from? And also par and Flow, is it comparable to where it came from?

Can you get some pictures of the side where the hole and the rip in the flesh is?

 

[NichMusc]

When you say you had a hole in the flesh and it split down, the first thing that comes to my mind is damaged during transport. It doesn't take much to poke through the flesh if it jarred up against the side of a container.

How close are all your numbers to the tank that it came from? And also par and Flow, is it comparable to where it came from?

Can you get some pictures of the side where the hole and the rip in the flesh is?

With regards to damage during transport, I picked the coral myself and the car ride was maybe 30 minutes away (Although it could be a possible factor to keep in mind)

The original owner stated that it was in a high flow area and supposedly high par (unsure regarding the actual par). I will ask tomorrow to check if they are atleast comparable

I have attached two photos of the ‘rip’. I have circled the area which was a hole before. I can also still see a bit of hanging tissue on the left side of the tissue (marked red).

 

[Pistondog]

Alk might be higher than where he came from.
Hope he will adjust.

 

[Pistondog]

Welcome to reef2reef.
Hope he settles in.
I got one on ebay maybe 2.5 years ago.
15+ heads now

 

[Dburr1014]

Definitely keep an eye on it.
Is your alk a lot higher or just a little? If it's less than one dkh don't worry about it.
I think putting it in a little bit less flow is a good idea but just make sure it's still random so it will sway way back and forth.
As far as the par, I would try to keep that a little lower than your friends tank. Spectrum wise it could be much different in your tank unless you're running the same lights with the same settings. A healing torch will have to get used to the tank changes and heal, that's a lot of energy to use up. Keep your po4 at minimum where you're at now, a little higher might do it some good. LPS like tanks a little dirtier, IMO.
The rest of your numbers are spot on just keep them stable.
Let us know how it goes after a few days.

EDIT: almost forgot about the pics you posted. It's really hard to see where the skeleton ends in the flesh starts but in the pictures when I see is green is skeleton that's been exposed for quite some time for stuff to be growing on it. So the flesh doesn't really look like it's extended down too far which is what I like to see in a really healthy specimen. My hammers are at least an inch to an inch and a half off the head It's All Flesh. So anyway keep an eye on that area make sure the flesh doesn't recede any higher up to the head. If it does you may have to intervene with some kind of a dip. And make sure no brown jelly starts forming.

 

[NichMusc]

Previous owner just got back to me. He stated that the coral was kept at a minimum of 300 par and in moderate to high flow. The alk levels in his tank are kept at around 8-8.5. I am currently doubting the readings of my hannah dkh checker, and will be buying a manual dkh test kit to double-check, however my dkh is still stable.

Earlier this morning I saw the torch more deflated then before (lights were off and yesterday I spot-fed reefroids). I did not see any more tissue recession up till now.

I will keep you guys posted with more pictures (as the lights turn on) and the progress of any updates, improvements or regression.

Test results on 11/02/2023:
Temp: 24.6
Salinity: 1.026
Alk: 9.5
Nitrate: 5

Will be checking PO4, Mag and Calcium later on the day.

 

[NichMusc]

@everyone Update!

I would say that the torch is looking worse. Just went to check on it and to my surpise I found more tissue holes on the head.

I wonder if any other reefers out there experienced anything like this?
Could it be a parasite or maybe fish bites? Or I m catching the toch coral at opportunistic moments before receding further up?
Sorry for the non-filtered photos however I did not have my lenses at hand.

 

[NichMusc]

Definitely keep an eye on it.
Is your alk a lot higher or just a little? If it's less than one dkh don't worry about it.
I think putting it in a little bit less flow is a good idea but just make sure it's still random so it will sway way back and forth.
As far as the par, I would try to keep that a little lower than your friends tank. Spectrum wise it could be much different in your tank unless you're running the same lights with the same settings. A healing torch will have to get used to the tank changes and heal, that's a lot of energy to use up. Keep your po4 at minimum where you're at now, a little higher might do it some good. LPS like tanks a little dirtier, IMO.
The rest of your numbers are spot on just keep them stable.
Let us know how it goes after a few days.

EDIT: almost forgot about the pics you posted. It's really hard to see where the skeleton ends in the flesh starts but in the pictures when I see is green is skeleton that's been exposed for quite some time for stuff to be growing on it. So the flesh doesn't really look like it's extended down too far which is what I like to see in a really healthy specimen. My hammers are at least an inch to an inch and a half off the head It's All Flesh. So anyway keep an eye on that area make sure the flesh doesn't recede any higher up to the head. If it does you may have to intervene with some kind of a dip. And make sure no brown jelly starts forming.

Didn’t know how to grab your attention!
i wonder what you would suggest

 

[Dburr1014]

Didn’t know how to grab your attention!
i wonder what you would suggest

What fish, crabs, shrimp, snails are in your system?

I think you should do a dip and look for pests if you don't think it's from bitting.
Do you have Bayer?

I can't really see anything with the blue pics. Need to shine a flashlight on it or turn on the white lights.

 

[NichMusc]

What fish, crabs, shrimp, snails are in your system?

I think you should do a dip and look for pests if you don't think it's from bitting.
Do you have Bayer?

I can't really see anything with the blue pics. Need to shine a flashlight on it or turn on the white lights.

Current fish in display : 2 clowns and 1 bangaii
Cleaner shrimp
2 hermit crabs
Cerith snail
Sand sifting starfish
1 tuxedo uechin
Couple if trochus snails, somatella snails, nassarius snails

We are not able to import bayers reagent in Malta. However I do have seachem iodine dip.

Quite difficult taking photos with the polyps in the way, I hope these are much clearer!

 

[Dburr1014]

List looks okay.

Do you have another coral dip? Like revive or simular? Look for any post that fall off.
Dip in that then rinse and dip in iodine.

 

[NichMusc]

Dips done, torch looks ticked off. No visible pests have fallen off.
Just took a look at the reef, and noticed an asterina starfish on the stalk of the torch. Removed kust to be safe, will be updating you tomorrow afternoon!

List looks okay.

Do you have another coral dip? Like revive or simular? Look for any post that fall off.
Dip in that then rinse and dip in iodine.

 

[Dburr1014]

Dips done, torch looks ticked off. No visible pests have fallen off.
Just took a look at the reef, and noticed an asterina starfish on the stalk of the torch. Removed kust to be safe, will be updating you tomorrow afternoon!

Fingers crossed

 

[coralfishgirl]

I'm assuming it died? Sorry I'm late to the conversation, but for anyone else who stumbles on this, I would have said your temperature was the problem.

It seems most posts I read, people will have you going bonkers about this or that parameter, or dips for disease, par, flow, and most of the time none of it helps. And, of course, if your tank is less than a year, it's "just too young and simply cannot sustain such coral." Most of the time I notice the person with the issues has their temp anywhere from 76 to 78 F. I have never seen anybody mention temp being a problem at these ranges. Ever.

In my experience I have torches and other lps/softies which I thought were a great success, yet my hammer was sad compared to what it looked like when I first started. I read everything I could and moved it all over my tank. More light, less light, on sand bottom, more flow, less flow. No change. Tested parameters, made tweaks, no change. I bought another hammer and it started dying immediately. I though it was just stress from shipping. Everything else in the the shipment seemed to do great, though. Including two torches. Anyway, the hammer lost one whole head. Nothing but skeleton remained. I was just waiting for the other to die. I dipped it in an iodine dip which really didn't do anything. Then, I started having issues with a candycane. It's skin started receding. My temp was about 78F. I never came here asking for help because I knew immediately (from all my research) I would simply have been blasted on my tank not being mature enough.

Then I saw a youtube video from a guy whose reef tank I greatly admire. His channel isn't about reefing. He's not a professional. Just a guy who's enjoyed the hobby for many years, sharing his experiences and what works for him. He talked about temperature and how he usually kept his tank at 82F. He talked about other stuff, too, but I was thinking what a huge difference there was between his temp and mine, so I decided to start with that. That night I gave my heater a good bump and went to bed. The next morning my jaw hit the floor. All my corals more than doubled in size and looked gorgeous! Even the torches and duncans which I thought had already been thriving. The temp was about 79. I've bumped it closer to 80 since then. Fish are also happier. Some were always hiding. Since bumping up the temp they are all swimming in the open now.

Anyway, just thought I'd share my story. Sorry if this went a bit long. Just food for thought for anyone perusing old posts for info like I do.

 

[NichMusc]

Actually! The coral survived, it is now bigger than ever with 8 heads and counting

What I did:
Provide more indirect and random flow.
Dosed a bit of nitrate every day until it was at an acceptable level.
Left it alone without moving, no changing flow or changing light schedule.