High nitrates, but low undectable phosphates help

[vdubreefer]

More great news!!!, the new ball of cheato I put in the tank is TAKING OFF, WAAAY more then my cheato before.
Though, I havent seen as positive health or new growth with my corals that were struggling, and a lil new growth from the corals that were doing ok, I guess its probably related to the light changes I'm making,

 

[vdubreefer]

You’re welcome! :) I can relate completely to my mental state being directly related to the health of my reef aquarium... you are not alone!

Hey Rick, I got another question, I've slowly been increasing my lights 5% each week, and Monday 4/15 I adjusted my mp40s from being on the back of the tank on both sides to being on the sides of the tank opposing each other, and I turned them up probably about 10-15% and the acros didnt receed their polyps they looked like they were ok, and now I've noticed a couple of my acropora that were doing well have started STN at the bottom, I noticed this Tuesday of this week nearly a week later, I immediately turned my lights down 5% and backed my mp40s down, (i watched too many BRS videos talking about you can never have too much flow)
Could this be the cause of my problem?? I drew up some diagrams of how the pumps are laid out, I'll also show you my light schedule, any advice?

 

[Rick.45cal]

Hey Rick, I got another question, I've slowly been increasing my lights 5% each week, and Monday 4/15 I adjusted my mp40s from being on the back of the tank on both sides to being on the sides of the tank opposing each other, and I turned them up probably about 10-15% and the acros didnt receed their polyps they looked like they were ok, and now I've noticed a couple of my acropora that were doing well have started STN at the bottom, I noticed this Tuesday of this week nearly a week later, I immediately turned my lights down 5% and backed my mp40s down, (i watched too many BRS videos talking about you can never have too much flow)
Could this be the cause of my problem?? I drew up some diagrams of how the pumps are laid out, I'll also show you my light schedule, any advice?

I don’t think your MP40’s are to blame for that STN. What are your parameters looking like these days. I also don’t think that the increase in light is the cause of your STN. It’s likely something else completely.

 

[vdubreefer]

I don’t think your MP40’s are to blame for that STN. What are your parameters looking like these days. I also don’t think that the increase in light is the cause of your STN. It’s likely something else completely.

Ok so my parameters are
Alk - 8.8 hanna
Cal- 450 red sea
Mag - unable to get test will retry tonight
No3 - between 32 and 64 it's back up again red sea
P04- 0.02 red sea
Temp-78.8 degrees farenheit apex.
Salinty- 35.5 ppt salinity apex will recheck with digital refractometer tonight
PH- 7.9 -8.1 Apex dashboard

I've been out of town this weekend and I came back and it looked my my cheato doubled In size

 

[Rick.45cal]

So I’m guessing here @vdubreefer (keep that in mind) but I suspect your phosphates are still a little low, they may have dipped down to undetectable causing the STN again. I’d try dosing a slightly higher daily dosage of phosphates. It would also be nice to figure out why your nitrates keep shooting up still. Possibly they shot up when phosphates became limited again, I don’t know.

 

[vdubreefer]

So I’m guessing here @vdubreefer (keep that in mind) but I suspect your phosphates are still a little low, they may have dipped down to undetectable causing the STN again. I’d try dosing a slightly higher daily dosage of phosphates. It would also be nice to figure out why your nitrates keep shooting up still. Possibly they shot up when phosphates became limited again, I don’t know.

Ok, that could be happening I'll try a higher dose, also my mag test is 1500 a lil high but I dont think too bad right

 

[vdubreefer]

So I’m guessing here @vdubreefer (keep that in mind) but I suspect your phosphates are still a little low, they may have dipped down to undetectable causing the STN again. I’d try dosing a slightly higher daily dosage of phosphates. It would also be nice to figure out why your nitrates keep shooting up still. Possibly they shot up when phosphates became limited again, I don’t know.

I'm going to add another fish, a wrasse maybe ? Know any wrasses that do ok in bare bottom systems

 

[Rick.45cal]

Ok, that could be happening I'll try a higher dose, also my mag test is 1500 a lil high but I dont think too bad right

I wouldn’t be concerned about that magnesium level.

I think about any of the “fairy” wrasses would be a good choice.

 

[vdubreefer]

I wouldn’t be concerned about that magnesium level.

I think about any of the “fairy” wrasses would be a good choice.

Ok great thank you, also I noticed bulk reef supply recently did a video on precipitation inside salt storage containers for auto water changes and each brand show at least some kind of rise and fall of alk is this something I should be concerned about would that cause my stn issue?? I of course heat and circulate my storage container

 

[Rick.45cal]

Ok great thank you, also I noticed bulk reef supply recently did a video on precipitation inside salt storage containers for auto water changes and each brand show at least some kind of rise and fall of alk is this something I should be concerned about would that cause my stn issue?? I of course heat and circulate my storage container

I’ve never had a problem with mine, but after mixing the only circulation mine has is an airstone and an airpump. I also don’t heat my saltwater storage container.

 

[ADAM]

Well I have found myself in the same situation as the OP. 0-PO4 and somewhere around 50 NO3. Glad this discussion is already here, however not thankful for your frustrations.

Question; Instead of adding the Neophos to the ATO I am assuming I can use a doser for the same function. The doser I have on hand is a BRS 1.1ML/ minute.

 

[vdubreefer]

Well I have found myself in the same situation as the OP. 0-PO4 and somewhere around 50 NO3. Glad this discussion is already here, however not thankful for your frustrations.

Question; Instead of adding the Neophos to the ATO I am assuming I can use a doser for the same function. The doser I have on hand is a BRS 1.1ML/ minute.

Yes you can just go very very very slow, and raise it slowly, I'm glad other people are starting to benefit from this post,

 

[vdubreefer]

I’ve never had a problem with mine, but after mixing the only circulation mine has is an airstone and an airpump. I also don’t heat my saltwater storage container.

Hey Rick is there a chance I could be dosing too much? And my po4 is too high ? I'm noticing a ton of algea, but very little coraline

 

[Rick.45cal]

Hey Rick is there a chance I could be dosing too much? And my po4 is too high ? I'm noticing a ton of algea, but very little coraline

Time to beef up the cleanup crew. :) It’s always possible you’ve dosed too much, but if your tests are correct I don’t think so. If you’ve got micro algae present it’s going to take advantage of the situation until you can achieve a balance with grazers and consumers of the algae.

Most likely what is happening is the algae is sucking up the phosphates as fast as you put them in. I’d increase you clean up crew. Do you know what kind of algae it is? (You can always post a pic and we can try and figure it out).

 

[ADAM]

I must not have needed much PO4, or either the frozen Marine Cuisine and Brine Shrimp from PetsMart have tons of PO4 in the water that it’s frozen in. For the day or two waiting on the ordered NeoPhos to arrive, I decided to thaw some frozen food in a media bag in the sump to see what effect it would have on my PO4. Well after the 4th cube I noticed the diatoms that had formed were receding and there was tiny bit of reddish cyano forming on one of the rocks. I then adjusted to thawing one cube a day instead of two in the sump and the diatoms look to be all but gone and there’s a little more noticeable cyano forming. There’s is a slightly noticeable change of color in the tank water with the test kits also. As for now I will continue to thaw one cube a day in the sump and continue monitoring. This also looks to “wake up” the corals for feeding time as well since the food is thawing in the water column.

 

[vdubreefer]

Time to beef up the cleanup crew. :) It’s always possible you’ve dosed too much, but if your tests are correct I don’t think so. If you’ve got micro algae present it’s going to take advantage of the situation until you can achieve a balance with grazers and consumers of the algae.

Most likely what is happening is the algae is sucking up the phosphates as fast as you put them in. I’d increase you clean up crew. Do you know what kind of algae it is? (You can always post a pic and we can try and figure it out).

Well I've had to take a hiatus Because after I put in my chato into the sump it wasn't a week or 2 after posting on this forum that I came home to all of my akros completely dead algae all over the tank and my corals completely dead except for my LPS I have had to take a step back because I was going to either sell everything I owned or I was going to quit altogether, why would my acros just start stn out of nowhere, I did add 4 more snails to the tank, and I think I need to get another couple of fish because if dont hand dose po4 or put it in my ato everything ceases like playing the game red light green light as a kid,, (po4 present) GREEN LIGHT, (not present) RED LIGHT, and it's like everything stops in its tracks, and I dont get it, how can this hobby be so easy for some people and they cab successfully keep two tanks, and I can't even keep one ya know what the crap is going on, honestly it has sucked

 

[Patrick.S]

I’m no acro expert but if I were you I’d try to shut off my skimmer and keep the fudge cranking. You shouldn’t be able to bottom out anything with chaeto because it’s growth is self limiting. Then I would keep up with the water changes and feed the fish as usual. Then just let her ride for a while. My feeling is that all this dosing and lighting changes are a destabilizing factor on your tank. Try not doing anything for a couple months other than your normal routine. Just my 2c

 

[Rick.45cal]

Well I've had to take a hiatus Because after I put in my chato into the sump it wasn't a week or 2 after posting on this forum that I came home to all of my akros completely dead algae all over the tank and my corals completely dead except for my LPS I have had to take a step back because I was going to either sell everything I owned or I was going to quit altogether, why would my acros just start stn out of nowhere, I did add 4 more snails to the tank, and I think I need to get another couple of fish because if dont hand dose po4 or put it in my ato everything ceases like playing the game red light green light as a kid,, (po4 present) GREEN LIGHT, (not present) RED LIGHT, and it's like everything stops in its tracks, and I dont get it, how can this hobby be so easy for some people and they cab successfully keep two tanks, and I can't even keep one ya know what the crap is going on, honestly it has sucked

I’m sorry to hear that. I don’t think there’s anyone here that thinks this is easy, keeping a delicately balanced ecosystem in a tiny glass box isn’t a simple task for anyone. I say don’t give up, almost all of the people with successful tanks have had to go through a tank catastrophe. There’s a way to get through this.

 

[vdubreefer]

I’m sorry to hear that. I don’t think there’s anyone here that thinks this is easy, keeping a delicately balanced ecosystem in a tiny glass box isn’t a simple task for anyone. I say don’t give up, almost all of the people with successful tanks have had to go through a tank catastrophe. There’s a way to get through this.

I agree, and I just feel like I need to take a step back maybe, maybe I only keep lps in there for awhile i still wanna keep it up and running but I need to pull back a lil bit or I was gonna end up really really really resenting the hobby and my tank and that can be bad, Rick have you seen that add on Facebook,? Saltwater aquarium advice or something and it's like a 4 or 5 ebook series apparently about keeping a successful reef tank wondering if it's even worth my time ??

 

[Jonathan Troutt]

I battled with super high nitrates and undetectable phosphates for almost a year. I tried lots of things overfeeding, dosing tsp, etc. hell there was one point i was dosing enough tap that it should of brought my phosphate levels to 1ppm. The next day after dosing my phosphate would be at 0 again. Nitrates always stayed up around 50.

I had algae growing in sump and in main display. In the end i rebooted the tank with brand new rock and brand new sand. Tore it all down bleached everything and set it all back up. Coral got dipped, rinsed, bug killered, peroxide dipped.

I now have measurable phosphates finally. Corals look fantastic. I still dont know what caused my issue to be honest. The sand or the rock is my guess