Help understanding clownfish deaths

[igorz]

Hi everyone,

I’m looking for some insight into what happened with a pair of clownfish I recently lost. I own a Waterbox Cube 25 Peninsula with about 74 liters actual water volume, cycled and running stable for several months. Other livestock (shrimp, snails, coral, macroalgae, no other fish) are doing fine. I added 2 tank-bred Amphiprion ocellaris (about 2 cm and 3 cm) a couple of weeks ago. They were overnight shipped, so I temperature acclimated them and after that put them in the display (don't have a QT).

Smaller clown colored up quickly after introduction, active, eating well. Larger clown remained pale, less active (though not lethargic), rarely ate. On one occasion (a day or two before dying) I noticed a white stringy thing hanging from its underside. It disappeared within a couple of hours.

After about a week, the larger clown was suddenly found being carried by the flow, upside down, extremely pale, and gills flaring rapidly. It died within ~30 minutes. No visible excess mucus, spots, or external damage.

The next day, the smaller clown stopped eating. It began showing buoyancy issues — listing to one side, later tilting forward. Still somewhat active. Four days after the first fish, it suddenly declined in the same way: pale, carried by flow, rapid gill movement, dead within ~30 minutes.

I didn't notice any flashing or scratching with either fish. There was no excess mucus or visible parasites on the fish at the time of death. There was no white stringy feces except for that one incident with the larger fish. Color on bot faded very quickly just before death.

I’d appreciate any thoughts on possible causes — internal parasites, bacterial infection, oxygenation issue, or something else? I’m trying to understand what went wrong before I consider another pair.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[Nano_Man]

Did you acclimatise the fish when first put in . I mean dripped them salinity temp ect
Let ask a #fishmedic

 

[igorz]

No, I did as the sellers recommended - only temp acclimation and then transferred them to my tank. This was to avoid ammonia issues because of overnight shipping.

 

[vetteguy53081]

No, I did as the sellers recommended - only temp acclimation and then transferred them to my tank. This was to avoid ammonia issues because of overnight shipping.

Seller recommended nothing. Especially if wild caught clowns, they are susceptible to Brooklynella and should be quarantined , and at minimum, given a ruby Rally Pro Bath for 60-90 minutes and then ruby rally pro used in the tank for at least 3-4 weeks especially with shipped fish.
To Float and then dump fish into tank, fish in shipped bags produce carbon dioxide and ammonia which lowers the pH of the water in the bag, and in turn makes the ammonia toxic to the fish. When you acclimate them, if not done just right, you drive off the carbon dioxide faster than you are diluting the ammonia which then raises the pH of the water in the bag, and in turn makes the residual ammonia very toxic to the fish.
Sometimes, the fish will die right in the bag. You said to avoid ammonia, and the opposite was likely done

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Hi everyone,

I’m looking for some insight into what happened with a pair of clownfish I recently lost. I own a Waterbox Cube 25 Peninsula with about 74 liters actual water volume, cycled and running stable for several months. Other livestock (shrimp, snails, coral, macroalgae, no other fish) are doing fine. I added 2 tank-bred Amphiprion ocellaris (about 2 cm and 3 cm) a couple of weeks ago. They were overnight shipped, so I temperature acclimated them and after that put them in the display (don't have a QT).

Smaller clown colored up quickly after introduction, active, eating well. Larger clown remained pale, less active (though not lethargic), rarely ate. On one occasion (a day or two before dying) I noticed a white stringy thing hanging from its underside. It disappeared within a couple of hours.

After about a week, the larger clown was suddenly found being carried by the flow, upside down, extremely pale, and gills flaring rapidly. It died within ~30 minutes. No visible excess mucus, spots, or external damage.

The next day, the smaller clown stopped eating. It began showing buoyancy issues — listing to one side, later tilting forward. Still somewhat active. Four days after the first fish, it suddenly declined in the same way: pale, carried by flow, rapid gill movement, dead within ~30 minutes.

I didn't notice any flashing or scratching with either fish. There was no excess mucus or visible parasites on the fish at the time of death. There was no white stringy feces except for that one incident with the larger fish. Color on bot faded very quickly just before death.

I’d appreciate any thoughts on possible causes — internal parasites, bacterial infection, oxygenation issue, or something else? I’m trying to understand what went wrong before I consider another pair.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

The length of time from arrival to death rules out issues with acclimation.

Was the white string coming from its anus? That is mucus feces. Did the fish breath faster towards the end?

Clownfish have some issues with internal parasites, one of which is coccidia (not treatable) of flagellate protozoans (treatment requires medicated food).

 

[igorz]

No, I did as the sellers recommended - only temp acclimation and then transferred them to my tank. This was to avoid ammonia issues because of overnight shipping.

Seller recommended nothing. Especially if wild caught clowns, they are susceptible to Brooklynella and should be quarantined , and at minimum, given a ruby Rally Pro Bath for 60-90 minutes and then ruby rally pro used in the tank for at least 3-4 weeks especially with shipped fish.
To Float and then dump fish into tank, fish in shipped bags produce carbon dioxide and ammonia which lowers the pH of the water in the bag, and in turn makes the ammonia toxic to the fish. When you acclimate them, if not done just right, you drive off the carbon dioxide faster than you are diluting the ammonia which then raises the pH of the water in the bag, and in turn makes the residual ammonia very toxic to the fish.
Sometimes, the fish will die right in the bag. You said to avoid ammonia, and the opposite was likely done

The fish were tank bred as I wrote in the message. Please at least read it before you go accusing me of things.

 

[igorz]

Hi everyone,

I’m looking for some insight into what happened with a pair of clownfish I recently lost. I own a Waterbox Cube 25 Peninsula with about 74 liters actual water volume, cycled and running stable for several months. Other livestock (shrimp, snails, coral, macroalgae, no other fish) are doing fine. I added 2 tank-bred Amphiprion ocellaris (about 2 cm and 3 cm) a couple of weeks ago. They were overnight shipped, so I temperature acclimated them and after that put them in the display (don't have a QT).

Smaller clown colored up quickly after introduction, active, eating well. Larger clown remained pale, less active (though not lethargic), rarely ate. On one occasion (a day or two before dying) I noticed a white stringy thing hanging from its underside. It disappeared within a couple of hours.

After about a week, the larger clown was suddenly found being carried by the flow, upside down, extremely pale, and gills flaring rapidly. It died within ~30 minutes. No visible excess mucus, spots, or external damage.

The next day, the smaller clown stopped eating. It began showing buoyancy issues — listing to one side, later tilting forward. Still somewhat active. Four days after the first fish, it suddenly declined in the same way: pale, carried by flow, rapid gill movement, dead within ~30 minutes.

I didn't notice any flashing or scratching with either fish. There was no excess mucus or visible parasites on the fish at the time of death. There was no white stringy feces except for that one incident with the larger fish. Color on bot faded very quickly just before death.

I’d appreciate any thoughts on possible causes — internal parasites, bacterial infection, oxygenation issue, or something else? I’m trying to understand what went wrong before I consider another pair.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

The length of time from arrival to death rules out issues with acclimation.

Was the white string coming from its anus? That is mucus feces. Did the fish breath faster towards the end?

Clownfish have some issues with internal parasites, one of which is coccidia (not treatable) of flagellate protozoans (treatment requires medicated food).

The string was more to the front, belly area, though I can’t say with certainty. Both fish did breathe faster towards the end. I didn’t notice gills before the last hour, after that they were flaring quite a bit.

 

[AAZ]

The fish were tank bred as I wrote in the message. Please at least read it before you go accusing me of things.

Did you bag float them then dump or how did you do that? I can see there being ammonia shock if done incorrectly if not just bag floated and dumped because as vette guy said. But if you kept them in a bag and let it come to temp and then just plop them in, I don't see there being an ammonia spike issue since they weren't in a pH swinging setting to allow ammonia to swing toxic.

 

[vetteguy53081]

The fish were tank bred as I wrote in the message. Please at least read it before you go accusing me of things.

You wanted insight and i gave you insight. What were you accused of?
Yes I see tank bred but mentioned " Especially with wild caught" as they were shipped and I questioned acclimation as did a couple of others and the step you took would place fish in shock, not control ammonia.
If you cant accept possibilities and then be so bitter, best to do some research
Youre welcome

 

[Jay Hemdal]

The string was more to the front, belly area, though I can’t say with certainty. Both fish did breathe faster towards the end. I didn’t notice gills before the last hour, after that they were flaring quite a bit.

So to clarify - if you didn’t see any major issues in the first few days, or if the fish got worse over time, you can ignore acclimation issues. That sort of thing causes acute, immediate problems.

Since the tank has invertebrates in it, and if they are fine, you can generally rule out water quality issues.

Since the tank is fishless, I would wait 45 days and then try again - try to get larger clowns, 2cm is pretty small. Try to buy them directly from the breeder if you can.

 

[igorz]

The string was more to the front, belly area, though I can’t say with certainty. Both fish did breathe faster towards the end. I didn’t notice gills before the last hour, after that they were flaring quite a bit.

So to clarify - if you didn’t see any major issues in the first few days, or if the fish got worse over time, you can ignore acclimation issues. That sort of thing causes acute, immediate problems.

Since the tank has invertebrates in it, and if they are fine, you can generally rule out water quality issues.

Since the tank is fishless, I would wait 45 days and then try again - try to get larger clowns, 2cm is pretty small. Try to buy them directly from the breeder if you can.

The fish were OK for the first days, the smaller one for more than a week. Then they started showing issues.
My 5 sexy shrimp, a Duncan and an assortment of snails are all actually thriving. Columbella mercatoria are even breeding in the tank.
I’ll wait with any new fish and get them larger. Can I/should I do anything else in the meantime?
Thanks for the help!

 

[viceversabrd]

I would wager they came in with brook or velvet. As Jay said, I would let the tank stay fishless for min 45 days. In the meantime set up a QT order another pair of clowns and treat . There are numerous QT prophylactic treatment protocols available online. This type of stuff would always happen to me (random fish deaths) until I started QTing everything and QTing and treating every fish. If you don't want to QT order from a QT vendor like Dr. Reef. This is the method that I follow https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/how-to-quarantine.232/

 

[Jay Hemdal]

The fish were OK for the first days, the smaller one for more than a week. Then they started showing issues.
My 5 sexy shrimp, a Duncan and an assortment of snails are all actually thriving. Columbella mercatoria are even breeding in the tank.
I’ll wait with any new fish and get them larger. Can I/should I do anything else in the meantime?
Thanks for the help!

You could try a different species of clown, like clarkii, they are hardier - but they are also more rambunctious

 

[igorz]

I would wager they came in with brook or velvet. As Jay said, I would let the tank stay fishless for min 45 days. In the meantime set up a QT order another pair of clowns and treat . There are numerous QT prophylactic treatment protocols available online. This type of stuff would always happen to me (random fish deaths) until I started QTing everything and QTing and treating every fish. If you don't want to QT order from a QT vendor like Dr. Reef. This is the method that I follow https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/how-to-quarantine.232/

I'm already planning a quarantine tank. As I'm in Europe I have a more limited access to meds, but I'll figure it out.