Help- Need ID On Mystery Algae

[OstentatiousOctopus]

Hey reefers,
I need help with an algae/bacteria ID. I’m at my wit’s end- nothing seems to match 100%.
TL;DR: 664 gallon inter-plumbed trough system in retail setting. Bubbly/turfy green/brown eyesore appeared about the same time as nutrients bottoming out a few months ago. Stabilizing chems, turning off white/red spectrums, and adding a UV did not help. Remains over night but does seem to get worse during the day. Black outs are not an option. Photos, videos, and chem log attached.

Background:
This is a very old and established 664 gallon trough system in a retail store for selling coral. Filtration includes filter socks into a refugium (no macro), bio-tower, UV (recent), and skimmer (offline). We removed macro and turned the skimmer off July ‘24 because the system was too clean- we got and cured dino’s more than once over the last few years prior to that. We dose seachem nitrogen, fusion 1, and fusion 2. Until recently we fed Fuel and phytoplankton (or reef roids) multiple times weekly. About 3ish months ago there was a malfunction with the dosing pumps and nutrients bottomed out in addition to calc/alk becoming unstable. Around that time we noticed a dino-like growth taking over one of the 3 inter-plumbed troughs. We corrected and stabilized chems as quickly as we could- there a lot of challenges with a revolving staff and frequent livestock change- but the algae persisted and started to spread to the other two troughs. We adjusted light spectrum to be nearly full blue, no white or red, and finally got a UV running 2 weeks ago but there has been no change. We scrub the egg crate/siphon into socks every day but it grows back extremely quickly and persists over night (though it does seem to get worse during the day). Dosing bacteria did not appear to have any effect.

Once we finally got a microscope in I took a look at a water sample using this method: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/helpful-method-for-identifying-dinoflagellates.216508/
But nothing developed in the water as described there nor did I see anything with the microscope. I put samples of algae (included that which was scrubbed off, floating on surface, or yanked directly from surfaces) under the microscope and all that is attached is from those observations. I’ve also attached photos of the egg crate under white lights, as well as our chem logs from the last few months. The pic of the egg crate is first thing in the morning before the lights even came on- I turned them on for the photo.

My suspects include large cell amphidinium, lynbya, calothrix, or maybe some species of bryopsis- but none seem to fit all the characteristics, particularly the microscopy.
Keep in mind that black outs are not an option- we are open 7 days a week and don’t currently have an alternative system for the coral to be moved to. The lights must be on 10am-8pm. Please help me ID and treat!

 

[Lasse]

The pic of the egg crate is first thing in the morning before the lights even came on- I turned them on for the photo.

If I look att the eggcrate pictures - it seem like it is gas bubbles all around. Is this the case - gas bubbles already in the morning?

But the light has been out since 8 pm the day before? And just light for the photo session? Is it 100 % black during night? The whole night?

The algae samples seems to be a mix of everything evil I know about.

How to treat this - to be honest - I do not know.

The light must be on but does it need to be on high intensity? Is the light for growing or sell the corals?

Is it possible to prepare a new egg crater system for one tank. Soak this in water with bacteria (and some organic carbon) for some days and after that - just switch out the egg craters in one tank. Limit the light as much as possible for a week and see was happening.

I would let the skimmer on if you run UV-C - something must take care of possibly killed bacteria and algae

But gas bubbles in the morning ......

Sincerely Lasse

 

[OstentatiousOctopus]

If I look att the eggcrate pictures - it seem like it is gas bubbles all around. Is this the case - gas bubbles already in the morning?

But the light has been out since 8 pm the day before? And just light for the photo session? Is it 100 % black during night? The whole night?

The algae samples seems to be a mix of everything evil I know about.

How to treat this - to be honest - I do not know.

The light must be on but does it need to be on high intensity? Is the light for growing or sell the corals?

Is it possible to prepare a new egg crater system for one tank. Soak this in water with bacteria (and some organic carbon) for some days and after that - just switch out the egg craters in one tank. Limit the light as much as possible for a week and see was happening.

I would let the skimmer on if you run UV-C - something must take care of possibly killed bacteria and algae

But gas bubbles in the morning ......

Sincerely Lasse

Hi Lasse,
Yes all the lights in the room turn off between 8/9pm every night. It's not pitch black but very close.
The lights are primarily for merchandising the coral, I can turn down the intensity a little but not much.
Moving the coral or the egg crate is not an option unfortunately, we recently dismantled our coral farm/quarantine in preparation for building a new one (terrible timing!). What evil ID's have you made in the sample?

 

[Lasse]

What worry me most is these bubbles already before light on - can you confirm that they are gas bubbles - not bubble algae?.

If it is bubble algae - there is both crabs and large hermits that eat them. Once - a friend of me had an stunning aquarium but it got infested of bubble algae - he get a large red-haired hermit - probably Dardanus megistos. It just slaughter the bubble algae but it also refurnished the aquarium - move some corals. We also use this hermit in a set up like yours - yes it remove some of the corals but we could place them back when the hermit cleaned up the actual space.

In the algae sample - it looks like it is a mix of Cyanobacteria and many algae forms but I´m not sure. Do you have any schools or institutions in the neighbourhood that can help you with a proper identification.

I would test a biological approach first - but both peroxide and fluconazole have been used by others but in this case with much of corals I would be very careful and not use it in the first run. Have you test a sea hare or hermits as I mentioned before?

One way could be to in a mechanical way clean small parts of the egg craters each day. Using a toothbrush dipped in peroxid. Test in one tank.

Another test you can do is to temporary move corals from let us say an aera length of a meter in one of the tanks. Take a a black but rather thin plastic sheet (black garbage bags as an example) that cover the eggcrate in that area. Make a hole for the corals and place them back. Be sure you have a good circulation above the egg crates (and below too) After a week or so - remove the plastic and clean up the egg craters.

The problem IMO is that even if the bloom was caused by low nutrients - the biomass of the current unwanted organisms is so large that it will completely outcompete "better" organisms in the fight for available cultivation space even if the nutritional situation improves.

Sincerely Lasse

 

[OstentatiousOctopus]

@Lasse I'm certain it's not bubble algae (unfortunately). There is a substantial population of hermits, tangs, and snails already, but I'll consider throwing a sea hare in a trough just to see what happens, in addition to some of the experimentation you suggested. Do you think dosing bacteria, pods, and/or silicates would be helpful to try and outcompete more?

 

[Freenow54]

If I look att the eggcrate pictures - it seem like it is gas bubbles all around. Is this the case - gas bubbles already in the morning?

But the light has been out since 8 pm the day before? And just light for the photo session? Is it 100 % black during night? The whole night?

The algae samples seems to be a mix of everything evil I know about.

How to treat this - to be honest - I do not know.

The light must be on but does it need to be on high intensity? Is the light for growing or sell the corals?

Is it possible to prepare a new egg crater system for one tank. Soak this in water with bacteria (and some organic carbon) for some days and after that - just switch out the egg craters in one tank. Limit the light as much as possible for a week and see was happening.

I would let the skimmer on if you run UV-C - something must take care of possibly killed bacteria and algae

But gas bubbles in the morning ......

Sincerely Lasse

It is scary to watch but I added Trochus, and Nassarius snails. The will get on your eggcrate and clean it right up, as well as get on tour coral and clean them and the plugs. I also let the small white star fish do it after killing about 5 of them because of concern of consumption but turned out ok. I was criticized for this one. I took the plugs and laid them on my rock to let the bristle worms go on them. I was told this was impossible that bristle worms don't eat algae but mine do must be vegetarian's I actually witnessed this so no one can tell me different. I will send a picture of my egg crate with my spotless frags if you like

 

[Freenow54]

It is scary to watch but I added Trochus, and Nassarius snails. The will get on your eggcrate and clean it right up, as well as get on tour coral and clean them and the plugs. I also let the small white star fish do it after killing about 5 of them because of concern of consumption but turned out ok. I was criticized for this one. I took the plugs and laid them on my rock to let the bristle worms go on them. I was told this was impossible that bristle worms don't eat algae but mine do must be vegetarian's I act

ually wit

nessed this so no one can tell me different. I will send a picture of my egg crate with my spotless frags if you like

snails results

 

[Lasse]

Can you confirm that the bubbles are gas bubbles in some way? The problem for me is that - IMO - there is only 3 types of gas bubbles that can exist in an environment like this - oxygen. nitrogen gas and hydrogen sulphide gas. The environment is however wrong for all 3. They seems to evolve even during darkness where no photosynthesis taking place. N2 forming happens in oxygen free environment and so will hydrogen sulphide do too. If it not smell rutten eggs - we probably can role out hydrogen sulphide,

Can you please clean one or two holes in the egg crate from bubble without take away the other substances just before end of the light period? In that way we maybe can see if they really are produced during darkness or if it is bubble produced during light that just stay during night.

In some way I think that the bubbles is the key to understand what´s happening.

I did a search for organisms producing oxygen in the dark - and they exist

I hate to say this - even if it is only is a test - because - IMO - products containing antibiotics should not be used in aquarium. Cut of a square or two (containing your pest) of the egg crate. Place it in a glass (or transparent plastic box) with aquarium water treated with chemiclean. The box walls should rise above the surface of the tank when you place it on the egg crate below the light. See whats happen

I was told this was impossible that bristle worms don't eat algae but mine do must be vegetarian's I actually witnessed this so no one can tell me different.

Is not totally wrong - if your growth was mainly cyanobacteria or microorganism that's can both be autotroph (use photosynthesis) and heterotroph (need to eat) - they feed on organic matter. Bristle worms also feeds on organic matter and could take the food away from other organisms



Sincerely Lasse

 

[Freenow54]

Can you confirm that the bubbles are gas bubbles in some way? The problem for me is that - IMO - there is only 3 types of gas bubbles that can exist in an environment like this - oxygen. nitrogen gas and hydrogen sulphide gas. The environment is however wrong for all 3. They seems to evolve even during darkness where no photosynthesis taking place. N2 forming happens in oxygen free environment and so will hydrogen sulphide do too. If it not smell rutten eggs - we probably can role out hydrogen sulphide,

Can you please clean one or two holes in the egg crate from bubble without take away the other substances just before end of the light period? In that way we maybe can see if they really are produced during darkness or if it is bubble produced during light that just stay during night.

In some way I think that the bubbles is the key to understand what´s happening.

I did a search for organisms producing oxygen in the dark - and they exist

I hate to say this - even if it is only is a test - because - IMO - products containing antibiotics should not be used in aquarium. Cut of a square or two (containing your pest) of the egg crate. Place it in a glass (or transparent plastic box) with aquarium water treated with chemiclean. The box walls should rise above the surface of the tank when you place it on the egg crate below the light. See whats happen


Is not totally wrong - if your growth was mainly cyanobacteria or microorganism that's can both be autotroph (use photosynthesis) and heterotroph (need to eat) - they feed on organic matter. Bristle worms also feeds on organic matter and could take the food away from other organisms



Sincerely Lasse

It really helps me because I have to carefully target feed my fish because of my what I call Baby Hughy Tang that goes after all the food as if its different and does not want to miss out. I now hold the food back, and it which is about 6 inches long will feed out of my fingers and I can pet it when its satisfied I can then feed the others. This leads to overfeeding and dozens of bristle worms clean it up