Invincible GHA

[JumboShrimp]

Paul, I guess 'algae is all in the eye of the beholder.'

 

[Paul B]

Paul, I guess 'algae is all in the eye of the beholder.'

I didn't say it was good looking. Just healthy.

 

[mcarroll]

Ah yes its working now.

You really think the hermits are killing the snails? I mean I know it's possible I've never seen it and I've watched closely. Also my hermits are very small and have lots of options.

Without question IMO.

Crabs "can" eat algae, but it's not what they really want.

They are carrion scavengers just like the Nassarius snails they cohabitate with.

So whenever the crab is hungry enough or a snail becomes marginal enough, snail is on the menu. Multiply that factor by the number of crabs you keep. For this reason I try to keep no more than 1 or 2 per tank....0 is okay by me.

Have you tried an urchin? One of the small herbivore types.

Did you also check out Paul B's DIY micron filter, BTW?

 

[Ghost-X9]

Dealing with GHA is not fun. I’ve use Flux RX and it works great on bryopsys but GHA not so much. I’ve use peroxide with mid success but the stuff can harm corals with prolonged use. Coral snow is great to bind most pollutants that help feed the nuisance algae and I've used it as a tool with water changes and monitoring most of all the phosphates. The that worked for me is to remove as much as possible and measure the phosphate the following day because it will give you a more reliable measurement since the algae is unable to uptake the phosphates immediately. I would also do a good cleaning of your overflow. This area is usually overlooked and GHA will grow comfortably if left unchecked. I would check and clean overflow, remove as much algae from display and measure phosphates the following day then water change if phosphates are too high.

Don’t give up and good luck

 

[slingfox]

In my prior tank I dealt with a dark green almost black turf algae which was finally invincible to fish, invert, and chemical. I battled that algae for half a year during which time I pulled out and scrubbed down the rock at least half a dozen times. ultimately, I did a tank reset where I switched out all my Marco Rock with ocean live rock. I have had the new aquascape up for 9 months now and it has been smooth sailing.

If you want to try one more chemical route my friend used the Continuum line of product on his tank and the results have been extremely impressive (he was dealing with a hair algae that was resistant to Fluconazole). This video explains the process:



I believe the only place you can buy the suite of products in the US is directly from the Brightwell website.

 

[Davem24]

Ah yes its working now.

You really think the hermits are killing the snails? I mean I know it's possible I've never seen it and I've watched closely. Also my hermits are very small and have lots of options.

Without question IMO.

Crabs "can" eat algae, but it's not what they really want.

They are carrion scavengers just like the Nassarius snails they cohabitate with.

So whenever the crab is hungry enough or a snail becomes marginal enough, snail is on the menu. Multiply that factor by the number of crabs you keep. For this reason I try to keep no more than 1 or 2 per tank....0 is okay by me.

Have you tried an urchin? One of the small herbivore types.

Did you also check out Paul B's DIY micron filter, BTW?

Hmmm. I can't say this isn't the case but there is tons of crab food in missed fish food, waste, etc.

I have both a pincushion and tuxedo. They go right past the stuff.

And I actually made that filter about 6 months ago. I use it to clean rock and suck out the algae.

 

[BryanM]

@Davem24

I just posted this in another thread:

The nuclear option is Fluconazole, but I would research that thoroughly before going down that road.

A much better option with success stories is an algae turf scrubber, which after it gets going (~6 weeks), basically outcompetes the GHA and it eventually dies off. It more efficiently grows a similar algae that uses up what fuels GHA, basically.

You can ask the folks over at santa monica filtration exactly how it works, but this would be a good, natural method to rid yourself of GHA. One note, its a nitrate and phosphate exporter as well, and you should probably be ready to dose something for both of these if you go down this road as you'll likely bottom out both N and P with your current levels.

 

[Davem24]

@Davem24

I just posted this in another thread:

The nuclear option is Fluconazole, but I would research that thoroughly before going down that road.

A much better option with success stories is an algae turf scrubber, which after it gets going (~6 weeks), basically outcompetes the GHA and it eventually dies off. It more efficiently grows a similar algae that uses up what fuels GHA, basically.

You can ask the folks over at santa monica filtration exactly how it works, but this would be a good, natural method to rid yourself of GHA. One note, its a nitrate and phosphate exporter as well, and you should probably be ready to dose something for both of these if you go down this road as you'll likely bottom out both N and P with your current levels.

Tried reef flux. No effect. I do have a fuge. I know a scrubber will be more aggressive but I don't really have the room to add it in .

 

[13rodo]

I have way, way, way more algae than that and I wouldn't do anything. Algae is actually a sign of health as it grows on every reef in the sea, of course we don't want it covering our corals. It sometimes covers mine but if you keep a reef long enough you will see that everything in our tanks runs in cycles. Algae is one of those things.

It may show up for a few months or a year, then disappear with no help from you. People feel these chemical interventions work, but I think it's just a cycle and unless you do something stupid, it will leave on it's own.











I have been SCUBA diving for 50 years and it grows in every ocean in every sea. The only reason we don't see it much on the real reefs is due to all the algae eaters on the reef. And most of the creatures in the sea eat algae.

If there was no algae in the sea what would these creatures eat?











Your tank looks fine and natural. I wouldn't add any chemicals.

This is off-topic, but I love that possum wrasse!

As for the algae, have you tried a sea hare? Gotta be careful because they can release an ink if threatened, but they are lawnmowers.

A lettuce nudibranch (really a sea slug) is also another cool algae eater that specifically hunts green algae. It can pull chloroplasts from them and use them to make energy :)

 

[Paul B]

This is off-topic, but I love that possum wrasse!

He's an adult there. Probably 7 or 8 years old but he could be 12. I have two of them and I can't tell which one is which.

This is him as a youngster. They look better young. The same way I did.

 

[13rodo]

He's an adult there. Probably 7 or 8 years old but he could be 12. I have two of them and I can't tell which one is which.

This is him as a youngster. They look better young. The same way I did.

Such a cool little fish! Is it just my eyes playing tricks or is that a white band? I only ever see the yellow band.

 

[Paul B]

The bands on mine were white; those bands disappear as they age.

Here it's yellow. Maybe I have cataracts.



Same fish, here it is white. I don't know why.

 

[mcarroll]

And I actually made that filter about 6 months ago. I use it to clean rock and suck out the algae.

Depending how yours is set up, you would want to leave it running 24/7 instead of just "spot-treating" with it.

Having too large a pump and too fine a micron rating might be a problem for running like this due to overheating....higher flow and smaller µ numbers would be good for spot treating, but for running 24/7 I'd use moderate flow and something like 25µ filter that will flow decently when it's new.

Tried reef flux. No effect. I do have a fuge. I know a scrubber will be more aggressive but I don't really have the room to add it in .

Algae respond to their environment to survive like anything else...established algae won't die just because nutrients get lower. Most algae I've read about just become less and less palatable and more and more competitive/aggressive as nutrient levels drop.

Something needs to eat or otherwise remove the algae from its place in the tank.

And something needs to displace that algae to prevent new algae from settling in the space.

In general our tanks lack big herbivores to clean up "out of control" algae (in the wild, this is often done by very large or non-traditional herbivores.

So in a reef tank the final removal job often ends up with the reefkeeper – you are cleanup crew member #1.

 

[Davem24]

And I actually made that filter about 6 months ago. I use it to clean rock and suck out the algae.

Depending how yours is set up, you would want to leave it running 24/7 instead of just "spot-treating" with it.

Having too large a pump and too fine a micron rating might be a problem for running like this due to overheating....higher flow and smaller µ numbers would be good for spot treating, but for running 24/7 I'd use moderate flow and something like 25µ filter that will flow decently when it's new.

Tried reef flux. No effect. I do have a fuge. I know a scrubber will be more aggressive but I don't really have the room to add it in .

Algae respond to their environment to survive like anything else...established algae won't die just because nutrients get lower. Most algae I've read about just become less and less palatable and more and more competitive/aggressive as nutrient levels drop.

Something needs to eat or otherwise remove the algae from its place in the tank.

And something needs to displace that algae to prevent new algae from settling in the space.

In general our tanks lack big herbivores to clean up "out of control" algae (in the wild, this is often done by very large or non-traditional herbivores.

So in a reef tank the final removal job often ends up with the reefkeeper – you are cleanup crew member #1.

Algae becomes less palatable the lower the nutrients ? I've never heard that! That makes sense. Do have any links to share so I can read up on that? I've never had an algae problem like this, I wonder if the reason is I tanked the nutrients and that's why nothing will touch it ?

 

[mcarroll]

Algae becomes less palatable the lower the nutrients ? I've never heard that! That makes sense. Do have any links to share so I can read up on that? I've never had an algae problem like this, I wonder if the reason is I tanked the nutrients and that's why nothing will touch it ?

There's a bunch of good journal articles linked in the algae section on my blog:

Algae – Reef Success

Posts about Algae written by therealmattcarroll

reefsuccess.com

This one is specific on that palatability....check out Appendix A specifically.

Macroalgal palatability and the flux of ciguatera toxins through marine food webs

Chaeto and turf algae allow the highest density of epiphitic toxic dino’s of any sudied algae. (See Table 1.) Even more interesting to me is Appendix A where a variety of macro aglae are lis…

reefsuccess.com

Throw that title into Google Scholar to get more related reading material.


You might have to dig around some for the reference about the maturity, can't recall if that's specifically from the same article.

 

[robanister]

Tank looks pretty mature. Wondering if you have phosphate bound to your rock. If so it will take some time to get rid of the hair algae. Start with full sump cleaning and sand bed cleaning over several weeks to not tank your nutrients. Get some pytho crabs they do the best job. If you can put an algae scrubber in that may be the wisest choice. Good luck . Nothing happens fast. This takes about 3 months and algae will be gone.

 

[Davem24]

Algae becomes less palatable the lower the nutrients ? I've never heard that! That makes sense. Do have any links to share so I can read up on that? I've never had an algae problem like this, I wonder if the reason is I tanked the nutrients and that's why nothing will touch it ?

There's a bunch of good journal articles linked in the algae section on my blog:

Algae – Reef Success

Posts about Algae written by therealmattcarroll

reefsuccess.com

This one is specific on that palatability....check out Appendix A specifically.

Macroalgal palatability and the flux of ciguatera toxins through marine food webs

Chaeto and turf algae allow the highest density of epiphitic toxic dino’s of any sudied algae. (See Table 1.) Even more interesting to me is Appendix A where a variety of macro aglae are lis…

reefsuccess.com

Throw that title into Google Scholar to get more related reading material.


You might have to dig around some for the reference about the maturity, can't recall if that's specifically from the same article.

Thank you ! I have some reading to do. This is fantastic.