Is random torch death just a thing with torches?

[Morpheosz]

I have had 4 torches over the history of my 2 year old tank. The first two were in the first year and they both succumbed randomly and unexpectedly to receding and disintegrating over the course of a week after looking great for several months. When I mentioned it to the LFS back then they said "that's just torches, they sometimes randomly die for no apparent reason - more so than other euphyllias".

The last 2 torches I purchased have been doing great though and this indo green torch I have had for a solid year+ and has grown 5x the size I bought it, from 3 heads to >10. It has become the centerpiece of my tank and I love it. However, this past week, it just took a turn down the same path as those early torches. It just out of the blue started showing a few heads look unhappy with less extension this past week. Then in the past 48 hours or so one looked like it was on a path to dying. This morning I woke to find a few more looking really unhappy.

I wish I was coming here looking for an answer today but I don't expect to find any because my tank has been on very steady cruise control for months. I haven't added anything in months, it's quite full and by all accounts thriving. My parameters are great and continue to be steady at the same level that this coral has grown rapidly at for the past year. I'm sure some people will say you need more nutrients or this or that, but it's hard to argue with a year's worth of rapid growth at these levels. I don't see any sign of BJD, nor did I on the last 2 I lost. I don't see any sign of flatworms. Just receding heads until the last bits fall apart. They did expel some zooxanthellae, but I believe that's not too surprising when dying.

So I guess I'm pretty much just here to ask - is what the LFS guy said true? Are torches just randomly finnicky? Even when they've thrived for a year or more?

For fun, here are my params (again, consistently managed very close to this for over a year):
Temp: 78
pH: 8.2 - 8.4
Salt: 35ppt
PO4: 0.05
NO3: 7ppm
Ca: 450ppm
Mg: 1350ppm
Alk: 8.0

Here are some pics - what it looked like a week or so ago and for the past year, and this morning before the lights... Big green guy center right.

 

[Morpheosz]

Also I have 4 other euphyllia - 2 frogspawn related and 2 hammer related that have also grown massively and none of them have ever or currently are showing any distress. Some of these predate all the torches as well. And the rest of the tank is still thriving, so I don't think some chemical or other issue got randomly introduced.

 

[Rmckoy]

I have always had trouble keeping torches long term .
But I can keep frog spawn , hammers alive and growing.

I haven’t tried another torch in over 10 years .
Same goes with trumpets and elegance ,

 

[Troylee]

Could possibly be flow… you got nice flesh bands so they look healthy… are they getting moderate, pulsating flow?

 

[Morpheosz]

Could possibly be flow… you got nice flesh bands so they look healthy… are they getting moderate, pulsating flow?

Yeah, they get really good flow, pulsing back and forth gently to moderately. I go back to the fact that it grew like crazy for a year. I can't imagine it would just decide all of the sudden that it's not happy with flow or water params, etc. and crash inside of a week.

 

[Morpheosz]

I have always had trouble keeping torches long term .
But I can keep frog spawn , hammers alive and growing.

I haven’t tried another torch in over 10 years .
Same goes with trumpets and elegance ,

I also had an elegance do great for about 6 months then just detach from its base awhile back. I feel you!

 

[Dburr1014]

You say it's grown 5 times it's size.
But have you thought about flow? Flow can be impeded and possibly cause the demise of corals.

 

[Salty_Northerner]

There was a video on YouTube from Fragbox that mentioned his LPS would POP heads or just die. He mentions about keeping his magnesium at 1500 and doesn't have the problem anymore.

Just throwing it out there as I've got no experience with those Coral but he did mention the magnesium thing.

 

[Morpheosz]

You say it's grown 5 times it's size.
But have you thought about flow? Flow can be impeded and possibly cause the demise of corals.

See #5

 

[vetteguy53081]

I have had 4 torches over the history of my 2 year old tank. The first two were in the first year and they both succumbed randomly and unexpectedly to receding and disintegrating over the course of a week after looking great for several months. When I mentioned it to the LFS back then they said "that's just torches, they sometimes randomly die for no apparent reason - more so than other euphyllias".

The last 2 torches I purchased have been doing great though and this indo green torch I have had for a solid year+ and has grown 5x the size I bought it, from 3 heads to >10. It has become the centerpiece of my tank and I love it. However, this past week, it just took a turn down the same path as those early torches. It just out of the blue started showing a few heads look unhappy with less extension this past week. Then in the past 48 hours or so one looked like it was on a path to dying. This morning I woke to find a few more looking really unhappy.

I wish I was coming here looking for an answer today but I don't expect to find any because my tank has been on very steady cruise control for months. I haven't added anything in months, it's quite full and by all accounts thriving. My parameters are great and continue to be steady at the same level that this coral has grown rapidly at for the past year. I'm sure some people will say you need more nutrients or this or that, but it's hard to argue with a year's worth of rapid growth at these levels. I don't see any sign of BJD, nor did I on the last 2 I lost. I don't see any sign of flatworms. Just receding heads until the last bits fall apart. They did expel some zooxanthellae, but I believe that's not too surprising when dying.

So I guess I'm pretty much just here to ask - is what the LFS guy said true? Are torches just randomly finnicky? Even when they've thrived for a year or more?

For fun, here are my params (again, consistently managed very close to this for over a year):
Temp: 78
pH: 8.2 - 8.4
Salt: 35ppt
PO4: 0.05
NO3: 7ppm
Ca: 450ppm
Mg: 1350ppm
Alk: 8.0

Here are some pics - what it looked like a week or so ago and for the past year, and this morning before the lights... Big green guy center right.

Torch corals will challenge the novice and the most experienced reefers. They have generalized requirements and do best in a stable environment not doing well often with changes in chemistry. Even water changes can upset them.

 

[flashsmith]

I have a frogspawn the size of a football and several large hammers. I gave up on torches long ago. Never could get them to thrive. The only one I have is a small flashlight torch I got on black Friday for $10. I'm glad I never bought into the hype of the high end torches. You would think being from the same genus they wouldn't be any more difficult than a hammer or frogspawn.

 

[Morpheosz]

Here's the flow recently for those asking.

 

[zoomonster]

Most of the issues I have had were BJD and that's been successfully dealt with using cipro. However, I had a hellfire I lost several heads of like that. Pulled it out of tank dipped it and it had picked up a couple big Euphyllia eating flatworms from somewhere (likely missed eggs). They killed most of it fast and I salvaged one head and of course bought a new one lol. Your dead heads look pretty black on the inside and it may well be BJD. Can't hurt to treat the tank if you're starting to lose stuff.

 

[exnisstech]

Like some of the others I have never been able to keep a torch alive but I have a frogspawn bigger than a soft ball from a couple of heads. I don't get it but just accept it. Especially since the last torch was a multi head hellfire that only lasted 2 weeks

 

[Pistondog]

Stating the obvious, all torches are not created equal. I have much better luck with indo sourced vs australian.

 

[Icryhard]

Torch corals will challenge the novice and the most experienced reefers. They have generalized requirements and do best in a stable environment not doing well often with changes in chemistry. Even water changes can upset them.

Honestly, this is why I (to some extent) try to replicate your small water changes. I don’t do them on a daily basis, but rather on a weekly / 2 weeks basis. We’re talking 5 liter in a 400. They’re starting to become bigger and happier it seems, however only my tiger torch seems to be ticked off by what I assume must be the other torches. I placed it somewhere else and am hoping it’ll recover and be happy

 

[nezw0001]

I have had the same experience with torches. Doing fine for years, growing and then just go downhill and die.

 

[Lavey29]

I have lost a head here and there then they grow more. In your case based on the timeline and description of decline I suspect euphyllia eating flatworms or some bacterial infection.

 

[newreeferboi]

I have had 4 torches over the history of my 2 year old tank. The first two were in the first year and they both succumbed randomly and unexpectedly to receding and disintegrating over the course of a week after looking great for several months. When I mentioned it to the LFS back then they said "that's just torches, they sometimes randomly die for no apparent reason - more so than other euphyllias".

The last 2 torches I purchased have been doing great though and this indo green torch I have had for a solid year+ and has grown 5x the size I bought it, from 3 heads to >10. It has become the centerpiece of my tank and I love it. However, this past week, it just took a turn down the same path as those early torches. It just out of the blue started showing a few heads look unhappy with less extension this past week. Then in the past 48 hours or so one looked like it was on a path to dying. This morning I woke to find a few more looking really unhappy.

I wish I was coming here looking for an answer today but I don't expect to find any because my tank has been on very steady cruise control for months. I haven't added anything in months, it's quite full and by all accounts thriving. My parameters are great and continue to be steady at the same level that this coral has grown rapidly at for the past year. I'm sure some people will say you need more nutrients or this or that, but it's hard to argue with a year's worth of rapid growth at these levels. I don't see any sign of BJD, nor did I on the last 2 I lost. I don't see any sign of flatworms. Just receding heads until the last bits fall apart. They did expel some zooxanthellae, but I believe that's not too surprising when dying.

So I guess I'm pretty much just here to ask - is what the LFS guy said true? Are torches just randomly finnicky? Even when they've thrived for a year or more?

For fun, here are my params (again, consistently managed very close to this for over a year):
Temp: 78
pH: 8.2 - 8.4
Salt: 35ppt
PO4: 0.05
NO3: 7ppm
Ca: 450ppm
Mg: 1350ppm
Alk: 8.0

Here are some pics - what it looked like a week or so ago and for the past year, and this morning before the lights... Big green guy center right.

My torch was killed down to 1 POLYP i couldn’t figure out what was killing it. But I had recently introduced peppermint shrimp to the tank. Yes they were eating the heads of my torch coral. Watch out for those little evil crustaceans.

 

[Boehmtown]

I believe torches are hard to keep alive is they don't show signs of stress visually, by the time it's really receding it's too late. And people are propagating them like wild fire, they aren't giving them time for the flesh to grow down the skeleton. So sometimes it seems overnight, but really it's been in the works. Also one good whack from something, hard like a fish can hurt them good